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New Cases Test Optimism on Extremism by U.S. Muslims

By SCOTT SHANE, December 11, 2009, NY Times

WASHINGTON — As the years passed after Sept. 11, 2001, without another major attack on American soil and with no sign of hidden terrorist cells, many counterterrorism specialists reached a comforting conclusion: Muslims in the United States were not very vulnerable to radicalization.

American Muslims, the reasoning went, were well assimilated in diverse communities with room for advancement. They showed little of the alienation often on display among their European counterparts, let alone attraction to extremist violence.

But with a rash of recent cases in which Americans have been accused of being drawn into terrorist scheming, the rampage at Fort Hood, Tex., last month and now the alarming account of five young Virginia men who went to Pakistan and are suspected of seeking jihad, the notion that the United States has some immunity against homegrown terrorists is coming under new scrutiny.

It is a concern that President Obama noted in passing in his address on the decision to send 30,000 more American troops to Afghanistan, and one that has grown as the Afghan war and the hunt for Al Qaeda and the Taliban in Pakistan intensifies.

“These events certainly call the consensus into question,” said Robert S. Leiken, who studies terrorism at the Nixon Center, a Washington policy institute, and wrote the forthcoming book “Europe’s Angry Muslims.”

“The notion of a difference between Europe and United States remains relevant,” Mr. Leiken said. But the continuing wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and the American operations like drone strikes in Pakistan, are fueling radicalization at home, he said.

“Just the length of U.S. involvement in these countries is provoking more Muslim Americans to react,” Mr. Leiken said.

Concern over the recent cases has profoundly affected Muslim organizations in the United States, which have renewed pledges to campaign against extremist thinking.

“Among leaders, there’s a recognition that there’s a challenge within our community that needs to be addressed,” said Alejandro J. Beutel, government liaison at the Muslim Public Affairs Council in Washington, and main author of a report by the council on radicalization and how to combat it.

Mr. Beutel, a Muslim convert from New Jersey, said the council started a grass-roots counterradicalization effort in 2005, but acknowledged that “for a while it was on the back burner.” He said, “Now we’re going to revive it.”

F.B.I. investigators were in Pakistan on Friday questioning the five Virginia men. But it remained unclear whether the men would be deported to the United States, and whether they had broken any laws in either Pakistan or the United States.

At a news conference Friday at the small Virginia mosque where the men had been youth group regulars, mosque officials expressed bewilderment at claims that the men wanted to join the jihad against American troops in Afghanistan.

“I never observed any extreme behavior from them,” said Mustafa Maryam, who runs the youth group and said he had known the young men since 2006. “They were fun-loving, career-focused children. They had a bright future before them.”

Also at the press briefing, asked about reports that the five men had contacted a Pakistani militant via the Web, Mahdi Bray, the head of the Freedom Foundation of the Muslim American Society, told reporters that YouTube and social networking sites had become a dangerous recruiting tool for militants.

“We are determined not to let religious extremists exploit the vulnerability of our children through this slick, seductive propaganda on the Internet,” said Mr. Bray, who is organizing a youth meeting later this month in Chicago to address the issue.

“Silence in cyberspace is not an option for us,” he said.

The detention of the Virginia men — ranging in age from late teens to mid-20s — would have prompted soul-searching no matter when it occurred. But it comes after a series of disturbing cases that already had terror experts speculating about a trend.

There were the November shootings that took 13 lives at Fort Hood, with murder charges pending against Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan, an American-born Muslim and an Army psychiatrist.

There was the arrest of Najibullah Zazi, born in Afghanistan but the seeming model of the striving immigrant as a popular coffee vendor in Manhattan, accused of going to Pakistan for explosives training with the intention of attacking in the United States.

There was David Coleman Headley, a Pakistani-American living in Chicago, accused of helping plan the killings in Mumbai, India, last year and of plotting attacks in Denmark.

There was Bryant Neal Vinas, a Muslim convert from Long Island who participated in a rocket attack on American troops in Afghanistan and used his knowledge of commuter trains in New York to advise Al Qaeda about potential targets.

There were the Somali-Americans from Minnesota who had traveled to Somalia to join a violent Islamist movement.

And there were cases of would-be terrorists who plotted attacks in Texas, Illinois and North Carolina with conspirators who turned out to be F.B.I. informants.

Bruce Hoffman, who studies terrorism at Georgetown University, said the recent cases only confirmed that it was “myopic” to believe “we could insulate ourselves from the currents affecting young Muslims everywhere else.”

Like many other specialists, Mr. Hoffman pointed to the United States’ combat in Muslim lands as the only obvious spur to many of the recent cases, especially those with a Pakistani connection.

“The longer we’ve been in Iraq and Afghanistan,” he said, “the more some susceptible young men are coming to believe that it’s their duty to take up arms to defend their fellow Muslims.”

A few analysts, in fact, argue that Mr. Obama’s decision to send more troops to Afghanistan — intended to prevent a terrorist haven there — could backfire.

Robert A. Pape, a University of Chicago political scientist, contends that suicide attacks are almost always prompted by resentment of foreign troops, and that escalation in Afghanistan will fuel more plots.

“This new deployment increases the risk of the next 9/11,” he said. “It will not make this country safer.”

Yet amid the concern about the five Virginia men and the impact of the wars on Muslim opinion, Audrey Kurth Cronin of the National War College in Washington said she found something to take comfort in.

“To me, the most interesting thing about the five guys is that it was their parents that went immediately to the F.B.I.,” she said. “It was members of the American Muslim community that put a stop to whatever those men may have been planning.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/12/us/12assess.html?_r=1&pagewanted=2
 
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i like canada...people here dont get worked up about stuff like americans do...although that could be due to the fact that canadians are stoned half of the time
 
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i like canada...people here dont get worked up about stuff like americans do...although that could be due to the fact that canadians are stoned half of the time

Yea, Canada - great place. Try being a doctor there from a third word country. Many of them are doing menial jobs there. Canada might come second or third after UK in my opinion.

As much Canadians blame US, I am yet to see any country including Canada, Europe or NZ stand up with less racist remarks than US and with equal opportunities. Australia and South Africa is not even worth mentioning.
 
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The good thing is that the parents and the community are not hiding these fact but working with the authorities. I think this is a good sign but we as muslims have to be more vigilant and make sure that we nip any kind of violent extremism in the bud.
 
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New Cases Test Optimism on Extremism by U.S. Muslims

By SCOTT SHANE, December 11, 2009, NY Times

WASHINGTON — As the years passed after Sept. 11, 2001, without another major attack on American soil and with no sign of hidden terrorist cells, many counterterrorism specialists reached a comforting conclusion: Muslims in the United States were not very vulnerable to radicalization.

American Muslims, the reasoning went, were well assimilated in diverse communities with room for advancement. They showed little of the alienation often on display among their European counterparts, let alone attraction to extremist violence.

But with a rash of recent cases in which Americans have been accused of being drawn into terrorist scheming, the rampage at Fort Hood, Tex., last month and now the alarming account of five young Virginia men who went to Pakistan and are suspected of seeking jihad, the notion that the United States has some immunity against homegrown terrorists is coming under new scrutiny.

It is a concern that President Obama noted in passing in his address on the decision to send 30,000 more American troops to Afghanistan, and one that has grown as the Afghan war and the hunt for Al Qaeda and the Taliban in Pakistan intensifies.

“These events certainly call the consensus into question,” said Robert S. Leiken, who studies terrorism at the Nixon Center, a Washington policy institute, and wrote the forthcoming book “Europe’s Angry Muslims.”

“The notion of a difference between Europe and United States remains relevant,” Mr. Leiken said. But the continuing wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and the American operations like drone strikes in Pakistan, are fueling radicalization at home, he said.

“Just the length of U.S. involvement in these countries is provoking more Muslim Americans to react,” Mr. Leiken said.

Concern over the recent cases has profoundly affected Muslim organizations in the United States, which have renewed pledges to campaign against extremist thinking.

“Among leaders, there’s a recognition that there’s a challenge within our community that needs to be addressed,” said Alejandro J. Beutel, government liaison at the Muslim Public Affairs Council in Washington, and main author of a report by the council on radicalization and how to combat it.

Mr. Beutel, a Muslim convert from New Jersey, said the council started a grass-roots counterradicalization effort in 2005, but acknowledged that “for a while it was on the back burner.” He said, “Now we’re going to revive it.”

F.B.I. investigators were in Pakistan on Friday questioning the five Virginia men. But it remained unclear whether the men would be deported to the United States, and whether they had broken any laws in either Pakistan or the United States.

At a news conference Friday at the small Virginia mosque where the men had been youth group regulars, mosque officials expressed bewilderment at claims that the men wanted to join the jihad against American troops in Afghanistan.

“I never observed any extreme behavior from them,” said Mustafa Maryam, who runs the youth group and said he had known the young men since 2006. “They were fun-loving, career-focused children. They had a bright future before them.”

Also at the press briefing, asked about reports that the five men had contacted a Pakistani militant via the Web, Mahdi Bray, the head of the Freedom Foundation of the Muslim American Society, told reporters that YouTube and social networking sites had become a dangerous recruiting tool for militants.

“We are determined not to let religious extremists exploit the vulnerability of our children through this slick, seductive propaganda on the Internet,” said Mr. Bray, who is organizing a youth meeting later this month in Chicago to address the issue.

“Silence in cyberspace is not an option for us,” he said.

The detention of the Virginia men — ranging in age from late teens to mid-20s — would have prompted soul-searching no matter when it occurred. But it comes after a series of disturbing cases that already had terror experts speculating about a trend.

There were the November shootings that took 13 lives at Fort Hood, with murder charges pending against Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan, an American-born Muslim and an Army psychiatrist.

There was the arrest of Najibullah Zazi, born in Afghanistan but the seeming model of the striving immigrant as a popular coffee vendor in Manhattan, accused of going to Pakistan for explosives training with the intention of attacking in the United States.

There was David Coleman Headley, a Pakistani-American living in Chicago, accused of helping plan the killings in Mumbai, India, last year and of plotting attacks in Denmark.

There was Bryant Neal Vinas, a Muslim convert from Long Island who participated in a rocket attack on American troops in Afghanistan and used his knowledge of commuter trains in New York to advise Al Qaeda about potential targets.

There were the Somali-Americans from Minnesota who had traveled to Somalia to join a violent Islamist movement.

And there were cases of would-be terrorists who plotted attacks in Texas, Illinois and North Carolina with conspirators who turned out to be F.B.I. informants.

Bruce Hoffman, who studies terrorism at Georgetown University, said the recent cases only confirmed that it was “myopic” to believe “we could insulate ourselves from the currents affecting young Muslims everywhere else.”

Like many other specialists, Mr. Hoffman pointed to the United States’ combat in Muslim lands as the only obvious spur to many of the recent cases, especially those with a Pakistani connection.

“The longer we’ve been in Iraq and Afghanistan,” he said, “the more some susceptible young men are coming to believe that it’s their duty to take up arms to defend their fellow Muslims.”

A few analysts, in fact, argue that Mr. Obama’s decision to send more troops to Afghanistan — intended to prevent a terrorist haven there — could backfire.

Robert A. Pape, a University of Chicago political scientist, contends that suicide attacks are almost always prompted by resentment of foreign troops, and that escalation in Afghanistan will fuel more plots.

“This new deployment increases the risk of the next 9/11,” he said. “It will not make this country safer.”

Yet amid the concern about the five Virginia men and the impact of the wars on Muslim opinion, Audrey Kurth Cronin of the National War College in Washington said she found something to take comfort in.

“To me, the most interesting thing about the five guys is that it was their parents that went immediately to the F.B.I.,” she said. “It was members of the American Muslim community that put a stop to whatever those men may have been planning.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/12/us/12assess.html?_r=1&pagewanted=2
Hmmm judging from what I've seen is, this is the very real fear all Muslims live in, in your very own hometown. Many of them believe they have to keep up appearances like be happy smiling people and not confront any of the "regular" Americans on trivial things like neighborly issues to avoid one of them using their religion against them.

People come in all types. If you just go out and ask any Muslim Virginia you'd find out that they know someone or the other who was attacked after the 9/11 attacks. Most Americans don't even know that, the period after 9/11 was a time of real fear for America's Muslims. It's something no one should have to go through. Definitely not again.
 
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Yea, Canada - great place. Try being a doctor there from a third word country. Many of them are doing menial jobs there. Canada might come second or third after UK in my opinion.

As much Canadians blame US, I am yet to see any country including Canada, Europe or NZ stand up with less racist remarks than US and with equal opportunities. Australia and South Africa is not even worth mentioning.

first to your question regarding foreign people seeking jobs in canada... okay buddy we work our ***** off paying for the crazy tution fees at univeristies here... people from india pak etc get super cheap university education as compared to us, so whats in it for us who study here huh ?

plus that isnt even the real reason why foreign people are doing menial jobs...they are doing menial jobs because they choose too.. canada has exceptional accreditation programs regarding foreign skilled workers... and as far as racism is concerned lemme tell you this....when i say im canadian another canadian be it white black or whoever will accept me as a canadian... that only happens in canada

you can be a US citizen in papers only, to americans you'll always " them terrorizerss"
 
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first to your question regarding foreign people seeking jobs in canada... okay buddy we work our ***** off paying for the crazy tution fees at univeristies here... people from india pak etc get super cheap university education as compared to us, so whats in it for us who study here huh ?

plus that isnt even the real reason why foreign people are doing menial jobs...they are doing menial jobs because they choose too.. canada has exceptional accreditation programs regarding foreign skilled workers... and as far as racism is concerned lemme tell you this....when i say im canadian another canadian be it white black or whoever will accept me as a canadian... that only happens in canada

you can be a US citizen in papers only, to americans you'll always " them terrorizerss"

I dont know whether education is free in Canada, but in US, yes, you have to pay for it. But if you go to State Schools, most run somewhere around 5-10K/year. That is not astronomical unless ofcourse, your goal is study at Harvard.

In US, unless you work as blue-collar jobs, most foreigners especially Indians get pretty much the same treatment. Watch for Red Southern states in no-man's land, other than that, everything else is cool.

In Canada, I heard about your medical system, which is pretty nice and all, but you are paying a hell in income taxes.

I have read enough horror stories of people who moved there. Only one of my friend have moved to Canada to work there and too because he couldn't find job in US at that time. I think he is not complaining because he lives in Toronto, but I am not sure about the states like Alberta, Yukon, NE and Quebec.

Regarding your comment all foreigners appear terrorists to America. You are right in a way, but I am lucky in some way that they can discover me as Indian merely by my looks. So, I am think I am fine for now. But these criminals like the one caught in Denver and now these kids traveling to Pakistan is going to start creating negative image for rest of us. Fox news will find its holy grail and keep on reporting it and red necks who are more worried about blacks will find their cause with us.

How many Canadian crazies are you aware are getting caught like this? I have not heard any. So far, even though we found a crazy dude in US military, there had been no repercussions. When similar things happen in Canada, you will find who is "real Canadian".
 
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I dont know whether education is free in Canada, but in US, yes, you have to pay for it. But if you go to State Schools, most run somewhere around 5-10K/year. That is not astronomical unless ofcourse, your goal is study at Harvard.

In US, unless you work as blue-collar jobs, most foreigners especially Indians get pretty much the same treatment. Watch for Red Southern states in no-man's land, other than that, everything else is cool.

In Canada, I heard about your medical system, which is pretty nice and all, but you are paying a hell in income taxes.

I have read enough horror stories of people who moved there. Only one of my friend have moved to Canada to work there and too because he couldn't find job in US at that time. I think he is not complaining because he lives in Toronto, but I am not sure about the states like Alberta, Yukon, NE and Quebec.

Regarding your comment all foreigners appear terrorists to America. You are right in a way, but I am lucky in some way that they can discover me as Indian merely by my looks. So, I am think I am fine for now. But these criminals like the one caught in Denver and now these kids traveling to Pakistan is going to start creating negative image for rest of us. Fox news will find its holy grail and keep on reporting it and red necks who are more worried about blacks will find their cause with us.

How many Canadian crazies are you aware are getting caught like this? I have not heard any. So far, even though we found a crazy dude in US military, there had been no repercussions. When similar things happen in Canada, you will find who is "real Canadian".

uh no university isnt free in canada...you were complaining about foreigners getting menial jobs here.. in that retrospect i said that the countries these people come from offer free education compared to what we have to pay here...so its unfair to us that they get to work the same job as us having virtually paid nothing for their higher education... thats why i think its only fair that canada drills them through accreditation programs.

We dont have 'states', we got provinces and you might wanna actually look at canadian economics before you post about how alberta and others are doing.. Canada has way better economic fundamentals than the states... Recession here was over before it even started..and the medical system and other benefits we pay for they are well worth it

and as to your last point, dude canada was founded on the basis of multiculturalism period..and things have happened here 'crazies' have been caught but unlike americans people didnt start shooting down sikhs jus cuz they were wearing turbans.
 
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uh no university isnt free in canada...you were complaining about foreigners getting menial jobs here.. in that retrospect i said that the countries these people come from offer free education compared to what we have to pay here...so its unfair to us that they get to work the same job as us having virtually paid nothing for their higher education... thats why i think its only fair that canada drills them through accreditation programs.

We dont have 'states', we got provinces and you might wanna actually look at canadian economics before you post about how alberta and others are doing.. Canada has way better economic fundamentals than the states... Recession here was over before it even started..and the medical system and other benefits we pay for they are well worth itY

and as to your last point, dude canada was founded on the basis of multiculturalism period..and things have happened here 'crazies' have been caught but unlike americans people didnt start shooting down sikhs jus cuz they were wearing turbans.

That is why I am telling you that Canadians are racist. To do any work, you dont need Canadian education, you need the right education. It does not matter whether your education cost you nothing. I know for fact they are willing to let go this requirement if you come from any first world country. Please do visit US and see this difference first hand.

Also, try for promotions in Canada. Let me know how often you would find any one other than "white" becoming significant. Try that in Quebec, which hates immigration and you talk about multiculturalism.

Now regarding the recession of US, it is not first time US had the recession and I am sure it wont be the last time either. The application of Keynesian theory has saved the US and the world from collapse. Even Rosenberg has started becoming neutral towards US economy for the long term.

US's per capita is still higher than Canada even after all the recession. The recent run up of Canadian dollar against USD would put any other industry other commodities at a disadvantage.
 
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That is why I am telling you that Canadians are racist. To do any work, you dont need Canadian education, you need the right education. It does not matter whether your education cost you nothing. I know for fact they are willing to let go this requirement if you come from any first world country. Please do visit US and see this difference first hand.

Also, try for promotions in Canada. Let me know how often you would find any one other than "white" becoming significant. Try that in Quebec, which hates immigration and you talk about multiculturalism.

Now regarding the recession of US, it is not first time US had the recession and I am sure it wont be the last time either. The application of Keynesian theory has saved the US and the world from collapse. Even Rosenberg has started becoming neutral towards US economy for the long term.

US's per capita is still higher than Canada even after all the recession. The recent run up of Canadian dollar against USD would put any other industry other commodities at a disadvantage.

how the hell is that being racist ? and thats not even the reason why these accreditation programs are in place... these are in place to regulate professional services and to maintain the highest standard of professionals in every field. And again NO we have these accreditation programs even for people coming from states...And its incompetency that stops people from going further up in their careers not the "whites"


Quebec aren't racists, they are a bit more conservative but believe me nobody in Canada likes to burn black people wearing masks. Quebecs are seperatists not racists, like i pointed out before get your facts straight.

ok here's your economy as of now, housing market gone down the drain..God knows how many are jobless..GM bankrupt we had to bail you guys out...Chrysler Bankrupt Fiat had to bail them out...US is a massive economy..we dont have to compete with you guys when it comes to that..Our society is based on completely different fundamentals...people dont die here just because they cant afford a frikin tylenol
 
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