F-16 didn’t down India’s MiG-21 Bison, says top Chinese military expert

[Imran Khan]

He's talking shit. PAF doesn't have less than 20 F-16's and if you think he's referring to Blk 52s, what about the F-16A/B's? He seems to have forgotten those. Those are more than capable of interception.

His points are meant for amateurs.

he is human too just forgive

 

[Ghost 125]

Allow me to say that this "expert" does not sounds like an expert. his expertise bubble is bursted when he says just 20 F16 in PAF fleet and that too not in servicable condition. An expert would know that we have atleast 4 squadrons of F16. So there goes his expetise. please dont qoute such experts for the sake of arguments.

 

[Trailer23]

I don't even know where the idea of the F-16 came from - to begin with. He should have done more research...

 

[Raider 21]

A top expert with the Chinese defence forces has said it wasn’t Pakistan Air Force’s (PAF) US-made F-16 that shot down India’s MiG-21 Bison during last month’s dogfight .(HT Photo )


A top expert with the Chinese defence forces has said it wasn’t Pakistan Air Force’s (PAF) US-made F-16 that shot down India’s MiG-21 Bison during last month’s dogfight when the two air forces had scrambled jets along the Line of Control (LoC).

Professor Jin Yinan from the elite National Defence University (NDU) of the PLA (People’s Liberation Army) hints - without actually saying so - that it could have been a China-built jet, possibly the jointly built JF-17 fighter aircraft, which shot down India’s jet.

Jin also argued that it wasn’t a surface-to-air missile that hit the MiG-21 Bison but an air-to-air projectile.

Jin’s interview was first published earlier this month on a Chinese website run by the PLA where he picked holes in the narrative that it was an F-16, which shot down the Indian aircraft.

Jin, a retired general and an author, was a director of the strategic research institute at the NDU.

“Expert: Who shot down India’s MiG-21 in India-Pakistan air battle?” was the headline of the English version of the interview.

“The Indian side tried to find reasons for its loss, saying that Pakistan had dispatched its most advanced F-16 fighters, which was denied. Pakistan’s saying is more reliable for three reasons,” he said

“First, the sales of F-16 fighters had been cut off by the US, so Pakistan now has only less than 20 such aircraft left, not to mention how many of which could still perform a flight mission,” Jin said.

“Second, Pakistan had signed an ‘agreement’ with the US, which banned the use of F-16 fighters in offensive operations. This time, Indian warplanes flew into the Pakistani airspace and attacked ground targets first, and then Pakistan sent aircraft into India’s airspace for retaliation. From this perspective, it was a retaliatory, offensive operation conducted by Pakistan, in which the F-16 was inapplicable according to the aforesaid agreement.”

Jin then argued that the Indian Air Force is well aware of the capabilities of the US-made jets including firepower and radar frequencies.

“Third, the Indian military had already obtained basic data about the F-16 jets. The U.S. planned to export the F-21 - an upgraded version of the F-16 - to India, so it had informed the Indian side of all performance parameters about the aircraft. For this reason, India is familiar with the combating performances of the F-16, including its fire-control and searching radar frequency,” the PLA expert said.

“Given all this, Pakistan was unlikely to use its F-16 fighters in the air battle because there was a small chance to win even if it sent out the aircraft.”

Asked what kind of missile would have hit the Indian jet, Jin said it was an air-to-air missile.

“All existing signs indicate that it is improbable a surface-to-air missile. The wreckage of the MiG-21 fighter jet should be comminuted debris caused by the cellular explosion. However, it is evident that part of the crashed MiG-21 fighter jet was cut by a missile, instead of exploding in the air. It was directly hit by a missile warhead. In this case, it is unlikely to be a surface-to-air missile, but probably an air-to-air missile,” he said.

Interestingly, about two weeks after the India-Pakistan clash, China announced that Beijing and Islamabad have begun upgrading their jointly developed JF-17 fighter jet.

“The development and production of the JF-17 Block 3 are underway,” Yang Wei, a Chinese legislator and chief designer of the China-Pakistan co-developed fighter jet, was quoted as saying by the state media.

Jin said IAF’s frontier jets are in poor shape and flying “outdated” aircraft.

“The aircraft equipped in India’s frontier troops are poor in performance. For instance, the MiG-21 fighter is already outdated. The captured Indian pilot is a senior wing commander. Among air force pilots, wing commander is already a high military ranking, who needs to fly at least 1,000 hours, so he is actually an experienced pilot. However, limited by its backward avionics, the MiG-21 fighter’s search radar could not detect the enemy and its fire-control radar cannot guide medium-range air-to-air missiles,” Jin said.

The expert added: “So, it could not perform preemptive detection and firing. As a result, it was detected and shot down first by the enemy. If the Indian military commissioned some more advanced fighters in the frontier, it would not only enhance its image but also not lose so badly. This is a feature of air warfare: a single pilot and a single aircraft can determine the result of an air battle”.

First Published: Mar 24, 2019 18:40 IST

https://www.hindustantimes.com/indi...OaumkLLNrqlib2xZ4eMCUI0AfoswBWg4rOmbI1RhP_btQ

They called a BVR engagement a dogfight.

 

[Jinn Baba]

“First, the sales of F-16 fighters had been cut off by the US, so Pakistan now has only less than 20 such aircraft left, not to mention how many of which could still perform a flight mission,” Jin said.

May be he was talking about the C/D of which we do have less than 20. Further sales were cut off. And the end part may refer to restrictions on use of these C/Ds on which he goes on to talk.

Jin then argued that the Indian Air Force is well aware of the capabilities of the US-made jets including firepower and radar frequencies.

Very possible.

“Third, the Indian military had already obtained basic data about the F-16 jets. The U.S. planned to export the F-21 - an upgraded version of the F-16 - to India, so it had informed the Indian side of all performance parameters about the aircraft. For this reason, India is familiar with the combating performances of the F-16, including its fire-control and searching radar frequency,” the PLA expert said.

“Given all this, Pakistan was unlikely to use its F-16 fighters in the air battle because there was a small chance to win even if it sent out the aircraft.”

Reasonable.

If the Indian military commissioned some more advanced fighters in the frontier, it would not only enhance its image but also not lose so badly.

 

[sinait]

May be he was talking about the C/D of which we do have less than 20. Further sales were cut off. And the end part may refer to restrictions on use of these C/Ds on which he goes on to talk.

Indeed he was referring only to the F-16 C/D.
Keyword here is "most advanced" which could only mean the C/D.
It is NOT a statement of HOW MANY F-16 in total, but his response to how many "its most advanced F-16 fighters" as alleged by India.

“The Indian side tried to find reasons for its loss, saying that Pakistan had dispatched its most advanced F-16 fighters, which was denied. Pakistan’s saying is more reliable for three reasons,” he said

“First, the sales of F-16 fighters had been cut off by the US, so Pakistan now has only less than 20 such aircraft left, not to mention how many of which could still perform a flight mission,” Jin said.

Meaning if sales of F-16 had not been cut off, there would have been MORE than 20 "most advanced F-16 fighters".
Does not mean F-16 A/B are not capable, it is a direct response to the Indian allegation that Pakistan had to rely on "its most advanced F-16 fighters" to mitigate THEIR TOTAL HUMILIATION.
In other words, LOSING to "most advanced F-16" is less SHAMEFUL for Gangas.
.

 

[IceCold]

DGISPR also confirmed that no F-16s were used and it was JF-17 which shot Mig down. Should end this debate on the use of F-16s.
PS I am not referring to older statements of DGISPR, its the one he gave today to a Russian news agency.
@OCguy We had a debate sometime earlier where you said it was the F-16s stating the pilot was a viper pilot and i told you being a viper pilot does not mean its an F-16 because viper pilots are regularly transferred to JF-17s.

 

[War Thunder]

Allow me to say that this "expert" does not sounds like an expert. his expertise bubble is bursted when he says just 20 F16 in PAF fleet and that too not in servicable condition. An expert would know that we have atleast 4 squadrons of F16. So there goes his expetise. please dont qoute such experts for the sake of arguments.

O uncle panga tranlation mei aur reporter ki writing mei hai. Not in what the person said at the time.

 

[Ghost 125]

O uncle panga tranlation mei aur reporter ki writing mei hai. Not in what the person said at the time.

i am still not sure weather i qualify for the tittle of uncle from you

 

[nana41]

he is human too just forgive

Chinese after becoming affluent,have started drinking more than they should,lest they start talking non sense.This "expert" perhaps ,is promoting j-10?

 

[帅的一匹]

maybe he is talking about F16blk52

 

[War Thunder]

i am still not sure weather i qualify for the tittle of uncle from you

Chalo jo sahi lagey....uncle

 

[OCguy]

DGISPR also confirmed that no F-16s were used and it was JF-17 which shot Mig down. Should end this debate on the use of F-16s.
PS I am not referring to older statements of DGISPR, its the one he gave today to a Russian news agency.
@OCguy We had a debate sometime earlier where you said it was the F-16s stating the pilot was a viper pilot and i told you being a viper pilot does not mean its an F-16 because viper pilots are regularly transferred to JF-17s.

Somebody saying it doesn't hold weight, the actual evidence is what I base conclusions off of.

 

[IceCold]

Somebody saying it doesn't hold weight, the actual evidence is what I base conclusions off of.

That somebody is DGISPR. Its straight from the horse mouth.

 

[Guest]

Chinese professor says that pakistan has less then 20 operational f-16s.

which is completly wrong.

according to wiki PAF has 85 F-16s
Block A-B = 66 jets
Block C-D = 19 jets

maybe the chinese professor was talking about the upgraded Block C-D f16's which PAF only has 19 off.

There is a big difference between
Bought, has, operational, combat ready numbers

for US air force, only "71.3 percent of the Air Force's aircraft were flyable"
for German air force , "In a Bundeswehr document provided to the German parliament last year, the military classified 39 of 128 jets as combat ready."

for PAKAF's F16 figures
Bought: 66+19
Has: xx
operational: yy
combat ready: zz

so which one do you think would best fit the "less than 20" said by Jin