Even a Horrific Murder Isn't Enough to Shake Pakistan's Blasphemy Laws

[SQ8]

Blasphemy law is not for Pakistani people. This law is suitable for those countries where they have rule of law. Not mob mentality .
Sethi share some facts and figures.Start from 24.01

In my opinion, Pakistan deserves a iron cast dictatorship like North Korea for 100 years before people should even be allowed to choose the sort of haircut they want- but nothing is ideal.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Why indians are concerned about Pakistani law they sud worry about their terrorist PM who's killing indians for cow meat.

Don't hijack the discussion please - the broader issue is the rampant hatred in Pakistani society towards 'others' and a complete lack of respect for the law and the rights of other Pakistanis when their religious views are different from ours.

This kind of hatred and intolerance is seen in the attitudes of Pakistanis towards Ahmadis, Hindus, Jews and even Shia.

 

[HAIDER]

A good read Aljazeera.
http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/fe...pakistan-blasphemy-law-20145179369144891.html

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Further over 20 Muslims countries have similar laws to deal with blaspheme cases then why should we / Pakistan only abandon this just because of a killing of one student over some issue.

It's not just 'one student' - mobs have killed many more under the guise of blasphemy. More importantly, the impact of blasphemy laws is to stifle free speech and debate, especially when it comes to discourse on religious reform.

How can you expect society to openly debate and question certain prevalent and regressive interpretations of Islam/religion when Mullah's and backward idiots will fly into a rage and level allegations of blasphemy at people who do so? Even if there are no mob lynchings, the expense and time required to fight a blasphemy allegation in court would deter individuals from openly speaking their minds.

The laws absolutely need to be reformed and the burden of proving the allegation needs to fall on the accuser with the accused individual's identity kept secret with no detention and a secret trial. The accuser should be held criminally responsible (jail time and/or fines) if the allegation is not substantiated.

 

[Sheikh Rauf]

Don't hijack the discussion please - the broader issue is the rampant hatred in Pakistani society towards 'others' and a complete lack of respect for the law and the rights of other Pakistanis when their religious views are different from ours.

This kind of hatred and intolerance is seen in the attitudes of Pakistanis towards Ahmadis, Hindus, Jews and even Shia.

Well indian on Pakistani forum spreading hate against Pakistan. We have issues in our society but we are not way near where indians.
And it's u who is derailing. Pakistan have law about blasphemy why the hell Indian got problem with it. People who's living in it. it's purely their issue.

 

[JK!]

Well indian on Pakistani forum spreading hate against Pakistan. We have issues in our society but we are not way near where indians.
And it's u who is derailing. Pakistan have law about blasphemy why the hell Indian got problem with it. People who's living in it. it's purely their issue.

Not spreading hate. Having an honest discussion. You do know how a conversation works - right?

Furthermore look at how long he's been a member for. I've been here since 2006 and I'll vouch for him. Got a problem with that then PM me.

Nice to see you posting here again @AgNoStiC MuSliM its been while.

 

[Sheikh Rauf]

Not spreading hate. Having an honest discussion. You do know how a conversation works - right?

Furthermore look at how long he's been a member for. I've been here since 2006 and I'll vouch for him. Got a problem with that then PM me.

Nice to see you posting here again @AgNoStiC MuSliM its been while.

It's not Pakistani who are extremist since u are here from 2006 shows it clearl no one stay this long without respect. So it stablish u are here on this forum with respect but it doesn't mean u alot with all Indians have right to disrespect Pakistan's sensitive issues.
Do we make fun of cow since most of don't care but I bet some do care about cow. Why hindus who don't know nothing about islam they pass stupid comments on Blasphemy.
So stay on topic and bring who ever u want to rescue u. This is Pakistani forum where u have full rights to express ur feeling but not gonna allow to spread hate against Pak and it's society.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Do we make fun of cow since most of don't care but I bet some do care about cow. Why hindus who don't know nothing about islam they pass stupid comments on Blasphemy.
So stay on topic and bring who ever u want to rescue u. This is Pakistani forum where u have full rights to express ur feeling but not gonna allow to spread hate against Pak and it's society.

Hindus consider cows sacred, so yes, comments that seek to insult Hindus with references towards cows should not be allowed for the sake of civil discussion on the forum - this is not a good analogy though.

A better analogy to Indians participating in discussions over Pakistan's blasphemy laws is when Pakistanis participate in discussions on India passing laws against the slaughter/consumption of beef or restrict freedom of speech in other ways. There is nothing wrong with Indians participating in a debate on Pakistan's blasphemy laws, provided it is done with civility and seeks to promote constructive discourse.

 

[JK!]

It's not Pakistani who are extremist since u are here from 2006 shows it clearl no one stay this long without respect. So it stablish u are here on this forum with respect but it doesn't mean u alot with all Indians have right to disrespect Pakistan's sensitive issues.
Do we make fun of cow since most of don't care but I bet some do care about cow. Why hindus who don't know nothing about islam they pass stupid comments on Blasphemy.
So stay on topic and bring who ever u want to rescue u. This is Pakistani forum where u have full rights to express ur feeling but not gonna allow to spread hate against Pak and it's society.

You're bringing up cows and Hindus here not me. Not the other gentleman. I can tell you now neither of us are from India. So kindly stop using that as an argument.

This is not just a Pakistani matter. The video of the people marching to carry out this barbaric act were chanting La Illahah. Not Pakistan Zindabad. They were chanting Shahada. This is a matter involving all muslims no matter where they live. We are part of an Ummah. That means I am accountable to you and you are accountable to me.

It's no insult to say the truth. This is embarrassing for the Pakistan. It is embarrassing for muslims everywhere. It is deeply shameful and it needs to be discussed.

 

[Sheikh Rauf]

Hindus consider cows sacred, so yes, comments that seek to insult Hindus with references towards cows should not be allowed for the sake of civil discussion on the forum - this is not a good analogy though.

A better analogy to Indians participating in discussions over Pakistan's blasphemy laws is when Pakistanis participate in discussions on India passing laws against the slaughter/consumption of beef or restrict freedom of speech in other ways. There is nothing wrong with Indians participating in a debate on Pakistan's blasphemy laws, provided it is done with civility and seeks to promote constructive discourse.

I answered this already nothing wrong with constructive discussion but if someone come here and tell us that muslims in Pak treating other insanely bad then we got problem.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Read the blaspheme law again, the things you have mentioned already exist in the law.

Under the current laws individuals accused of blasphemy are arrested/detained and kept in prison until they are acquitted/found innocent. This is a complete mockery of justice - the accused are treated as guilty and have to prove their innocence to obtain freedom. People are rotting in prison awaiting the results of trials (which at the lower court levels are ridiculously flawed and often overturned at the high court and supreme court).

The law needs to be revamped to where the accused is not detained or imprisoned and is given as much flexibility as possible to respond to any allegations until the entire appeals process is complete (Supreme Court decision).

 

[Sheikh Rauf]

You're bringing up cows and Hindus here not me. Not the other gentleman. I can tell you now neither of us are from India. So kindly stop using that as an argument.

This is not just a Pakistani matter. The video of the people marching to carry out this barbaric act were chanting La Illahah. Not Pakistan Zindabad. They were chanting Shahada. This is a matter involving all muslims no matter where they live. We are part of an Ummah. That means I am accountable to you and you are accountable to me.

It's no insult to say the truth. This is embarrassing for the Pakistan. It is embarrassing for muslims everywhere. It is deeply shameful and it needs to be discussed.

Did I ever try to justify what happened is right.. bringing cow is to show that we don't make fun of issue but Indian particularly hindu raiz issues to make fun which we not gonna let it them.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I answered this already nothing wrong with constructive discussion but if someone come here and tell us that muslims in Pak treating other insanely bad then we got problem.

The only 'problem' you have is the inability to counter their arguments rationally. Pakistan obviously has a problem with 'Mob Justice' - we have had multiple mob lynchings of Ahmadis and people accused of blasphemy. Just because an Indian brings up these issues doesn't make the problem magically non-existent.

Instead of getting upset at the Indians for pointing out very real and very critical problems in Pakistani society and laws, participate in civil and constructive debate to address these issues in Pakistan.

 

[JK!]

Did I ever try to justify what happened is right.. bringing cow is to show that we don't make fun of issue but Indian particularly hindu raiz issues to make fun which we not gonna let it them.

Ok you've made that clear. Regardless pointing at what someone else is doing doesn't hide what they have highlighted. It's certainly not an opportunity to start point scoring using religion.

 

[Divergent]

In my opinion, Pakistan deserves a iron cast dictatorship like North Korea for 100 years before people should even be allowed to choose the sort of haircut they want- but nothing is ideal.

The problem with Pakistan's blasphemy law is that during Zia's era from 'sentence' to 'death' was verified in such short space of time. Prior to that there were less incidents, since this change many have taken advantage of it to bully or scare people or settle personal scores. The sad part of it is in all this 'Faith & Country' get portrayed wrongly.

The other thing is this law has taken Pakistani society backwards instead of forward and has given them wrong level of confidence thus increasing extremism. Pakistan shouldn't make a massive 'haye mein Margaye' or act like they won't be able to survive because they've lived the period with the original law. To change it back is nothing new or taboo to the people of Pakistan. But the fact that it's given the wrong message and adapted a wrong mentality - to break out of it is now difficult and that is the challenging bit.