Erdogan says Saudi Arabia has requested to purchase armed drones from Turkey

[LeGenD]

That chart is highly incomplete as far Chinese drones go. It's missing the GJ-11 and CH-7 stealth UCAVs, the entire CH lineup of MALEs, and the Wind Shadow/Cloud Shadow. And that's just at a glance, I'm sure if I wracked my brain I could come up with a bunch more.

The chart [in question] does not show all types of UAV that would FIT into each class but select examples of leaps in performance levels. Sufficient to make a point.

 

[Beast]

OK, see, that's nice. This looks like an actual deal with some details and numbers to it. The only issue is

Compare this with the scale of Saudi acquisitions of Chinese "garbage" drones

Saudi Arabia Buying and Building Chinese Armed Drones | AIN

Big new deals follow previous imports by the Kingdom; other countries also buying Chinese UCAVs to avoid Western export restrictions.

www.ainonline.com

You've surely noticed that $200 million (I threw in half a mil in there because what's a rounding error between friends) vs. $10 billion is quite a difference in scale.

Not only that, the turkish drone has a pathetic payload of 120kg only... Obviously a very small drone bought by Saudi as some backup.

 

[ZeEa5KPul]

The chart [in question] does not show all types of UAV that would FIT into each class but select examples of leaps in performance levels. Sufficient to make a point.

Not quite. Chinese examples like the GJ-11 were entirely missing from the stealth UCAV category. In any event, my post provided a few more examples the interested reader can look up.

 

[IblinI]

That chart is highly incomplete as far Chinese drones go. It's missing the GJ-11 and CH-7 stealth UCAVs, the entire CH lineup of MALEs, and the Wind Shadow/Cloud Shadow. And that's just at a glance, I'm sure if I wracked my brain I could come up with a bunch more.

Edit: I just remembered a couple more: Since the Global Hawk is there, so should the Divine Eagle and Soaring Dragon HALE drones.

among China's known UAV projects, I found the divine eagle most interesting, said to be an Anti-stealth/AWE HALE drone.

 

[Goritoes]

Might be a move to reduce tension between Turkey and KSA, KSA will find no allies once America took their hand from them, before someone brag about GCC they are all talk no walk in them, KSA should realize that a strong and equality based alliance with Islamic countries such as Turkey , Malaysia , Pakistan , Indonesia etc will be in their favor, not the boot licking of US and NATO.

 

[raptor22]

I am telling you fanboys, it doesn't matter what kind SAM you bring all will be destroyed. Libya, Syria and Karabagh...


Bayraktar will spy from 30 km far and that old russian old garbage can not shoot it from that distance.



2030 vision....

Well I don't know about old Russians but Iranians SAM 3rd Khordad shot down Global Hawk in 50k feet altitude and 90kms away and for sure it is far advanced than Bayraktar ... and it was not out of blue:

 

[T-SaGe]

Fail to understand Erdogan statement .... KSA already have Turkish drone with load.

SAUDI ARABIA INKS DRONE MANUFACTURING DEAL






March 16, 2021

Photo Source: INTRA Defense Technologies
Daily News
May 6, 2020Quwa Team -
SAUDI ARABIA INKS DRONE MANUFACTURING DEAL
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Saudi Arabia’s General Authority of Military Industries (GAMI) announced that it will acquire 46 unmanned aerial vehicles (UAV) from local defence vendor INTRA Defense Technologies.
The UAV acquisition will start in Q1 2021 at a projected cost of $199.5 million US.
Neither GAMI or INTRA revealed the type or specifications of the drone, but INTRA showcases two drone types in its product portfolio: the ASEF vertical take-off and landing (VTOL) UAV, and the Karayel combat-capable UAV. Thus, GAMI’s order is likely for one (or both) of these UAVs.
The Karayel was developed by the Turkish company Vestel, which unveiled the armed UAV in 2017 at the Dubai Air Show. With a wingspan of 13 m, the Karayel offers an endurance of eight hours when equipped with a payload of 120 kg. If equipped with solely a 50 kg electro-optical and infrared (EO/IR) sensor suite, the Karayel can operate for 20 hours and reach an altitude of 18,000 ft.
It should be noted that INTRA’s UAV is among several programs in Saudi Arabia. In 2017, the King Abdulaziz City for Science and Technology (KACST) revealed its own UAV design, the Saqr-1. Likewise, there had also been reports of KACST manufacturing Chinese CH-series UAVs under license.
Given the mandate of GAMI (i.e., to promote Saudi Arabia’s defence industry), INTRA will commit to locally manufacture the UAVs. Moreover, INTRA’s CEO Salman Al-Shathri said that his company will localize 60% of the program’s total value across both production and maintenance. He added that the program will generate around 500 jobs, of which 70% will go to Saudi Arabia.
In addition, INTRA is also aiming to export the UAVs to other markets.


Janes reported ..

Karayel UAV lost over Yemen
by Jeremy Binnie



The Yemeni rebel group Ansar Allah (the Houthis) claimed on 30 December that it shot down a Turkish-developed Karayel unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) over Al-Hudaydah province as part of an escalated air defence campaign.

A still from a video released by Ansar Allah (Houthis) on 31 December 2019 shows armed men recovering the wreckage of an aircraft identified as a Karayel UAV operated by Saudi Arabia (Ansar Allah)
The group’s website cited its military spokesman as saying the Karayel was operated by Saudi Arabia and was brought down with a surface-to-air missile (SAM) near the Red Sea port of Al-Salif.

It supported this claim with a video purportedly showing the SAM being launched during the night and armed men carrying the wreckage of an aircraft that matched a Karayel from the sea the following day. The air defence system used in the engagement was not shown.

The Karayel was developed by the Turkish company Vestel Defence Industry, which told Jane’s in 2016 that it was operating the type on behalf of the Turkish Land Forces. The company unveiled the Karayel-SU extended-wing variant that can be armed with Roketsan MAM-L and MAM-C guided bombs at the Dubai Air Show in November 2017.

The Karayel was not previously known to be in service with the Saudi military. The downed aircraft may have been operated on its behalf by Intra Defense Technologies, a Saudi company that advertises the Karayel as one of its products and offers “end-to-end” UAV surveillance and reconnaissance services for both military and civil customers.

We can label Karayel (Mistral) as KSA's tactical armed UAV solution from now. The facility and production planning activities have been continuing for a long time. Configuration testing and training activities continued during the same period. The rest is now in the hands of KSA. KSA now has a very cheap, expendable, and armed UAV system that it can produce as much as it wants. Since his production and stock control will be theirs own, even losing 20 UAV in 1 month will not be a problem. As a result, even in such a situation, it will save the lives of dozens of Saud soldiers. Also, It can continue to improve this system with field experience and feedback.

Karayel has very high potential as a tactical armed UAV system. If there could be a system that would take off from the catapult, it would also be chosen by the TAF. However, it remained in the background due to the creation of a system that exceeds the requirements(yes it is ironic) and some other reasons that are not relevant here.

These tools belong to completely different design philosophy, unlike other advanced and expensive systems. Unfortunately, talking about these doctrinal differences is not likely to serve the current pissing contest, so these are issues that are out of interest to the general audience here.

In Karabakh, Libya and Syria, it was the whole system that enabled take advantage on the field, even suppress Regiment / Brigade level air defense systems such as BUK-M and Pantsir within some certain conditions. These UAVs are just one part of a whole system and I will not go into them one by one. However, I would like to say briefly that the last link of the chain that makes this different is the precision strike ammunitions they carry in their pylons rather than these vehicles. In this regard, it is necessary to look at the tactical UAVs of the KSA, as well as the field intelligence, jamming and deception, rapid decision mechanism, and military comm, and of course strike ammunitions types that are a part of these operations.

Might be a move to reduce tension between Turkey and KSA, KSA will find no allies once America took their hand from them, before someone brag about GCC they are all talk no walk in them, KSA should realize that a strong and equality based alliance with Islamic countries such as Turkey , Malaysia , Pakistan , Indonesia etc will be in their favor, not the boot licking of US and NATO.

In the coming period: Qatar, Turkey, KSA, Egypt and even Emirates will solve their majority of the problems between them. There are another states mediating on these issues and they are about to achieve a diplomatic success that will be written in the books in the future.

 

[MMM-E]

Not only that, the turkish drone has a pathetic payload of 120kg only... Obviously a very small drone bought by Saudi as some backup.

İts better than pathetic Chinese Drones which have inferior performing in high altitude

and Turkey can offer KSA 4 different UCAVs including AKSUNGUR with 750kg payload and AKINCI with 1350kg payload


Turkish -- İsraeli Drones destroyed 6 of Armenian S300 Air Defense Systems

so TURKS can rape iRAN backed Houtsis in Yemen , as like we did it in Idlib against SAA , IRGC and HEZBOLAH

but Yemen war is not our war

Where do you get the engines for the drones you're allegedly going to sell to Saudi Arabia and can you guarantee that you'll be able to supply them? Assuming, of course, that all of this isn't just fiction.

indigenous TEI PD-170 Turboprop Engine in mass production for ANKA-S , AKSUNGUR and Bayraktar TB-3 UCAVs

even Turkish TEI-PD170 Engine which produces 225 horsepower at the time of take-off and 170 horsepower at a critical altitude of 20.000 feet with its 40.000 feet altitude capability provided by diesel fuel, stands out as the best in its class worldwide

 

[Beast]

İts better than pathetic Chinese Drones which have inferior performing in high altitude

and Turkey can offer KSA 4 different UCAVs including AKSUNGUR with 750kg payload and AKINCI with 1350kg payload


Turkish -- İsraeli Drones destroyed 6 of Armenian S300 Air Defense Systems

so TURKS can rape iRAN backed Houtsis in Yemen , as like we did it in Idlib against SAA , IRGC and HEZBOLAH

but Yemen war is not our war







indigenous TEI PD-170 Turboprop Engine in mass production for ANKA-S , AKSUNGUR and Bayraktar TB-3 UCAVs
View attachment 726029

even Turkish TEI-PD170 Engine which produces 225 horsepower at the time of take-off and 170 horsepower at a critical altitude of 20.000 feet with its 40.000 feet altitude capability provided by diesel fuel, stands out as the best in its class worldwide

Lol... Indeed with your bragging mouth.
China UCAV is still the best selling UCAV around the world. We are not like some countries whose heavy drone depend on Ukraine engine.

Customers like to buy sanction proof product. Only a few are countries are selected to do this holy task

 

[313ghazi]

Well I don't know about old Russians but Iranians SAM 3rd Khordad shot down Global Hawk in 50k feet altitude and 90kms away and for sure it is far advanced than Bayraktar ... and it was not out of blue:

That's a really interesting picture. Are these all in Yemen?

 

[Oublious]

No, they aren't. They're far from it.

You should worry about being able to supply Pakistan with the helicopters you promised it. Where do you get the engines for the drones you're allegedly going to sell to Saudi Arabia and can you guarantee that you'll be able to supply them? Assuming, of course, that all of this isn't just fiction.

We supply them and they made more then 300.000 fly hourst and the chinese are not.

Losses of UAV over Yemen for reference:

CH-4 = 3
MQ-9 Reaper = 3
MQ-1 Predator = 3
Wing Long = 2
Karayel = 1
Seeker 200 = 1
Unknown = 1

I would not say that.

Yaacoub et al (2020)

You can see Chinese advances in this chart.

chart and specs say not much these days.

You can see ther systems in Libya. UAE used ther chinese drone from begin 2017 and could not win the war. Wher Turkish destroyed haftar, it is not only higher specs and chart, but doctrine.

Chinese are with that nowher, they can manufactur fast and cheap. Show the world how good they are, but when a formadible openent comes they lost.

Turkey used EW in Libya and the chinese drone could not be used anymore. Wher the Turkish drone outclassed Russian EW in Syria. This chart say nothing to me.

 

[LeGenD]

Well I don't know about old Russians but Iranians SAM 3rd Khordad shot down Global Hawk in 50k feet altitude and 90kms away and for sure it is far advanced than Bayraktar ... and it was not out of blue:

These figures are theoretical.

Distance of UAV from Iranian coast at the time of intercept = 34 kilometers (could be less because Iranian authorities insist that it violated Iranian airspace)

Altitude of the UAV at the time of intercept = undisclosed

Bayraktar is very small UAV with very small RCS - not easy to detect and/or economical intercept with big ticket A2/AD items such as 3rd Khordad.

 

[raptor22]

These figures are theoretical.

Distance of UAV from Iranian coast at the time of intercept = 34 kilometers (could be less because Iranian authorities insist that it violated Iranian airspace)

Altitude of the UAV at the time of intercept = undisclosed

Bayraktar is very small UAV with very small RCS - not easy to detect and/or economical intercept with big ticket A2/AD items such as 3rd Khordad.

Well Iran has demonstrated its capability against almost all types of American drones with different RCS, small or big ...
And Altitude of the UAV was mentioned by Hajizadeh:

51000 feet.

That's a really interesting picture. Are these all in Yemen?

No these are American drones Iran either has shot down or brought down by its air deference systems ...

 

[MMM-E]

China UCAV is still the best selling UCAV around the world. We are not like some countries whose heavy drone depend on Ukraine engine.

yes cheap and low quality Chinese UCAVs


there will be AKINCI UCAV variant with Turkish PD-222 turboprob Engine
Ukraine buys UCAVs from Turkey and Turkey buys Engines from Ukraine ... win - win solution

also The turboprop version of the indigenous TS1400 Turboshaft Engine is planned to power HURKUS trainer aircraft.

also In the turbojet configuration of the TS1400 engine ( the core engine can also be converted to turbofan configuration to power HURJET trainer Jet and Heavy UCAVs )




btw China get engine technologies from Ukraine ( Tanks , Warships )

The Chinese Navy heavily used Ukrainian engines for its Destroyers

 

[Hack-Hook]

We have seen IRGC , SAA and HEZBOLAH against the Turkish Armed Forces in IDLIB

no we didnt . you show me iranian equipment you destroyed in idlib.

costly option for iran isnt it? saudia can afford more drones, but i dont know whether iran will be able to keep arming the rebels, financially speaking of course

Is it let see several milion dollar drone vs at most 500000 to 100000 dolar loitering SAM

even OBAMA supported İran against KSA .......... now BIDEN also support İran against KSA in Yemen

All we see is usa support for ksa killing yemeni people.

The cooperation in question has nothing to do with either China or Iran. I'm having trouble understanding that why possible military-industrial convergence between Turkey and KSA triggering Chinese or the Iranians?

China plan to sell its own drones to KSA its a simple competition. Iran support yemen against KSA its natural if turkey sell something to ksa that favor the battlefield toward KSA then iran will arm Ansar-Allah to level the field.