Egyptian army will defend Gulf Arabs in case of direct threat

[Falcon29]

there is a reason to be against turkey and to threaten iran..

as you said his masters.. they are the ones who are pulling the strings.. EU, US israel and Saudis are the ones who are in charge

here is an excample of a backdoor controlled puppet

Are you not allowed to have relations with anybody and if otherwise it makes you a puppet? So is Turkey a puppet of US then? Since it needed permission from US to act in some areas in Syria? Or is it puppet of NATO for hosting NATO base? Is Iran puppet of Russia, India, China and EU, since they saved them from some sanctions? US is a superpower and you all enjoy our friendship and our security cooperation. If US pulls out of Middle East it will look very different, and suddenly we are not going to see how 'independent' your nations are.

First do something about your army getting raped by ISIS in small area of Sinai for years, losing hundreds (thousands maybe) of soldiers and hundreds of armored vehicles, then talk about threatenning Iran.

The head of military junta in Egypt better care about begging for more money from Arab countries to do something about Egypt's economy rather than threatening a country hundreds of miles away.

They aren't necessarily referencing Iran, and Iran will never make itself a direct threat to KSA.

 

[CAN_TR]

The real Question is defend against whom?
Turkey? Iran? besides Saudi Arabia there is no other one that threatened a Gulf country (Qatar) directly.

If Egypt wants defend someone they should try it with Palestinians.

Sisi's a$$-kissing tactics/politics are ->

 

[hussain0216]

All arab armies are useless.

It is NOT about the hardware.

It's a structural problem. Arab armies are tools for dictators to maintain their hegemony. They aren't designed to face threats with an independent professional doctrine.

I agree, Arab armies are set up to control their own populations and not take on external threats

The arms suppliers U.S etc have arabs on a chain they take their money for enough high end weapons to keep milking the idiots but not enough to let them get dangerous

And the arabs dont care or understand for one fundamental reason and that is that the despots and dictators like Sisi, house of saud etc need U.S and western support and protection for their corrupt regimes so they know they are useless but better be useless and in control then take the hard road to independence and give their people honour and the ability to fight their enemies like israel

 

[Timur]

Are you not allowed to have relations with anybody and if otherwise it makes you a puppet?

relations? are you really serious? no offence but if that is the mind of arabs than it clears everything.. you will have kings and dictators another 200 years

sissi does not have relations.. sissi did come to his position through the nations I listed above this is not a relationship nor anything near eaqualness or freedom.. all the toys all the gifts and birthday parties that popped out of nowhere are no realationship gifts this is more something like sattelite state.. egypt is the ping pong ball of certain states and it serves the security interests of this states.. sissis fate is in the hands of this masters so he needs to satisfy them.. you see Merkel or any other master shaking his hand smiling and having no problems with his mass killings its not egyptian mighty state that makes her to be friendly, its sissis submissiveness to seek their support

So is Turkey a puppet of US then?

our government is elected not imported from foreign states.. but there is a dependence problem of military products and economy.. we are on the right way but you cant compare turkey and saudi arabia and egypt this are compleate different kind of countries or let us call some vasall states..


so sure sissy will protect his masters with all he has..

 

[Saddam Hussein]

All Arab armies combined lost against tiny Israel. Arab armies couldn't defeat ISIS. Arab armies cant even defeat Houthis. Whenever a "mighty" Arab country got wrecked by US or Israel, Like Libya, Syria, Iraq or when Israel massacres Palestinians. The rest of the mighty Arab armies drinks tea with Bush, Netanyahu or whoever is/was in power. The only thing Arab armies are good at is buying expensive junk from US.

Hezbollah is not an Arab army. It is created by, trained by and funded by Iran. It's more a branch of IRGC than anything Arab.

PS: No hate on Arabs.

Just out of curiosity. I am no military expert. Far from it. But I am curious to know, how Egypt is planning to defend the gulf countries. Do they plan to fly from Egypt, over the red sea. Land and refuel in KSA. Then fly over the Persian Gulf, all the way to Iran, casually bomb us and fly back to KSA. All unnoticed. Or are they planning to use Iraqi airspace unnoticed? Or are they planning to send warships to the gulf and get wrecked? Not to mention that a few BMs can wipe out the gulf countries.

You paint any of the successes as Iranian successes based on it being distanced from Arabism. Not true, there are units in Arab armies that are highly capable, professional and have zero ties to Iran. Also, you mentioned the PMU. In Iraq specifically, ISOF and the 9th armored division took part in more offensive OPS than any other PMU brigade, and these 2 units are closer to the US military than anything.

Arabs did 'defeat' IS conventionally, mind you ISIS is just Zarqawi's creation together with the Iraqi republican guard command reformed and restructured so not sure what you're bashing here since it's an Arab-Arab fight on the high command level. IS is largely Iraq's doing of former regime officials merging with Ansar al Sunnah and Jama'at Tawhid w al Jihad with good marketing enabling them to recruit so many terrorists.

This thread is full of people trying to feel better about themselves by bashing Arabs, incompetence has been seen in both the Turkish and Iranian forces. Not long ago the Kurds were parading their artificially pumped up pride and prestige of being competent as opposed to the incompetent Iraqi Arabs, then it was shown how incompetent these superior gened Aryan Kurds were. Bottom line, It's not tied to Arab identity. Other then that people here can keep crying to try and feel better about their identity.

 

[lonelyman]

relations? are you really serious? no offence but if that is the mind of arabs than it clears everything.. you will have kings and dictators another 200 years

sissi does not have relations.. sissi did come to his position through the nations I listed above this is not a relationship nor anything near eaqualness or freedom.. all the toys all the gifts and birthday parties that popped out of nowhere are no realationship gifts this is more something like sattelite state.. egypt is the ping pong ball of certain states and it serves the security interests of this states.. sissis fate is in the hands of this masters so he needs to satisfy them.. you see Merkel or any other master shaking his hand smiling and having no problems with his mass killings its not egyptian mighty state that makes her to be friendly, its sissis submissiveness to seek their support



our government is elected not imported from foreign states.. but there is a dependence problem of military products and economy.. we are on the right way but you cant compare turkey and saudi arabia and egypt this are compleate different kind of countries or let us call some vasall states..


so sure sissy will protect his masters with all he has..

Pot calling kettle, isn’t sultan a dictator?

 

[HannibalBarca]

Pot calling kettle, isn’t sultan a dictator?

No, it's a Sultan.

 

[lonelyman]

No, it's a Sultan.

Whatever, another coup coming, be it gulunists or military

 

[mangekyo]

You paint any of the successes as Iranian successes based on it being distanced from Arabism. Not true, there are units in Arab armies that are highly capable, professional and have zero ties to Iran. Also, you mentioned the PMU. In Iraq specifically, ISOF and the 9th armored division took part in more offensive OPS than any other PMU brigade, and these 2 units are closer to the US military than anything.

Arabs did 'defeat' IS conventionally, mind you ISIS is just Zarqawi's creation together with the Iraqi republican guard command reformed and restructured so not sure what you're bashing here since it's an Arab-Arab fight on the high command level. IS is largely Iraq's doing of former regime officials merging with Ansar al Sunnah and Jama'at Tawhid w al Jihad with good marketing enabling them to recruit so many terrorists.

This thread is full of people trying to feel better about themselves by bashing Arabs, incompetence has been seen in both the Turkish and Iranian forces. Not long ago the Kurds were parading their artificially pumped up pride and prestige of being competent as opposed to the incompetent Iraqi Arabs, then it was shown how incompetent these superior gened Aryan Kurds were. Bottom line, It's not tied to Arab identity. Other then that people here can keep crying to try and feel better about their identity.

I mention Hezbollah because it was created by Iran and I mention PMU because Iraq was losing to ISIS in every front. The Iraqi army fled the battlefield and the only Iraqis left fighting ISIS were the Kurds who were losing until Iran helped them. Except for possibly some arabs fighting alongside Kurds. There were no Arab resistance against ISIS until Qasem Soleimani went to Iraq and formed the PMU. I never claimed that Hezbollah or PMU is distanced from Arabism. Not at all. Hezbollah is a Shia Arab group. PMU consists of Iraqis, from Kurds to Turkmens, to Sunni and Shia Arabs. And Ad an Iranian. Im not trying to take credits for Hezbollah or PMUs achievements. That belongs to the people of Lebanon and Iraq. But who funded, organized and trained them? It was Iran. Do you honestly believe Hezbollah and PMU would exist or matter at all without Iran?

 

[HannibalBarca]

Whatever, another coup coming, be it gulunists or military

Ok. But can I bet on a Mao coup for TR? I mean...Option are open right?
If it's taken...Then I will choose the second best... Tzar coup...

 

[Saddam Hussein]

I mention Hezbollah because it was created by Iran and I mention PMU because Iraq was losing to ISIS in every front. The Iraqi army fled the battlefield and the only Iraqis left fighting ISIS were the Kurds who were losing until Iran helped them. Except for possibly some arabs fighting alongside Kurds. There were no Arab resistance against ISIS until Qasem Soleimani went to Iraq and formed the PMU. I never claimed that Hezbollah or PMU is distanced from Arabism. Not at all. Hezbollah is a Shia Arab group. PMU consists of Iraqis, from Kurds to Turkmens, to Sunni and Shia Arabs. And Ad an Iranian. Im not trying to take credits for Hezbollah or PMUs achievements. That belongs to the people of Lebanon and Iraq. But who funded, organized and trained them? It was Iran. Do you honestly believe Hezbollah and PMU would exist or matter at all without Iran?

What i'm saying is that the effectiveness of Hezbollah and the PMU is not due to their link to Iran, Iraq's military failure didn't affect the ISOF unit which has no links to Iran and has its own chain of command separate from the defense ministry and the army. The problem lies not in Arabism, it's not Arab armies that fail. There are units in Arab armies which are highly capable with proper command.

I'm not sure what great wars non-Arab states in the region have conducted since WW1 that makes them stand out from Arab states. Turkey and Iran have not had any major war, and don't mention to me Turkey's war of independence when air planes were still of the stone age and numbers of troops mattered a lot more. Iran-Iraq war was no victory for Iran and there was nothing good from Iran's side, human wave tactics. The air force did it properly though which makes sense given the proper US training and F-14's (best in the region back then) prior to that.

you credit Qasem too much with the resurgence of these militia's in 2014, it was Sistani's call for Jihad that led to former militia leaders such as Sadr, Amiri, Mohandis, Qais al Khazali to assume leadership positions once again of organizations recruiting all those answering Sistani's call for Jihad. However, you can give a lot more credit to Qasem and his likes for forming these armed wings back in 2004, however who says that was any good for us to start with. It only fueled sectarianism and Zarqawi's narrative to spark the civil war.

Then let's look at ISIS, they had some proper successes on the battlefield and their entire leadership is ex Iraqi republican guard, so some Arab units can properly function? But let's ignore all that, let's ignore ISOF etc. When it comes to Egypt it's not possible to judge given they've not been in a major war for decades.

Shortly said, **** this entire thread.

 

[mangekyo]

What i'm saying is that the effectiveness of Hezbollah and the PMU is not due to their link to Iran, Iraq's military failure didn't affect the ISOF unit which has no links to Iran and has its own chain of command separate from the defense ministry and the army. The problem lies not in Arabism, it's not Arab armies that fail. There are units in Arab armies which are highly capable with proper command.

I'm not sure what great wars non-Arab states in the region have conducted since WW1 that makes them stand out from Arab states. Turkey and Iran have not had any major war, and don't mention to me Turkey's war of independence when air planes were still of the stone age and numbers of troops mattered a lot more. Iran-Iraq war was no victory for Iran and there was nothing good from Iran's side, human wave tactics. The air force did it properly though which makes sense given the proper US training and F-14's (best in the region back then) prior to that.

you credit Qasem too much with the resurgence of these militia's in 2014, it was Sistani's call for Jihad that led to former militia leaders such as Sadr, Amiri, Mohandis, Qais al Khazali to assume leadership positions once again of organizations recruiting all those answering Sistani's call for Jihad. However, you can give a lot more credit to Qasem and his likes for forming these armed wings back in 2004, however who says that was any good for us to start with. It only fueled sectarianism and Zarqawi's narrative to spark the civil war.

Then let's look at ISIS, they had some proper successes on the battlefield and their entire leadership is ex Iraqi republican guard, so some Arab units can properly function? But let's ignore all that, let's ignore ISOF etc. When it comes to Egypt it's not possible to judge given they've not been in a major war for decades.

Shortly said, **** this entire thread.

I respect your opinion but I disagree. I do believe that Hezbollah and PMUs success is due to their link to Iran. When you talk about the Iran-Iraq war, let's not forget that Saddam got financed by KSA and China among others and got a never ending supply of arms and latest tech, while Iran was begging Syria and N.K for simple SCUD missiles. And lets not forget Saddams use of chemical weapons and the technical and millitary support he got from USA.

By mid-1982, the war's momentum had shifted decisively in favor of Iran, which invaded Iraq to depose Saddam's government.[3][21] CIA analyst Bruce Riedel recounted: "You just had a series of catastrophic Iraqi defeats. They had been driven out of Iran, and the Iraqi army looked like it was falling apart."[22] "The Reagan administration feared that Iran's army might slice through Iraq to the oilfields of Kuwait and Saudi Arabia";[23] Veliotes, then "Assistant Secretary of State for Near Eastern and South Asian Affairs," "outlined a nightmare scenario in which the Iranians invade Iraq, they defeat Iraq, and then head straight for Israel, which is distracted and debilitated by its ongoing adventure in Lebanon." As a result, the U.S. gradually abandoned its policy of neutrality.[22]

[T]he United States actively supported the Iraqi war effort by supplying the Iraqis with billions of dollars of credits, by providing U.S. military intelligence and advice to the Iraqis, and by closely monitoring third country arms sales to Iraq to make sure that Iraq had the military weaponry required. The United States also provided strategic operational advice to the Iraqis to better use their assets in combat... The CIA, including both CIA Director Casey and Deputy Director Gates, knew of, approved of, and assisted in the sale of non-U.S. origin military weapons, ammunition and vehicles to Iraq. My notes, memoranda and other documents in my NSC files show or tend to show that the CIA knew of, approved of, and assisted in the sale of non-U.S. origin military weapons, munitions and vehicles to Iraq.[26]

IMO. When the whole world is against you and does whatever they can to help your enemy defeat you. But still your enemy couldn't defeat you. That is a victory.

 

[Saddam Hussein]

I respect your opinion but I disagree. I do believe that Hezbollah and PMUs success is due to their link to Iran. When you talk about the Iran-Iraq war, let's not forget that Saddam got financed by KSA and China among others and got a never ending supply of arms and latest tech, while Iran was begging Syria and N.K for simple SCUD missiles. And lets not forget Saddams use of chemical weapons and the technical and millitary support he got from USA.

By mid-1982, the war's momentum had shifted decisively in favor of Iran, which invaded Iraq to depose Saddam's government.[3][21] CIA analyst Bruce Riedel recounted: "You just had a series of catastrophic Iraqi defeats. They had been driven out of Iran, and the Iraqi army looked like it was falling apart."[22] "The Reagan administration feared that Iran's army might slice through Iraq to the oilfields of Kuwait and Saudi Arabia";[23] Veliotes, then "Assistant Secretary of State for Near Eastern and South Asian Affairs," "outlined a nightmare scenario in which the Iranians invade Iraq, they defeat Iraq, and then head straight for Israel, which is distracted and debilitated by its ongoing adventure in Lebanon." As a result, the U.S. gradually abandoned its policy of neutrality.[22]

[T]he United States actively supported the Iraqi war effort by supplying the Iraqis with billions of dollars of credits, by providing U.S. military intelligence and advice to the Iraqis, and by closely monitoring third country arms sales to Iraq to make sure that Iraq had the military weaponry required. The United States also provided strategic operational advice to the Iraqis to better use their assets in combat... The CIA, including both CIA Director Casey and Deputy Director Gates, knew of, approved of, and assisted in the sale of non-U.S. origin military weapons, ammunition and vehicles to Iraq. My notes, memoranda and other documents in my NSC files show or tend to show that the CIA knew of, approved of, and assisted in the sale of non-U.S. origin military weapons, munitions and vehicles to Iraq.[26]

IMO. When the whole world is against you and does whatever they can to help your enemy defeat you. But still your enemy couldn't defeat you. That is a victory.

Iran-Iraq war was simply one of both sides being balanced by global powers. Iraq had the upper hand till 1982, then Iran gained the upper hand.. Iraq proposed a cease-fire, Iran rejected it. Years later 1986, Iraq started gaining the upper hand again and it slowly shifted towards Iraq's favor. By 1988 Al-Faw operation resulted in Iraqi presence in Khuzestan with them pushing further. By 1988 Iran's force was depleted and not able to sustain the war much longer, this is when Khomeini accepted the cease-fire. Iraq was left with a large army, it invaded Kuwait and was then reduced to an army that can only defend from Iran, no longer pose a threat.

You can call it winning all day, you can parade it if you want Iraqis do the same thing. In the end you can say Iraq received support, I can say Iran is much bigger with a larger population and made deals with Israel, I can say Iraq has a majority Shia population which Iran influenced. See how easy that is?

Even if it is a victory, this was a war of survival for Iran where the level of tactics was reduced to using children and mass-human waves which is not competent, it might be brave but it's a last measure. By no means any example to be copied.

It also depends on who this force Hezbollah/PMU would be fighting, if they fight some armored units as Israel would deploy they'd have an advantage in certain terrains as you well know. In the open desert such as during the tank battles of desert storm it is completely different making these battles no comparisons. It's simple to make statements that Arab armies are ineffective. The early Turkish operation in Syria against IS showed them deploying tanks in line formations which resulted in failures obviously, it was a small replication similar to the 2006 Hezbollah war. IS isn't Iranian trained, what was shared in common had nothing to do with nationalities or ethnicities. Likewise in Anbar province Iraq's Abrams was deployed on routes that are swamps, easy targets for IS given they can hide around the swamps. The issue of understanding such things is not only with Arabs, it has been seen with Turks recently and with the IDF in 2006.

 

[Malik Alashter]

The Question is if Imam Sistani didn't make that Fatwa and the PMU not created are there any army that led by Baathis going to stand and save the country from ISIS or are there any Shia group going to defeat ISIS

Weather Arab Turks or Iranian please educate me or enlighten me on that matter please
Arab armeis aren't bad they're men like any men all they need some real leaders to get the job done I really don't understand this rhetoric about Arab been have human and can't do what the others can simple ignorance

Iranian helped no doubts but their help will equal to zero without local men with high morals to fight the dark side army

We don't have the luxury to mock each other enough of this ignorance since we won't get no where with mentality and our enemy still at the gate

بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم وهذه أمتكم أمة واحدة وانا ربكم فاعبدون

بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم كلكم لادن وادم من تراب
That's it what's Arab what's Persians or Turks
wake up please

 

[Stryker1982]

And Iran will send back a quick "lol" in reply.

This is the country that lost to Israel with 10 times the population.

Doesn't Egypt have bigger problems? I'm sure alot of Egyptian people will pack their bags to fight for a bunch of Saudi's in Yemen or against Iran.....

Iran-Iraq war was simply one of both sides being balanced by global powers. Iraq had the upper hand till 1982, then Iran gained the upper hand.. Iraq proposed a cease-fire, Iran rejected it. Years later 1986, Iraq started gaining the upper hand again and it slowly shifted towards Iraq's favor. By 1988 Al-Faw operation resulted in Iraqi presence in Khuzestan with them pushing further. By 1988 Iran's force was depleted and not able to sustain the war much longer, this is when Khomeini accepted the cease-fire. Iraq was left with a large army

Iraq's recovery was solely due to foreign suppliers and the statistics on the number of Iraqi armored vehicles present at the start and end of the war will show that. The fact that Iran was depleted from the very beginning and managed to hold and defeat Iraqi armored divisions that are multiple times larger in quantity than Iran shows how valiantly Iran defended with so little. The fact that Saddam Hussein had to resort to chemical weapons to prevent an Iranian victory, which the Americans deemed as unacceptable! proves my point about how desperate Iraq had become that they had to commit war crimes to stay alive. Don't forget my friend, Saddam Hussein said it would take a week for them to take Tehran. That's how bad shape Iran was at the time and how confident Iraq was. An Iraq that had several thousand more tanks than Iran. This is a testament to how poorly the Iraqi army fought despite being supported directly by every major power in the world in both materials and intelligence. Iran fought valiantly while under sanctions. Don't forget, Iran became the enemy of the west when U.S embassy was invaded.

The Iraqi Army has done very well against Daesh, and they along with the Syrian army will be the top Arab armies simply due to their very difficult experience and very difficult environments. Their is no doubt those soldiers involved in Battle for Mosul or Aleppo alone are worth more than the entire Saudi military. Iraqi and Syrian war veterans are much more hardened, experienced and resolute than their their Egyptian and Saudi counter parts who are idle, fat and lazy.