China Space Military：Recon, Satcom, Navi, ASAT/BMD, Orbital Vehicle, SLV, etc.

[Muhammad Omar]

Isn't that old news???

I think this is the Radar JY-26 Phased Array Radar

 

[Tiqiu]

Is this supposed to be news？

No, it is not for us

American said F-22 cannot be detect, but Chinese said it can. Now American said it can, does it mean American has been lying all along about F-22 capability?

Isn't that old news???

I think this is the Radar JY-26 Phased Array Radar

500 km range

 

[gambit]

Detecting a stealth fighter was never an issue,...

Yes, it is.

...Serbia brought down one in 1999.

Yes, just one. Out of hundreds of sorties. And it was by sheer luck.

Any longer wavelength radar can do that, but they lack the resolution to target one specifically. It will be news if China can do that.

If it is news that China can successfully use low freqs to track and target low observable US fighters, then 'stealth' is an issue.

 

[gambit]

American said F-22 cannot be detect,...

We never said so.

...but Chinese said it can.

Of course Chinese would. What else are they going to say ?

Now American said it can, does it mean American has been lying all along about F-22 capability?

No, it means you guys have a reading comprehension problem.

 

[Globenim]

Chinese say the can detect F-22.

Chinese said they detected some F-22.
American state lipservice aka "free press" claims to cite "Chinese claims" and make hype about Chinese radars "apparently" being able to detect F-22 even in a stealthy setup.

Wait for the Americans to debunk "it" claiming they where flying with RCS enhancer so everyone could have detected it and put the "Chinese hype" to "shame" and American cheerleaders starting the usual verbal masturbation how the "Chinese cheerleaders" are blind to "Chinese propaganda"

 

[Genesis]

Detection is not the same as IDENTIFICATION.

You know your mother, no ? Actually, you can only know her after you IDENTIFY her. An identity is a visual representation that is associated with something else.

In the near dark, you can detect -- with your eyes -- the outline of a human body, but how do you know that is your mother ? You do not. You can only IDENTIFY that human as your mother only after you associate her facial features with what you know of her in your memory.

So for China to declare that the PLA detected the F-22 is simply absurd. The radar scope cannot even display the outline of a body, let alone the body that is unique to the F-22.

The PLA detected 'something'. That 'something' is all there was. But of course that 'something' had to be exaggerated into the F-22.

I heard WW2 radars can detect birds. I'm assuming Chinese radars today can detect any number of things. So on that day the people there just decided today's a good day to say we detected a F-22.

I know you don't think much of the PLA, but at least assume they are not the most uneducated and unprofessional bunch in the world, if nothing else at least trust the US' ability to judge the validity of the information.

This is that space walk "hoax" all over again. Everyone's looking to make fun of the other, would China really release this information just to look stupid.

 

[j20blackdragon]

Since, the aircraft shaping is fixed.
The Battle of Stealth is the battle of ( Stealth Coating + Radar )

It seems the newly developed LockMart stealth coating applied to these F-22 who just flew to Japan is useless against PLA radar.
The LockMart previous Stealth coating used by the F-22 on the January 2015 on Chinese Lunar New Year were useless against PLA radar as well.
It means USAF F-22 vs PLAAF Radar = 0 vs 2

More specifically, it's a battle between fixed airframe shaping and RAM vs Moore's law. It's the processing/computational power behind the radar that matters. As computational power improves, the radar system's ability to glean coherent information from a jumble of data also improves. Faint radar returns that once would have been misconstrued as random background noise can now be detected and identified as the F-22.

Powerful radars have always existed. The Soviet MiG-25 radar was said to be so powerful that when they turned the radar on at the ground, small animals would drop dead and cook for a great distance in front of the aircraft. But what the Soviets lacked back then (and Russia today) was good processors. The F-22 was always marketed back in the day as having the power of two Cray supercomputers in every cockpit. Those 'supercomputers' pale in comparison with what China has today.

 

[Tiqiu]

On the CCTV( China state TV) "Today's Focus" program at Sat, the Chinese PLA general Yin Zhuo officially confirmed that after F22 was detected and identified by radar, it was followed by the Chinese jet for evidence obtaining. He didn't detail how many F22/Chinese jet and the exact location. I guess more details and pictures, or even videos will be surfaced soon.

Is it "The Emperor's New Clothes" retold?

 

[Tiqiu]

PLA Active Duty General on China State TV (from 01:32): "F22 was detected, approached,accompanied, warned and being photographed(obtaining evidence) by Chinese jet..."

少将：F-22闯东海被发现 中国战机直接伴飞警告_凤凰军事

Yin Zhuo, PLA active duty general

 

[Tiqiu]

 

[gambit]

I heard WW2 radars can detect birds.

How do you know they are birds ? I do not mean YOU personally. I mean -- you -- the radar operator ?

The problem here is more than just semantics. If a radar target exhibits some behaviors, as much as the radar signals can tell, then the only thing you -- the radar operator -- can do is GUESS that the target is a flock of birds. Most of the time, the guesses are correct.

But there are times when...

https://www.ll.mit.edu/mission/avia...-papers/Troxel_2001_BSC_MS-14800_WW-16341.pdf

Thunderstorm gust fronts can produce low-altitude reflectivity thin line echoes that could be mistaken for birds.

Who would have thought that the leading edges of wind gusts were mis-identified by the radar operator and/or computer for birds.

Further...Insects, birds, leaves, or rain drops are called 'volumetric targets', meaning individual bug, bird, leaf or rain drop are usually not detected. In radar detection, a 'volumetric target' is a TYPE of target data. It mean there must be a group of insects, of birds, or of leaves, in order for the radar to pick up this volumetric mass. If a single bird separate from the group, that bird is not detected.

Now...Just in case you think I am making this stuff up...

NASA - Bird Rest Stops To Be Tracked by NASA Rain Radar

It is used to make accurate volumetric measurements...

See the word 'volumetric' ? And the source is impeccable.

So no, radars cannot detect AND identify the target as anything. The radar computer can only make an educated guess based upon signal processing. The more complex the return signals, the better the guess.

I'm assuming Chinese radars today can detect any number of things. So on that day the people there just decided today's a good day to say we detected a F-22.

They can 'decide' that they detected anything they want.

I know you don't think much of the PLA,...

On the contrary, I have a great deal of respect for the PLA. More than you guys do, even if you guys are Chinese and I am not. But unlike you guys, my respect is not blind. It is based upon my personal experience in the US military and my personal studies of military affairs. Blind respect is the worst one can give or receive.

 

[BoQ77]

 

[JSCh]

Assembly of CZ-7 (Long March 7)

 

[BoQ77]

Gaofeng-4 satellite

Gaofen 4’s staring imager can spot objects as small as 50 meters (164 feet), a resolution that allows the satellite to see an oil tanker steaming across the ocean, according to Li Guo, Gaofen 4’s chief designer, in a story published by Xinhua.
The state-run China Youth Daily newspaper reported earlier this year the Gaofen 4 satellite’s purpose is also to hunt for U.S. aircraft carriers operating near China.
At night, an infrared camera aboard Gaofen 4 can capture less detailed imagery with a resolution of about 400 meters, or 1,300 feet.

resolution 50m means, if there's an object 50x50m with enough contrast from environment, For example a fire of 50mx50m, if luckily GF-4 could record as a pixel in its imager.

Why need luck? because there're cloud cover, precipitates , electronic noises ...

 

[Tiqiu]