Egypt, Pakistan join military campaign against Houthis

[Secur]

Please do tell us, Once we become neutral, would Iran support us like Saudis helped us during sanction periods of 90's ? Putting aside emotional rehtoric, do tell us by keeping how foreign relations works on Planet earth.

And those were the times of a Sunni ruler ruling Iran. Please do read Profiles of Intelligence by Ex-Brigadier Tirmizi - DG counter-terrorism ISI 79-84. He dedicated the whole chapter on what happened when Mullah took over Iran and how they used to do propaganda to proof Pakistan were stooges of America. There mentality hasn't changed much. Do you want to support this Iran over Saudia ?

Emotional rhetoric come on? You are better than that, my friend, aren't you? Is it some sort of Pakistan's duty to ensure that Gulf countries are kept safe from the fire they so recklessly lit themselves? Is it our duty to send our soldiers to fight other countries war? Haven't we learn a single thing from the 80's misadventure in Afghanistan? Foreign relations isn't sleeping with anyone who offers you a bit of money, bon ami. Unless of course the Islamabad has made a new definition of them.

Stop with the Sunni-Shia thing here. This is just Arab-Persian war and there is a big difference. I am not asking to support anyone, let the Middle East remain as it is. Let them destabilize it further and burn themselves in the fire, we need not intervene. Never take sides in a wizard's war, the victory is never for the the goblins in the end. Do not burn Pakistan again like you once did.

 

[Cheetah786]

As a Muslim I believe Almighty provides not house of saud.

Looking from 1990-2014. How many times Saudia has come to help and how many times iran has come to help ?

lol you made a 360 degree turn and to say what. Saudi help do you really wanna go there (Pakistan is on the brink of bankruptcy 1000 upon 1000 Pakistani dead) pakistan oil fired power plants are shut down,because we don't have the money to pay for the fuel which according to you is for free.

 

[Bratva]

Emotional rhetoric come on? You are better than that, my friend, aren't you? Is it some sort of Pakistan's duty to ensure that Gulf countries are kept safe from the fire they so recklessly lit themselves? Is it our duty to send our soldiers to fight other countries war? Haven't we learn a single thing from the 80's misadventure in Afghanistan? Foreign relations isn't sleeping with anyone who offers you a bit of money, bon ami. Unless of course the Islamabad has made a new definition of them.

Stop with the Sunni-Shia thing here. This is just Arab-Persian war and there is a big difference. I am not asking to support anyone, let the Middle East remain as it is. Let them destabilize it further and burn themselves in the fire, we need not intervene. Never take sides in a wizard's war, the victory is never for the the goblins in the end. Do not burn Pakistan again like you once did.

I was thinking along the same line. Emotionally. Then reality kicked in and emotional withdrawal started. We are aware of our realities. We know the sensitivities as well.

The arrangement would be similar to what Pakistan did in 91. Station troops in Saudia facing yemen border. Won't cross yemen. Air support and Naval blockade. Our soldiers aren't fighting anyone wars. Our allies need a symbolic gesture from us. Do you want to alienate whole GCC over this symbolic gesture ?

Would such gesture escalate things ? No they won't.

lol you made a 360 degree turn and to say what. Saudi help do you really wanna go there (Pakistan is on the brink of bankruptcy 1000 upon 1000 Pakistani dead) pakistan oil fired power plants are shut down,because we don't have the money to pay for the fuel which according to you is for free.

Okay let me rephrase my question. How many times Allah Almighty has given toufiq to Saudia to help us and how many times Allah Almighty has provided us through Iran ?

 

[Secur]

I was thinking along the same line. Emotionally. Then reality kicked in and emotional withdrawal started. We are aware of our realities. We know the sensitivities as well.

The arrangement would be similar to what Pakistan did in 91. Station troops in Saudia facing yemen border. Won't cross yemen. Air support and Naval blockade. Our soldiers aren't fighting anyone wars. Our allies need a symbolic gesture from us.

Would such gesture escalate things ? No they won't.

I am not emotional, just putting out things as they are. Without any censor, you can say. Rented soldiers and an army for hire. There's no withdrawal when an entire country is being run like a Govt school without any planning, foresight or sovereignty at all. Beggars in Govt ready to do anything for a lil bit of money!

This conflict will escalate, the soldiers standing over at the border if that is what is going to happen (there's a big if there) will be asked to move over to the war-zone and fight with Houthis. Wait and watch, this isn't as simple as you are putting it out to be. I know how KSA fights its wars, trust me.

 

[haviZsultan]

Emotional rhetoric come on? You are better than that, my friend, aren't you? Is it some sort of Pakistan's duty to ensure that Gulf countries are kept safe from the fire they so recklessly lit themselves? Is it our duty to send our soldiers to fight other countries war? Haven't we learn a single thing from the 80's misadventure in Afghanistan? Foreign relations isn't sleeping with anyone who offers you a bit of money, bon ami. Unless of course the Islamabad has made a new definition of them.

Stop with the Sunni-Shia thing here. This is just Arab-Persian war and there is a big difference. I am not asking to support anyone, let the Middle East remain as it is. Let them destabilize it further and burn themselves in the fire, we need not intervene. Never take sides in a wizard's war, the victory is never for the the goblins in the end. Do not burn Pakistan again like you once did.

I think the biggest foreign policy disaster of ours can teach us something. Afghanistan. We interfered in a sovereign country with or without US influence does not matter... but the end result must matter. We left Afghanistan in ruin and not only that. We left the fire of hatred burning against us in each Afghans heart. I will be truthful I have never seen anyone hate us as much, not even India. That was the result of our interference in said country secur and there is still the lingering belief that we support terrorist organizations which simply will not go away.

I fully agree with you here Secur. We should do everything to remain neutral. Lets take another example other than Afghanistan. We interfered in Jordan-Black September. We killed thousands of innocent Palestinians and many Palestinians still remember that. Zia Ul Haq was promoted for the said operation and he took Pakistan down the road where fanaticism and jihadism became mingled with the national fabric.

I can not more strongly say this. Yemen, Iran, Iraq, Saudia... remain neutral or we will be creating yet another problem for ourselves. Let the Yemenis deal with their own problems.

 

[Cheetah786]

Okay let me rephrase my question. How many times Allah Almighty has given toufiq to Saudia to help us and how many times Allah Almighty has provided us through Iran ?

WHAT HELP DO U TALK OFF TELL US ALL . TOUFIQ AKA MONEY TO BUY POLITICIANS IS NOT HELP,ITS A PURCHASE.

Last I checked our trade with India via Dubai is bigger then with Arab nations our trade with the Americans and the westren nations is bigger then the GCC. Americans and Europeans give more favourite terms for trade then your GCC nations. What exactly do you want Iran to do for you when they themselves are undersanctions.

 

[haviZsultan]

lol you made a 360 degree turn and to say what. Saudi help do you really wanna go there (Pakistan is on the brink of bankruptcy 1000 upon 1000 Pakistani dead) pakistan oil fired power plants are shut down,because we don't have the money to pay for the fuel which according to you is for free.

Thats right. Which country initiates wars where our borders do not even meet when we have lost $100 billion and 50000 people to terrorists? The Saudis have a guard force of SSG commandos. That is more than help they need. Let us not help them in any aggressive maneuver against a sovereign country. Africa is an example and a story of that. Chadian soldiers in Nigeria, French forces in Mali, Kenyan troops in Somalia... sounds fun? Well the Africans are still dying and no one cares about them. There is only one country in Asia as poor as African countries and it is Afghanistan and they faced the same problems foreign intervention and future war and disease. Do we want to be the Africa of South Asia?

 

[Sage]

@Serpentine @Zarvan

 

[Thəorətic Muslim]

The arrangement would be similar to what Pakistan did in 91. Station troops in Saudia facing yemen border. Won't cross yemen. Air support and Naval blockade. Our soldiers aren't fighting anyone wars. Our allies need a symbolic gesture from us. Do you want to alienate whole GCC over this symbolic gesture ?

Would such gesture escalate things ? No they won't.

So place Pakistani soldiers on the Iraq-Saudi Border to replace the 30,000 Saudi soldiers there.

 

[Sage]

So place Pakistani soldiers on the Iraq-Saudi Border to replace the 30,000 Saudi soldiers there.

This is the exact number of the troops last time they Saudis asked for ...but were denied !

 

[Thəorətic Muslim]

This is the exact number of the troops last time they Saudis asked for ...but were denied !

..... If you think 1 Saudi Soldier = 1 Pakistani Soldier......

 

[Sage]

..... If you think 1 Saudi Soldier = 1 Pakistani Soldier......

And they were not to be sent out of the border ...they wanted them to be there like the last line of defense ....!

 

[haviZsultan]

@Serpentine @Zarvan
View attachment 207882 View attachment 207883 View attachment 207884 View attachment 207885 View attachment 207886

I can't pretend to understand what this is. Its the names of a number of shias... possibly victims of some crimes. Do elaborate on what it tries to show. Because Sipah E Muhammed still has to kill even one innocent sunni. Yes it has targeted Lashkar E Jhangvi and the Taliban but it has never attacked civilians. However the police takes more action against them rather than giving them jobs in the police force to hunt down sunni organizations which have bombed entire mosques like the LEJ/ASWJ/SSP and of course the Taliban.

Lets be realistic, have you in the past 10 years heard of a shia suicide bomber. It seems we sunnis run that kind of thing. I mean I have to agree with some of the things Iranians are saying. We have the largest shia population in the world and are serving Saudi interests where we have nothing to benefit... its a recipe for civil war. We should be protecting our shia brothers and should pick a neutral path.

 

[Bratva]

I am not emotional, just putting out things as they are. Without any censor, you can say. Rented soldiers and an army for hire. There's no withdrawal when an entire country is being run like a Govt school without any planning, foresight or sovereignty at all. Beggars in Govt ready to do anything for a lil bit of money!

This conflict will escalate, the soldiers standing over at the border if that is what is going to happen (there's a big if there) will be asked to move over to the war-zone and fight with Houthis. Wait and watch, this isn't as simple as you are putting it out to be. I know how KSA fights its wars, trust me.

Interestingly Pakistan declined Saudi request 2 weeks back. But Saudia pulled this stunt and literally forced Pakistan hand to help them

Pakistan declines to join Saudi Arabia's anti-Iran alliance

Summary: Print Pakistani Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif has rejected, at least for now, Saudi Arabia's entreaties for Pakistani troops to help guard the Saudi border with northern Yemen, controlled by Iranian-backed Houthi Shiite forces.



Author Bruce Riedel Posted March 15, 2015

Saudi Arabia's campaign to build a broad Sunni alliance to contain Iran has apparently suffered at least a setback from Pakistan. Islamabad has opted, at least for now, to avoid becoming entangled in the sectarian cold war between Riyadh and Tehran.
Earlier this month, Pakistani Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif was invited to the kingdom for urgent talks with King Salman bin Abdul-Aziz Al Saud and his advisers. The king met Sharif at the airport to underscore the importance of the talks. The main topic was Iranian aggression in the Arab world and the impending deadline for the P5+1 negotiations on Iran's nuclear project. The king wanted firm assurances from Sharif that Pakistan would align itself with Saudi Arabia and its Sunni Arab allies against Iran, especially in the proxy war now underway in Yemen.



Salman specifically wanted a Pakistani military contingent to deploy to the kingdom to help defend the vulnerable southwest border with Zaydi Houthi-controlled north Yemen and serve as a trip-wire force to deter Iranian aggression. There is precedent for a Pakistani army expeditionary force in Saudi Arabia. After the Iranian Revolution, Pakistani dictator Mohammad Zia ul-Haq deployed an elite Pakistani armored brigade to the kingdom at King Fahd's request to deter any threats to the country. In all, some 40,000 Pakistanis served in the brigade over most of a decade. Today only some Pakistani advisers and experts serve in the kingdom.



According to Pakistani sources, Sharif has reluctantly decided not to send troops to Saudi Arabia for now. Sharif promised closer counterterrorism and military cooperation but no troops for the immediate future. Pakistan also declined to move its embassy in Yemen from Sanaa to Aden as the Saudis and the Gulf Cooperation Council states have done to distance themselves from the Houthis.



The Pakistanis are arguing their military is already overstretched facing the traditional enemy, India, and the increasing threat from the Pakistani Taliban. Pakistan has its own serious sectarian tensions and violence. About 20% of Pakistanis are Shiite and sectarian violence has been intensifying in recent years. Groups linked to al-Qaeda such as Lashkar-e-Jhangvi have targeted Shiite mosques and schools for suicide bombings. Iran also has proxies in Pakistan that have attacked Sunni targets in the past. Faced with these difficulties at home, Sharif is telling Salman not now for troops.



Sharif is by nature a cautious man and a very deliberate decision-maker. He is carefully leaving open the option of deploying troops to the kingdom in the future if the security situation gets worse. He will also be clear with the king that Pakistan remains a close Saudi ally. The ambiguous and mysterious Pakistani nuclear connection with Saudi Arabia will remain in the background.



The king has doubled down on his Egyptian connection this month. Crown Prince Muqrin pledged $4 billion in investment in Egypt at the Sharm el-Sheikh conference this week, and Kuwait and the United Arab Emirates each pledged the same. But Egypt, too, is reluctant to send troops, especially for operations around Yemen. Egyptians still have bitter memories of their disastrous intervention in Yemen in the 1960s. Ironically, the Egyptians then were fighting Saudi-backed Zaydi royalists.



So for now Saudi Defense Minister Prince Mohammed bin Salman, the king's son, will have to plan on dealing with Houthi threats on the border alone with Saudi troops. They have not fared well in past clashes with the Houthis.

WHAT HELP DO U TALK OFF TELL US ALL . TOUFIQ AKA MONEY TO BUY POLITICIANS IS NOT HELP,ITS A PURCHASE.

Last I checked our trade with India via Dubai is bigger then with Arab nations our trade with the Americans and the westren nations is bigger then the GCC. Americans and Europeans give more favourite terms for trade then your GCC nations. What exactly do you want Iran to do for you when they themselves are undersanctions.

Err Our nuclear program in mid 80's- late 90's. Money came from Saudia. They helped finance our defense deals.

 

[Sage]

I can't pretend to understand what this is. Its the names of a number of shias... possibly victims of some crimes. Do elaborate on what it tries to show. Because Sipah E Muhammed still has to kill even one innocent sunni. Yes it has targeted Lashkar E Jhangvi and the Taliban but it has never attacked civilians. However the police takes more action against them rather than giving them jobs in the police force to hunt down sunni organizations which have bombed entire mosques like the LEJ/ASWJ/SSP and of course the Taliban.

Lets be realistic, have you in the past 10 years heard of a shia suicide bomber. It seems we sunnis run that kind of thing. I mean I have to agree with some of the things Iranians are saying. We have the largest shia population in the world and are serving Saudi interests where we have nothing to benefit... its a recipe for civil war. We should be protecting our shia brothers and should pick a neutral path.

What I posted is actually a Wanted List of terrorists in Punjab ....Among LEL/ASW/SSP/TTP, there is TJP as well ...@Serpentine earlier in the same thread claimed that no Shia organization has committed any crime ...I was countering that ...TJP has the same ways as others ...!