China’s Schoolchildren Are Now the Smartest in the World

[Foggy_Bottom]

These tests are done in respective countries and when it comes to China they've been known to cheat the get the top ranking for the longest.

China “Cheats” the PISA Exams
Are The PISA Education Results Rigged?
We Need to Stop Letting China Cheat on International Education Rankings

 

[Mista]

These tests are done in respective countries and when it comes to China they've been known to cheat the get the top ranking for the longest.

China “Cheats” the PISA Exams
Are The PISA Education Results Rigged?
We Need to Stop Letting China Cheat on International Education Rankings

I wouldn't say cheat, but there's indeed selective bias in many countries, not just China.

https://ffteducationdatalab.org.uk/...of-international-rankings-is-such-a-bad-idea/

 

[Foggy_Bottom]

I wouldn't say cheat, but there's indeed selective bias in many countries, not just China.

https://ffteducationdatalab.org.uk/...of-international-rankings-is-such-a-bad-idea/

It's so trivial minded and just weird why they think it's important to fake stuff like this.

 

[serenity]

Wow China cheats is actually really just China selecting Shanghai region to represent in the PISA test. This is not the same as cheating in providing students with answers. Can be called inaccurate representation. But far away from cheating. This article clearly shows western reporting word choice bias.

So this was in 2012 and when China earlier started joining these tests. Now they include many regions not just Shanghai and 2018 results still top. Next time Americans will say China cheats because our kids study harder. So petty minded to call inaccurate representation cheating. Now Beijing Jiangsu and Shanghai are represented. It's already a bigger number of test takers than USA. You want every single kid in China to take the test before you can call it not cheating. Hahaha this truly is something that doesn't matter since they are all children. Future performance is not measured at age 15. If people truly didn't care, they won't call China a cheater for choosing not to administer the exam to every single 15 year old in China.

 

[Foggy_Bottom]

Wow China cheats is actually really just China selecting Shanghai region to represent in the PISA test. This is not the same as cheating in providing students with answers. Can be called inaccurate representation. But far away from cheating. This article clearly shows western reporting word choice bias.

So this was in 2012 and when China earlier started joining these tests. Now they include many regions not just Shanghai and 2018 results still top. Next time Americans will say China cheats because our kids study harder. So petty minded to call inaccurate representation cheating. Now Beijing Jiangsu and Shanghai are represented. It's already a bigger number of test takers than USA. You want every single kid in China to take the test before you can call it not cheating. Hahaha this truly is something that doesn't matter since they are all children. Future performance is not measured at age 15. If people truly didn't care, they won't call China a cheater for choosing not to administer the exam to every single 15 year old in China.

Yes, gaming the system is cheating the system. Always taking the shortcut like that Chinese orienteering team disqualified at World Military Games for cheating

 

[serenity]

Yes, gaming the system is cheating the system. Always taking the shortcut like that Chinese orienteering team disqualified at World Military Games for cheating

That's real cheating. Choosing Shanghai to test the students is not cheating. very country will have to choose some kids to test. Most may choose a spread out random distribution but China choose Shanghai for earlier rounds. They have their purpose, you just assume the top ranking means anything. I assume they choose Shanghai back in 2012 because they want to first figure out how the Chinese wealthiest city perform compared to rest of the world. Then introduce new variables. Also much easier to administer because Shanghai region's infrastructure is more developed than countryside. Sure they could have picked any other big city but after 2012, they have introduced new variables. I think the purpose was not to just score the highest, but to figure out if there is credit to Shanghai system compared to rest of world and then see if other cities match.

 

[Mista]

I assume they choose Shanghai back in 2012 because they want to first figure out how the Chinese wealthiest city perform compared to rest of the world.

I think the purpose was not to just score the highest, but to figure out if there is credit to Shanghai system compared to rest of world and then see if other cities match.

Actually other Chinese provinces took part in the tests too, but the Chinese government only allowed the release of Shanghai's score back then.

China has an unusual arrangement with the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD), the organization responsible for PISA. Other provinces took the 2009 PISA test, but the Chinese government only allowed the release of Shanghai’s scores. The Financial Times quotes Andreas Schleicher, one of the OECD officials responsible for PISA, as saying, “We have actually done PISA in 12 of the provinces in China. Even in some of the very poor areas you get performance close to the OECD average.”

https://www.brookings.edu/research/pisas-china-problem/

I'm not sure what's the arrangement now, but they replaced Guangdong province in 2015 with Zhejiang province in 2018.

IMO it should be expanded and not replaced, but I guess because of the international media's attention on such tests PISA now is sort of a dick-measuring contest between countries.

 

[beijingwalker]

The U.S. team tied for first place with China at the 60th International Mathematical Olympiad (IMO)
July 19, 2019
This is an American team or Chinese team....

https://www.cmu.edu/news/stories/archives/2019/july/us-first-in-math-competiton.html

Team China

Team USA

Team Canada

Team Australia

 

[Mista]

because of the international media's attention on such tests PISA now is sort of a dick-measuring contest between countries.

Oh look where this thread is going like I said.

 

[Kai Liu]

Yes, gaming the system is cheating the system. Always taking the shortcut like that Chinese orienteering team disqualified at World Military Games for cheating

Just pick Shanghai??? You are free to choose students from whatever part of China...This PISA test is piece of pizza You can also check the GRE quant score or the SAT test score to see how average Chinese performs. For Chinese students, not just PISA, but all these kind of tests are nothing... While the Gaokao is the real hardcore battle, especially for student in provinces such as Hubei, Hunan, Jiangsu, Zhejiang, Hebei, Shangdong, Jiangxi, Anhui, Henan, etc. etc... These provinces have the highest percentage of high scores in Gaokao...
I am trying to be modest and not to be racist here, but I can't:
Chinese students' academic excellence comes from both inborn talent and hard working:
for the inborn part, it is just like the athletic ability of Africans:

While for the hard working part, this is a typical day of Chinese high-school students, which you party school kids can't even withstand a day...

This kind of exam question very frequently appear in Gaokao, while you people consider it as rocket science:

I don't think you party school kid can even get enough score to be admitted into a vocational school (forget about a college) in any part of China, if you have to take the Gaokao...

And check this guy's group picture or you can go to any professor's group websites to see who are the real brain power for those scientific achievements...

In case you party school kid don't know who is this guy, google 'John B. Goodenough'...

 

[beijingwalker]

In Beijing we have a stereotype that students from rural regions are better students, cause they are way more hardworking and they know the only way for them to succeed is studying hard, while kids in big cities are lazy and spoiled who are more interested in playing games than studying.

 

[GS Zhou]

Seriously, when talking about maths or science, the kids from Shanghai are performing much poorer than the kids from other inner-land Chinese provinces, like Hunan, Hubei, Henan, or Sichuan. That's because the university enrollment chances in these provinces are much lower than Shanghai, so kids from there have to study harder, that's the only way to be successful.

I'm saying that because I'm from Shanghai.

 

[somsak]

I think new type of education needed for Creativity.
If you look at Youtube, there are a lot of Creative invention, which is valuable.
I saw many interesting garage built jet engines, IC fabrication, etc.
However, Asian students in general lacks this expertise.

 

[Mista]

I think new type of education needed for Creativity.

You can't teach creativity. However you can leave room for creativity by de-emphasising on standardised tests. The key is how do you do it without compromising academic rigor.

It's a balance which Singapore's education reform for the past few years is trying to achieve, and I think it's still a work in progress. It's the culture which is hard to reform, Asian parents still very much emphasis on test scores even though the government is trying to blur the lines.

 

[Manidabest]

Chinese is a hard working nation