Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi held meeting with COAS

[BHarwana]

A delegation level meeting was held between Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi and COAS Qamar Javed Bajwa

Details to follow.

 

[BHarwana]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1038450505142423554

https://twitter.com/x/status/1038452708934594560

 

[MBT 3000]

nice

 

[BHarwana]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1038454016672505862

 

[ARMalik]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1038450505142423554

https://twitter.com/x/status/1038452708934594560

The Chinese FM meeting COAS - interesting! Doesn't it feels as if after Pompeo's visit there is a bit of 'desperation' among the Chinese leaders? I don't know but for the Chinese FM to hastily come to Pakistan soon after Pompeo's visit actually shows that the Chinese are concerned about something or at least they are looking for "Re-assurances". Something might be cooking.

@BHarwana what do you think?

 

[BHarwana]

The Chinese FM meeting COAS - interesting! Doesn't it feels as if after Pompeo's visit there is a bit of 'desperation' among the Chinese leaders? I don't know but for the Chinese FM to hastily come to Pakistan soon after Pompeo's visit actually shows that the Chinese are concerned about something or at least they are looking for "Re-assurances". Something might be cooking.

@BHarwana what do you think?

Chinese Foreign Minister was invited to Pakistan by Pakistan. Yes the timing is noticeable and Chinese trip to Pakistan is related to US India meeting. It was to send a message to USA and India that Pakistan and China stand together.

This is my opinion.

 

[ARMalik]

Chinese Foreign Minister was invited to Pakistan by Pakistan. Yes the timing is noticeable and Chinese trip to Pakistan is related to US India meeting. It was to send a message to USA and India that Pakistan and China stand together.

This is my opinion.

I was thinking a little bit differently. I was thinking that US might have accepted Pakistan's demands and has offered Pakistan the core role in A-stan and Central Asia, whereas, it has asked India to concentrate on Pacific and East Indian Ocean only. In other words, Pakistan takes care of US interests in A-stan and Central Asia, whereas India concentrates on Pacific, Indian Oceans, etc.

If such an offer was made, it would definitely concern China, and hence the hasty visit of the Chinese FM. Of course the official story would always be that Pakistan invited the Chinese FM but in reality the Chinese asked for this visit.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

I was thinking a little bit differently. I was thinking that US might have accepted Pakistan's demands and has offered Pakistan the core role in A-stan and Central Asia, whereas, it has asked India to concentrate on Pacific and East Indian Ocean only. In other words, Pakistan takes care of US interests in A-stan and Central Asia, whereas India concentrates on Pacific, Indian Oceans, etc.

If such an offer was made, it would definitely concern China, and hence the hasty visit of the Chinese FM. Of course the official story would always be that Pakistan invited the Chinese FM but in reality the Chinese asked for this visit.

I have a related view ...

I suspect the US might secretly support Pakistan-Russian ties as it could, potentially, result in Pakistan becoming less amenable to China. The shakiness involving CPEC's role in Pakistan's ForEx decline plus Russia's apparent or potential willingness to invest and countertrade (thereby bumping our ForEx) could see an interesting dynamic.

However, the drawback of this 'hope' is that by looping in Russia, I think Pakistan becomes much more aware of what it means to be neutral and indifferent. In other words, we could develop the mindset of not seeing others as 'brothers' or whatever and become more like Russia and China in as far as pursuing raw interests.

In that case, Pakistan might double-down on China, but with a much sharper focus and push to exact concessions (as opposed to now where it sees any Chinese overture as charity).

 

[BHarwana]

I was thinking a little bit differently. I was thinking that US might have accepted Pakistan's demands and has offered Pakistan the core role in A-stan and Central Asia, whereas, it has asked India to concentrate on Pacific and East Indian Ocean only. In other words, Pakistan takes care of US interests in A-stan and Central Asia, whereas India concentrates on Pacific, Indian Oceans, etc.

If such an offer was made, it would definitely concern China, and hence the hasty visit of the Chinese FM. Of course the official story would always be that Pakistan invited the Chinese FM but in reality the Chinese asked for this visit.

Yes USA could offer Pakistan such a role but for this to happen there was no need for Pompeo to come and this message could have been delivered silently. Plus I would have seen restoration of aid to Pakistan but none of this is happening. USA gave a statement of India and USA jointly fighting terrorism as well. Now where will India fight terrorism? It is Afghanistan.
Imran Khan gave a very open speech that Pakistan is not going to fight any ones war.

First thing you need to tell me is what do you think USA wants in the region?

If USA wanted to give us any role what was Khalilzada doing with USA delegation? USA is bent on increasing Indian foot print in the region.

 

[ARMalik]

I have a related view ...

I suspect the US might secretly support Pakistan-Russian ties as it could, potentially, result in Pakistan becoming less amenable to China. The shakiness involving CPEC's role in Pakistan's ForEx decline plus Russia's apparent or potential willingness to invest and countertrade (thereby bumping our ForEx) could see an interesting dynamic.

However, the drawback of this 'hope' is that by looping in Russia, I think Pakistan becomes much more aware of what it means to be neutral and indifferent. In other words, we could develop the mindset of not seeing others as 'brothers' or whatever and become more like Russia and China in as far as pursuing raw interests.

In that case, Pakistan might double-down on China, but with a much sharper focus and push to exact concessions (as opposed to now where it sees any Chinese overture as charity).

Good points Bilal. There is a good chance of this taking place behind the scenes. US knows that it cannot directly tell Pakistan to back off from China cause Pakistan will not obliged. But if it creates conditions where China does not remain the ONLY strategic partner of Pakistan, then things could take an interesting turn.

Yes USA could offer Pakistan such a role but for this to happen there was no need for Pompeo to come and this message could have been delivered silently. Plus I would have seen restoration of aid to Pakistan but none of this is happening. USA gave a statement of India and USA jointly fighting terrorism as well. Now where will India fight terrorism? It is Afghanistan.
Imran Khan gave a very open speech that Pakistan is not going to fight any ones war.

First thing you need to tell me is what do you think USA wants in the region?

If USA wanted to give us any role what was Khalilzada doing with USA delegation? USA is bent on increasing Indian foot print in the region.

You are right but such visits, like that of Pompeo, are strategically "symbolic" cause these visits tend to create 'doubts' in the minds of key external stakeholders, example, China. Now to the the question of Khalilzada being here is nothing unusual. People like Khalilzada are tools used by important countries such as US to achieve objectives cause these people would know "old hands" in the Pakistan security and bureaucratic establishment and vice versa. Remember "Establishment" have people there who have been there for decades.

 

[BHarwana]

Good points Bilal. There is a good chance of this taking place behind the scenes. US knows that it cannot directly tell Pakistan to back off from China cause Pakistan will not obliged. But if it creates conditions where China does not remain the ONLY strategic partner of Pakistan, then things could take an interesting turn.



You are right but such visits, like that of Pompeo, are strategically "symbolic" cause these visits tend to create 'doubts' in the minds of key external stakeholders, example, China. Now to the the question of Khalilzada being here is nothing unusual. People like Khalilzada are tools used by important countries such as US to achieve objectives cause these people would know "old hands" in the Pakistan security and bureaucratic establishment and vice versa. Remember "Establishment" have people there who have been there for decades.

You are thinking the whole thing opposite. USA is not creating competition by moving in Russia. USA cannot throw China out of Pakistan there is a very good reason for that. Pakistan is heavily entrenched in China because of its economic needs.

Russia is coming into Pakistan not because of China or USA but because of Russia's own interest. USA has airlifted ISIS to Afghanistan and Russia considers it as a threat. Russia is buying its own influence into Pakistan. I agree with you that USA is trying to create a balance but until US core policy don't changes nothing will happen.

You are pointing at Pompeo visit wrong. The actual back door diplomacy is being done by Saudis on behalf of USA. Along with Chinese fm there a is a Saudi also visiting the country.

This now not about doing any ones bidding but it is all about national interests and Pakistani interests are colliding with US south Asia policy. The US deal with India just threw every thing out.

Pompeo met with COAS in presence of civil govt but here China met solo. So China has independent military relation with Pakistan and this is the thing that is hurting USA and India.

Pakistan cannot tolerate what USA is doing in India and this is hurting USA Pakistan relations more than anything.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1038420287283441667

@ARMalik USA has cut all aid to Pakistan to please India so that India can do their bidding against China.

Now USA don't want to lose Pakistan so they are planing to give aid using Saudis as their front. Pakistan want CSF to come from the hands of USA to piss off India and USA is stuck.

 

[ARMalik]

You are thinking the whole thing opposite. USA is not creating competition by moving in Russia. USA cannot throw China out of Pakistan there is a very good reason for that. Pakistan is heavily entrenched in China because of its economic needs.

Russia is coming into Pakistan not because of China or USA but because of Russia's own interest. USA has airlifted ISIS to Afghanistan and Russia considers it as a threat. Russia is buying its own influence into Pakistan. I agree with you that USA is trying to create a balance but until US core policy don't changes nothing will happen.

You are pointing at Pompeo visit wrong. The actual back door diplomacy is being done by Saudis on behalf of USA. Along with Chinese fm there a is a Saudi also visiting the country.

This now not about doing any ones bidding but it is all about national interests and Pakistani interests are colliding with US south Asia policy. The US deal with India just threw every thing out.

Pompeo met with COAS in presence of civil govt but here China met solo. So China has independent military relation with Pakistan and this is the thing that is hurting USA and India.

Pakistan cannot tolerate what USA is doing in India and this is hurting USA Pakistan relations more than anything.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1038420287283441667

@ARMalik USA has cut all aid to Pakistan to please India so that India can do their bidding against China.

Now USA don't want to lose Pakistan so they are planing to give aid using Saudis as their front. Pakistan want CSF to come from the hands of USA to piss off India and USA is stuck.

All valid points. But then there is another angle - the reason Chinese FM met COAS is cause on a number of occasions Pakistan Military has clearly said that it is the "Guarantor" of CPEC. The purpose of Chinese FM meeting COAS could also be that the FM is seeking "reassurance" from the COAS on CPEC.

Think about it - Why would a "Foreign Minister" meet an "Army chief"? It is not the role of COAS to entertain another's countries FM. That is not the job of a COAS. But it has happened. And to me it is clear that the Chinese FM is seeking "reassurance".

 

[BHarwana]

All valid points. But then there is another angle - the reason Chinese FM met COAS is cause on a number of occasions Pakistan Military has clearly said that it is the "Guarantor" of CPEC. The purpose of Chinese FM meeting COAS could also be that the FM is seeking "reassurance" from the COAS on CPEC.

Think about it - Why would a "Foreign Minister" meet an "Army chief"? It is not the role of COAS to entertain another's countries FM. That is not the job of a COAS. But it has happened. And to me it is clear that the Chinese FM is seeking "reassurance".

Your perception about the role of Chinese Foreign Minister is wrong. First understanding China is not a democracy and every high level official plays and speaks same language as president XI him self.
China just delivered Pakistan a ship along the arrival of their FM. FM meeting with COAS was not about CPEC. Yes army is the guarantor and the govt in place is on same length as army.

I don't know what they discussed in this close meeting but it definitely was military related.

 

[ARMalik]

Your perception about the role of Chinese Foreign Minister is wrong. First understanding China is not a democracy and every high level official plays and speaks same language as president XI him self.
China just delivered Pakistan a ship along the arrival of their FM. FM meeting with COAS was not about CPEC. Yes army is the guarantor and the govt in place is on same length as army.

I don't know what they discussed in this close meeting but it definitely was military related.

Mate, FM is an FM. Lets not change his role to something it is not. And lets not ignore the fact that it is not the role of COAS to meet a foreign FM and hold delegate level talks with him and his staff UNLESS something extraordinary has taken place. And it looks like something has happened forcing the Chinese FM to make this visit.

 

[BHarwana]

Mate, FM is an FM. Lets not change his role to something it is not. And lets not ignore the fact that it is not the role of COAS to meet a foreign FM and hold delegate level talks with him and his staff UNLESS something extraordinary has taken place. And it looks like something has happened forcing the Chinese FM to make this visit.

Yes some thing is taking place. It is not Chinese FM but other officials along his as well and on Pakistani side as well. I can see ISI chief there as well.

The official statement says bilateral relation. Regional security and military relations.

Chinese FM was not forced he was invited by us I can assure you this 100%.