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Defence council to green light local trainer today

SR-91

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On Thursday, the defence ministry's apex Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) will discuss a project the Indian Air Force (IAF) has tried for years to kill. However, the Hindustan Turbo Trainer-40 (HTT-40) basic trainer aircraft has not just survived but will take to the skies shortly.

The HTT-40 project is alive because, even as the IAF insisted on a Swiss trainer -the Pilatus PC-7 Mark II - and on shutting the HTT-40 project to buy more Pilatus trainers; Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) proceeded with the Indian alternative.

In an unprecedented show of confidence, HAL allocated Rs 350 crore of internal funding for the HTT-40, after the IAF stonewalled HAL's "detailed project report" (DPR), which asked for funds.

On Thursday, in a triumph for "Make in India", HAL will brief the DAC that the HTT-40 is on track to fly before the financial year-end. Another two years will go in flight-testing and, by March 2018, the HTT-40 will be ready for serial production.

Despite IAF's insistence that the HTT-40 cannot be built, three successive defence ministers - AK Antony, Arun Jaitley and now Manohar Parrikar - have steadfastly backed HAL. Now, their faith is being vindicated.

"The IAF is working closely with us and is now willing to fund the project. But we have decided to first fly the aircraft and then move the file for funding. This is HAL's vote of confidence in the project," said HAL chairman, T Suvarna Raju.

IAF head, Air Chief Marshal Arup Raha, addressing the media ahead of Air Force Day last month, publicly accepted the HTT-40. "As we get the HTT-40, indigenously built by HAL as a basic trainer, I think we will be well on our way in making up the deficiencies in our pilot training", said Raha.


The IAF trains its fighter pilots in three phases. Stage-1 training of rookies, done on propeller-driven basic trainers will be on the Pilatus PC-7 Mark II and the HTT-40, when it joins the fleet. Next, pilots will graduate to Stage-2 training on the Sitara intermediate jet trainer (IJT), which is completing development. Then pilots do Stage-3 training on the Hawk advanced jet trainer (AJT), which HAL builds under licence from BAE Systems.

To bring the IAF around to accepting the HTT-40, the defence ministry cut a deal in the DAC in February. It was agreed the IAF would buy 38 more Pilatus trainers under the "options clause" of the May 24, 2012 contract for 75 PC-7 Mark II aircraft. HAL, in turn, agreed to pare down its HTT-40 order to 70 aircraft from the promised 106. HAL said at least 70 trainers were needed for economical production.

The Business Standard visited the HTT-40 design centre in HAL Bengaluru, where the first prototype is being assembled in the fabrication hangar. A Honeywell TPE-331-12B engine, a version of which is already flying with the IAF, navy and coast guard on the Dornier-228 aircraft, will power the HTT-40. The engine has arrived and is waiting to be fitted into the first prototype.

The design team calls the HTT-40 a "nice, simple aircraft", which is unlikely to create problems in the crucial spin and stall trials. These prove that an aircraft a trainee pilot has stalled, or put into a spin, can bring itself back easily into level flight.

"We will set up our production line in HAL Bengaluru, with a rated output of 20 trainers each year. The first year we will build just two aircraft, eight in the second year and 20 aircraft from year-three onwards", says the design team head.

Since the IAF has committed to buying just 70 HTT-40s, HAL might run out of orders by 2022. However, the HTT-40 could be built in larger numbers if the IAF rejects the Sitara. In that eventuality, the IAF chief has an alternative plan for Stage-2 training to be done using the expanded flying envelope of the Stage-1 trainers.

"As soon as we get the HTT-40… this aircraft will also be used in Stage-2 training if we find that it meets our requirements. If it doesn't, the HTT-40 will be used only in Stage-1 training", said Raha.


Defence council to green light local trainer today | Business Standard News


Made in India is now getting into full swing. Good to see this development.
Its high time to Walk the Talk for HAL.
 
Good development. Is Htt-40 an intermediate trainer ?

Why LCA trainer is not inducted for advance superlative LIFT

Advantage :

1. Supersonic trainer, Make in India to Made in India

2 Comonality with LCA tejas

3. Could be used in war situation for CAS

4. Trainer for MKI, where MKI is used for training purpose, thus reducing its Technical Life

5. Radar, BVR, FBW and glass cockpit to mimic different fighter plane instruments and display.

6. Carrier based trainer would be available soon.

7. Trained pilot could easily transformed to respective fighter planes

8. Potential for Export, if used by IAF and IN.
 
Good development. Is Htt-40 an intermediate trainer ?

Why LCA trainer is not inducted for advance superlative LIFT

Advantage :

1. Supersonic trainer, Make in India to Made in India

2 Comonality with LCA tejas

3. Could be used in war situation for CAS

4. Trainer for MKI, where MKI is used for training purpose, thus reducing its Technical Life

5. Radar, BVR, FBW and glass cockpit to mimic different fighter plane instruments and display.

6. Carrier based trainer would be available soon.

7. Trained pilot could easily transformed to respective fighter planes

8. Potential for Export, if used by IAF and IN.

Nope HTT-40 is the basic trainer. IJT Sitara, is supposed to be the intermediate trainer.

HAL HJT-36 Sitara - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

HTT 40

HTT-40+BTT-1.jpg


IJT HJT 36

Hindustan_HJT-36_Sitara_Krivchikov_2007.jpg
 
Utter stupidity. What other country has two different types of BTT for the exact same purpose? As always the IAF will get the blame for being petulant and wanting PHOREN male only but the reality is HAL has failed to to develop this aircraft at all- not even when the Deepaks were KILLING their pilots. The IAF was forced to go for a fast track procurement of the PC-7 MK.2 and Pilatus did a commendable (and unappreciated) job in delivering them as fast as their production lines would allow. The IAF, rightly, simply wants to exercise that contract's follow-on clause for 150+ more PC-7s and Pilatus were willing to set up a production line in India but HAL has lobbied the MOD against it and the DM has, stupidly, played into their hands. So now the IAF is going to have 2 a/c for the basic training with all the extra costs that go with it and to top it all off HAL, even having known how much the IAF is paying for the PC-7, has quoted a price HIGHER than the IAF was prepared to pay. Is this taxpayer money well spent?

Politics should never get in the way of these decisions but the NDA has set several dangerous precedents.


@Dash @saurav @Star Wars
 
Utter stupidity. What other country has two different types of BTT for the exact same purpose? As always the IAF will get the blame for being petulant and wanting PHOREN male only but the reality is HAL has failed to to develop this aircraft at all- not even when the Deepaks were KILLING their pilots. The IAF was forced to go for a fast track procurement of the PC-7 MK.2 and Pilatus did a commendable (and unappreciated) job in delivering them as fast as their production lines would allow. The IAF, rightly, simply wants to exercise that contract's follow-on clause for 150+ more PC-7s and Pilatus were willing to set up a production line in India but HAL has lobbied the MOD against it and the DM has, stupidly, played into their hands. So now the IAF is going to have 2 a/c for the basic training with all the extra costs that go with it and to top it all off HAL, even having known how much the IAF is paying for the PC-7, has quoted a price HIGHER than the IAF was prepared to pay. Is this taxpayer money well spent?

Politics should never get in the way of these decisions but the NDA has set several dangerous precedents.


@Dash @saurav @Star Wars

Every country in the world needs its forces to support local production, only India is an exception. You are wrong bro, the dengerous precedence set by IAF itself needs a check now.

If we keep importing we will never create a base here for the hoe grown defence industry. This mentality of IAF will never let us come out of world's largest wepons exporter tag.
 
Every country in the world needs its forces to support local production, only India is an exception. You are wrong bro, the dengerous precedence set by IAF itself needs a check now.

If we keep importing we will never create a base here for the hoe grown defence industry. This mentality of IAF will never let us come out of world's largest wepons exporter tag.
So the IAF should have done nothing as Deepaks were falling out of the skies and taking the lives of budding pilots with them? Is this what you are saying?

It's very easy to blame the IAF but they are professionals and do their job with what they have. There was no (and STILL is no) home-grown BTT in India and thus they HAD to go for the PC-7. All this time and HAL is still yet to even fabricate the HTT-40, if it was up to them the IAF would STILL have NO BTT. The significance of this omission cannot be overstated- it would have CRIPPLED the IAF.

You still haven't rebuked my points on the economics of operating two different BTT types for the same role brother, I understand the ideology behind what you are saying and in an ideal world I would agree but this is the real world and one has to be pragmatic. Blind nationalism would have seen many more young pilots killed or crippled to date.
 
Utter stupidity. What other country has two different types of BTT for the exact same purpose? As always the IAF will get the blame for being petulant and wanting PHOREN male only but the reality is HAL has failed to to develop this aircraft at all- not even when the Deepaks were KILLING their pilots. The IAF was forced to go for a fast track procurement of the PC-7 MK.2 and Pilatus did a commendable (and unappreciated) job in delivering them as fast as their production lines would allow. The IAF, rightly, simply wants to exercise that contract's follow-on clause for 150+ more PC-7s and Pilatus were willing to set up a production line in India but HAL has lobbied the MOD against it and the DM has, stupidly, played into their hands. So now the IAF is going to have 2 a/c for the basic training with all the extra costs that go with it and to top it all off HAL, even having known how much the IAF is paying for the PC-7, has quoted a price HIGHER than the IAF was prepared to pay. Is this taxpayer money well spent?

Politics should never get in the way of these decisions but the NDA has set several dangerous precedents.


@Dash @saurav @Star Wars

Any link/source for price quoted by HAL for this trainer ?

If the price is ~10% more, its okay for me. Money stays in country.
 
Utter stupidity. What other country has two different types of BTT for the exact same purpose? As always the IAF will get the blame for being petulant and wanting PHOREN male only but the reality is HAL has failed to to develop this aircraft at all- not even when the Deepaks were KILLING their pilots. The IAF was forced to go for a fast track procurement of the PC-7 MK.2 and Pilatus did a commendable (and unappreciated) job in delivering them as fast as their production lines would allow. The IAF, rightly, simply wants to exercise that contract's follow-on clause for 150+ more PC-7s and Pilatus were willing to set up a production line in India but HAL has lobbied the MOD against it and the DM has, stupidly, played into their hands. So now the IAF is going to have 2 a/c for the basic training with all the extra costs that go with it and to top it all off HAL, even having known how much the IAF is paying for the PC-7, has quoted a price HIGHER than the IAF was prepared to pay. Is this taxpayer money well spent?

Politics should never get in the way of these decisions but the NDA has set several dangerous precedents.


@Dash @saurav @Star Wars

I agree with you they should concentrate on other more important technologies
 
I support HAL trainer..

Since India is likely to get this right than other advanced aircrafts ..
If we cannot make basic trainer right , how will we make AMCA ?

So were we have to make the transition , it's better we are doing it at trainer level..

Besides we have ordered pilatus , so for the time being it's ok.
So operationally it doesn't hinder..
Two types of basic trainer will waste some money, but in long run, it will save a lot.
Exports too


Another thing is when HTT 40 ready, IAF will assess both pilatus and HTT 40
And if one of the two can take up intermediate jet training , it will be promoted for that role..
 
What's the status of Sitars, is it on or the project has been dumped? I have googled it but getting conflicting news.
 
Utter stupidity. What other country has two different types of BTT for the exact same purpose? As always the IAF will get the blame for being petulant and wanting PHOREN male only but the reality is HAL has failed to to develop this aircraft at all- not even when the Deepaks were KILLING their pilots. The IAF was forced to go for a fast track procurement of the PC-7 MK.2 and Pilatus did a commendable (and unappreciated) job in delivering them as fast as their production lines would allow. The IAF, rightly, simply wants to exercise that contract's follow-on clause for 150+ more PC-7s and Pilatus were willing to set up a production line in India but HAL has lobbied the MOD against it and the DM has, stupidly, played into their hands. So now the IAF is going to have 2 a/c for the basic training with all the extra costs that go with it and to top it all off HAL, even having known how much the IAF is paying for the PC-7, has quoted a price HIGHER than the IAF was prepared to pay. Is this taxpayer money well spent?

Politics should never get in the way of these decisions but the NDA has set several dangerous precedents.


@Dash @saurav @Star Wars
Sir, just one question. How many Kiran basic trainers crashed and how many pilots died??????
Where you claim that trainers should be replaced pulling IAF lines. why IAF so eager to change basic trainer while they are still flying MIG21.....

I am not saying HAL isn't at fault, but if we really want to develop as a nation we can not keep on importing every thing.
Just food for thought.
 

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