F 35 Down The Drain:----

[Kompromat]

lol not true.

What do you think RAAF is going to buy now?

 

[Kinshuk]

BTW F-35 is still going through trials there were some glitches and that has been rectified and as the project progresses, it will become lethal only.. Why are we having this habit of judging so early??

Give it sometime. Till 2015-16 it will be ready for induction..

 

[SBD-3]

T-50 is just in a prototype stage buddy.... Still development is in progress, And T-50 was not a just started program, It was a decade long program for Russia to research in stealth....

do you know when JSF had its first flight.........speaks for its self

 

[Kinshuk]

do you know when JSF had its first flight.........speaks for its self

So by your logic China will all take a long time to produce the stealth?

But many claim here that its China, and it will make it ready by 2020 for induction??

Nice attempt..

 

[Kinshuk]

Well Sorry I wasn't attacking any country It was meant to be an example... Forgive me if sounds belligerent.

 

[SBD-3]

Hope is eternal my friend.. You keep hoping that there will be problems with T50 and we will hope that those problems are surmounted.

well you would notice one thing......that current PAK-FA has not taken its flight with "intended" hardware......even westerners didn't show any concern on this..........did you see any notable concern coming out of US...............no statement from any US millitary commander(probably US and RUS are allies?)......I think RU has just tried to gain its pride.....Just get in the air with what we have and we will integrate the goodies later.....I think It will not only increase the testing process, but will also increase the developmental cost of the program considerably....( Just my 2 Cents)

 

[SBD-3]

So by your logic China will all take a long time to produce the stealth?

But many claim here that its China, and it will make it ready by 2020 for induction??

Nice attempt..

probably they wont go by the JSF or Ruski Approach.....They will test it with its intended configuration

 

[Kinshuk]

probably they wont go by the JSF or Ruski Approach.....They will test it with its intended configuration

hmmm... Lets see all three projects are long way to go, with chances of F-35 is the brightest. But in Asia, its clearly a cold war era. Arm race. It's not good also to some extent..

 

[LCA Tejas]

well you would notice one thing......that current PAK-FA has not taken its flight with "intended" hardware......even westerners didn't show any concern on this..........did you see any notable concern coming out of US...............no statement from any US millitary commander(probably US and RUS are allies?)......I think RU has just tried to gain its pride.....Just get in the air with what we have and we will integrate the goodies later.....I think It will not only increase the testing process, but will also increase the developmental cost of the program considerably....( Just my 2 Cents)

Why would USA be concerned with PAK-FA. they have stealth technology and Have even gone far by Making stealth Bombers... And PAK -FA Flied Without Intended hardwares..... All the prototypes Dont fly with Intended hardwares buddy, Becoz thats when they get Idieas about the design.... There are various testing Phases. So lets wait for The Pak-FA to Roll Out when Done and allow to evolve FGFA from It...

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

May be US does not wants to export it to Japan/Australia/Pakistan/Saudia/Korea or other allied countries so its politely coming up with excuses

 

[Kinshuk]

Well Its erroneous to comment on PAKFA as for now.. We can't say it will be delayed and also that will make it on time... But one thing is for certain, It is going to be a reality and Russia would be only second to USA so it is not an issue that we should worry about.


Gotta go..

 

[garibnawaz]

do you know when JSF had its first flight.........speaks for its self

15 December 2006.

Speaks for what and whom?

It is intended to be inducted 2012 for US marines.

6 years is between first flight and induction is quite fast.

While the United States is the primary customer and financial backer, the United Kingdom, Italy, the Netherlands, Canada, Turkey, Australia, Norway and Denmark have agreed to contribute US$4.375 billion toward the development costs of the program. Total development costs are estimated at more than US$40 billion (underwritten largely by the United States), while the purchase of an estimated 2,400 planes is expected to cost an additional US$200 billion. The nine major partner nations plan to acquire over 3,100 F-35s through 2035, making the F-35 one of the most numerous jet fighters.

There are three levels of international participation. The levels generally reflect the financial stake in the program, the amount of technology transfer and subcontracts open for bid by national companies, and the order in which countries can obtain production aircraft. The United Kingdom is the sole "Level 1" partner, contributing US$2.5 billion, which was about 10% of the planned development costs under the 1995 Memorandum of Understanding that brought the UK into the project. Level 2 partners are Italy, which is contributing US$1 billion; and the Netherlands, US$800 million. Level 3 partners are Canada, US$475 million; Turkey, US$195 million; Australia, US$144 million; Norway, US$122 million and Denmark, US$110 million. Israel and Singapore have joined as Security Cooperative Participants (SCP).

Some of the partner countries have wavered in their public commitment to the JSF program, hinting or warning that unless they receive more subcontracts or technology transfer, they will forsake JSF for the Eurofighter Typhoon, Saab JAS 39 Gripen, Dassault Rafale or simply upgrade their existing aircraft. Furthermore, F-35 export competitiveness has been hurt by international buyers finding either its export variant too costly per unit or "watered down". While the F-16E/F costs $50 million per export copy, the F-35 is likely to cost between $65–120 million. The exported F-35 versions will be the same configuration as the U.S. versions according to Brigadier Gen. David Heinz, program executive officer in 2009.

F-35 is definately not going down the drain.

GB

 

[SBD-3]

Why would USA be concerned with PAK-FA. they have stealth technology and Have even gone far by Making stealth Bombers... And PAK -FA Flied Without Intended hardwares..... All the prototypes Don't fly with Intended hardwares buddy, Becoz thats when they get Ideas about the design.... There are various testing Phases. So lets wait for The Pak-FA to Roll Out when Done and allow to evolve FGFA from It...

well mate....then why US is so concerned about J-XX?????? every now and then a concern pops out of US about it......well PAK-FA didn't feature new gen engine at least (new avionics and more powerful computer to handle them, yet to know) .....it looked like a stealth from front but a flanker from rear...........and one more thing....US moved from Stealth Bombers to Fighters not from Fighters to Bombers

 

[LCA Tejas]

well mate....then why US is so concerned about J-XX?????? every now and then a concern pops out of US about it......well PAK-FA didn't feature new gen engine at least (new avionics and more powerful computer to handle them, yet to know) .....it looked like a stealth from front but a flanker from rear...........and one more thing....US moved from Stealth Bombers to Fighters not from Fighters to Bombers

And Where do U see USA getting concerned about an Aircraft which is still Under evaluation and Not a single prototype is released... Japan Is the one who are concerned not USA, and Thanks for correcting me there, Bombers-Fighters ,sorry. USA is having a close look on PAK FA, They cannot make any comment now as its still in testing phase.

 

[SBD-3]

15 December 2006.

Speaks for what and whom?

It is intended to be inducted 2012 for US marines.

6 years is between first flight and induction is quite fast.

While the United States is the primary customer and financial backer, the United Kingdom, Italy, the Netherlands, Canada, Turkey, Australia, Norway and Denmark have agreed to contribute US$4.375 billion toward the development costs of the program. Total development costs are estimated at more than US$40 billion (underwritten largely by the United States), while the purchase of an estimated 2,400 planes is expected to cost an additional US$200 billion. The nine major partner nations plan to acquire over 3,100 F-35s through 2035, making the F-35 one of the most numerous jet fighters.

There are three levels of international participation. The levels generally reflect the financial stake in the program, the amount of technology transfer and subcontracts open for bid by national companies, and the order in which countries can obtain production aircraft. The United Kingdom is the sole "Level 1" partner, contributing US$2.5 billion, which was about 10% of the planned development costs under the 1995 Memorandum of Understanding that brought the UK into the project. Level 2 partners are Italy, which is contributing US$1 billion; and the Netherlands, US$800 million. Level 3 partners are Canada, US$475 million; Turkey, US$195 million; Australia, US$144 million; Norway, US$122 million and Denmark, US$110 million. Israel and Singapore have joined as Security Cooperative Participants (SCP).

Some of the partner countries have wavered in their public commitment to the JSF program, hinting or warning that unless they receive more subcontracts or technology transfer, they will forsake JSF for the Eurofighter Typhoon, Saab JAS 39 Gripen, Dassault Rafale or simply upgrade their existing aircraft. Furthermore, F-35 export competitiveness has been hurt by international buyers finding either its export variant too costly per unit or "watered down". While the F-16E/F costs $50 million per export copy, the F-35 is likely to cost between $65–120 million. The exported F-35 versions will be the same configuration as the U.S. versions according to Brigadier Gen. David Heinz, program executive officer in 2009.

F-35 is definately not going down the drain.

GB

ok here are some extracts for your kind consideration

As of 5 January 2009, six F-35s are complete, including AF-1 and AG-1, and 17 are in production. "Thirteen of the 17 in production are pre-production test aircraft, and all of those will be finished in 2009," said John R. Kent, acting manager of F-35 Lightning II Communications at Lockheed Martin Aeronautics Company. "The other four are the first production-model planes, and the first of those will be delivered in 2010 to the U.S. Air Force, and will go to Eglin.

On 6 April 2009, US Secretary of Defense Robert Gates proposed speeding up production for the US to buy 2,443 F-35s.[

On 21 April 2009 media reports, citing Pentagon sources, said that during 2007 and 2008, computer spies managed to copy and siphon off several terabytes of data related to F-35's design and the electronics systems, potentially enabling the development of defense systems against the aircraft. However, Lockheed Martin has rejected suggestions that the project has been compromised, saying that it "does not believe any classified information had been stolen".

(may be Chinese getting into russian computers as well)

On 9 November 2009, Ashton Carter, undersecretary of defense for acquisition, technology and logistics, acknowledged that the Pentagon "joint estimate team" (JET) had found possible future cost and schedule overruns in the project and that he would be holding meetings to attempt to avoid these

On 1 February 2010, Gates removed JSF Program Manager Marine Maj. Gen. David Heinz and withheld $614 million in payments to Lockheed Martin because of program costs and delays