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China missile hit highest suborbital level since 1976:

I know you guys are desperate to one-up everybody and anybody, especially when none of you have relevant experience in any of the fields in the many subjects discussed in this forum. So the only way for you to do so is to grasp at any opportunity to focus on the details, especially when they are inappropriate, to play 'gotcha'.

you are doing the same thing all the while on board! Now you are humbled a bit!

You guys' mistake here is in thinking that Medium Earth Orbit (MEO) is a fixed altitude. It is not. It has a range. Here is a more accurate illustration...

orbit_class_zps798f3f3d.jpg


In terms of altitude, a geosynchronous orbit have the same altitude as a geostationary orbit.

Medium Earth Orbit (MEO) begins at 480km and stretches all the way up to 35,800km. No one with any bit of common sense and technical education is going to place a satellite at 500km altitude in the same category as one at 36,000km altitude even though technically speaking, both satellites are in MEO. To match that wide range of altitude, the orbital periods of MEO satellites ranges from 2 to 12 hrs. At the upper range of this scale, which is where GPS satellites are located (22,300km), satellites are moved into the classification of 'semi-'. You do know what the word 'semi-' imply, no?

But if you do want to get into the details, I will oblige and will dissect the relevant post...

That has nothing to do with the geostationary or geosynchronous orbit but about altitude, as if somehow the US back in the 1980s made a serious error in placing the GPS constellation at 22,300km altitude and as if somehow China gained the upper hand today by placing the Baidu navigation satellite at a higher altitude. You guys seems to do not know that the US have placed geostationary and geosynchronous satellites before China entered the space race. The first was Syncom 3 in 1964. Your error in logical thinking here is that if China does something different, it must be better.

You guys seems to believe that an anti-satellite weapon is a technically restricted constructed device when it is not. An anti-satellite satellite is just another satellite with a different purpose. We can reassign a weather satellite's mission from gathering cloud info into collision with another weather satellite if we wanted to. There -- we just made an ASAT satellite.

How we place an ASAT satellite in a geostat/geosync orbit is no different than how we would place a communication satellite in its geostat/geosync orbit.

orbit_transfer_zps4300d289.jpg


If we can place Syncom 3 into a geostat orbit back in 1964, we can certainly place an ASAT satellite into the same altitude today. If anything, Baidu being in a geostat orbit make it easier to target because the satellite's location is constant. Not merely predictable. But actually constant. So look at the illustration above and see how Baidu can be targeted by an ASAT satellite. The Baidu satellite cannot maneuver, not because it cannot technically maneuver, but that if it maneuver to avoid the ASAT satellite, China will lose satellite assisted navigation coverage.

Here is Baidu's limited coverage...

File:Beidou-coverage.png - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Do you guys know why Baidu 1 is geostationary? It have little to do with technical achievement. It is old news for US. Because a geostationary location is essentially fixed over an equatorial country, there is a tacit understanding among space-competent countries that a geostationary orbital location should be reserved for that country. That is understanding, not law.

CelesTrak: "Basics of the Geostationary Orbit"


Who Owns the Geostationary Orbit?


No country like to have another country's satellite in a geostationary orbit to observe 24/7/365. If an American spy satellite passes over Soviet territory, its passage is temporary and therefore tolerable. But if Russia is at the equator and the US had placed our own geostat spy satellite over Soviet territory, it would not exist for long. The Kremlin would have cancelled all kinds of projects and diverted those money to ensure the American spy satellite's destruction. On the other hand, if the US placed a geostationary spy satellite over Viet Nam, an equatorial country, there would be nothing the Viets could do but protest. It would be rude on the American behavior, but nothing the Viets could do. Even worse, what if that geostationary satellite is a nuclear weapon?

So there is nothing technically spectacular about Baidu's satellites being geostationary.

There are many technical and operational advantages to putting the GPS constellation where it is: at 22,300km altitude.

Foremost is overall system survivability and precision. If we are certain that satellites are perfectly constructed and that we do not have enemies, we would have placed the constellation at the geostat orbit over different geographical locations on Earth, providing 100% surface coverage with perfect signal integrity. But that is not possible. Satellites do fail. Signals do have propagation losses. So the US decided to place the GPS constellation where the combination of signal propagation losses and surface coverage is best: 22,300km altitude. You guys really thing we placed the GPS constellation at that altitude because our orbital science can reach only that high? :lol:

With a constellation, individual satellites produces diverse Doppler, range, and elevation angles and the receiver is forced to perform multiple calculations in order to ascertain position but multiple correlative factors are always desirable, especially if the receiver is mobile. Also because the constellation is at a semi geostat/geosync altitude where signal propagation losses are more tolerable, receiver antenna set can be made smaller, making the receiver more mobile and less costly to produce. This architecture worked so well that Baidu 2 essentially copied the American GPS. Baidu 1 satellites at geostat/geosync altitude uses directional transmit antennas. Baidu 2 satellites at the lower but semi geostat/geosync altitude will have omnidirectional transmit antennas, just like the American GPS design.

Its a long post Let us spend time reading it after our family gathering over the weekend It is not a top priority


So did you guys really do a 'gotcha' on me anywhere? Nope. All you guys did was proved -- again -- that your nationalistic zeal and eagerness overrode your common sense to do basic research.

You are just sad and stuboorn Never admit your own mistakes when confronted with blantant blunders!
 
gambit BLUNDER no. 2

you said:



And I replied




In either case - by altitude or by coverage - you lose
you are OWNED AGAIN! and all together in Multiple times now!
YOU brought up coverage and it has nothing to do with the subject. You brought up coverage to say something hegemony as if because the US wanted hegemony we created the GPS constellation. The truth is technical as I already explained.

I said if you accused us of "copying" then sue us. When we havent received anything legal from you that means you dont have any case in summary against us.

You are just admitting our tech is different from yours - Your outright confirmation of our achievements!
This has nothing to do with law, buddy. :lol:

You criticized the US military performance in Afghanistan and Iraq, so I asked that if the US military is so sh1tty, then why is the PLA copying US? That was not bring out any kind of legal debate but about why is the PLA emulating the US military, from helmets for infantry to helmet for carrier deckhands, if the US military is sooooo bad.

You are just sad and stuboorn Never admit your own mistakes when confronted with blantant blunders!
In other words, the word 'semi-' escaped you.
 
chinese won
stop discussion

YOU brought up coverage and it has nothing to do with the subject. You brought up coverage to say something hegemony as if because the US wanted hegemony we created the GPS constellation. The truth is technical as I already explained.


This has nothing to do with law, buddy. :lol:

You criticized the US military performance in Afghanistan and Iraq, so I asked that if the US military is so sh1tty, then why is the PLA copying US? That was not bring out any kind of legal debate but about why is the PLA emulating the US military, from helmets for infantry to helmet for carrier deckhands, if the US military is sooooo bad.


In other words, the word 'semi-' escaped you.

chinese won
stop discussion
 
YOU brought up coverage and it has nothing to do with the subject. You brought up coverage
to say something hegemony as if because the US wanted hegemony we created the GPS constellation. The truth is technical as I already explained.

yes you want hegemony the evidence of which is your thousands of military outposts in world

This has nothing to do with law, buddy. :lol:

of course it does

You criticized the US military performance in Afghanistan and Iraq, so I asked that if the US military is so sh1tty, then why is the PLA copying US? That was not bring out any kind of legal debate but about why is the PLA emulating the US military, from helmets for infantry to helmet for carrier deckhands, if the US military is sooooo bad.

it is always you and incapable cheerleading indians who cr@ap our weapons. again if you say we are infriinging copy rights - sue us!

You are obsessed with our copying. If your crying and whinging about these for ages why cant you defend well of your own stuff avoiding any copying attempts - your massive failures for:
1. not being able to defend yourselves -2. cannot instituting anything against us of your crazy allegations


In other words, the word 'semi-' escaped you.

PLA is a lot better than you think

You never have won a major war since WW2 - FACT!
 
yes you want hegemony the evidence of which is your thousands of military outposts in world
This is about GPS satellite constellation, of which I explained briefly on why there is a need for a constellation instead of being restricted to geostationary orbit. Baidu 2 is going that path. Or are you denying that fact?

of course it does



it is always you and incapable cheerleading indians who cr@ap our weapons. again if you say we are infriinging copy rights - sue us!

You are obsessed with our copying. If your crying and whinging about these for ages why cant you defend well of your own stuff avoiding any copying attempts - your massive failures for:
1. not being able to defend yourselves -2. cannot instituting anything against us of your crazy allegations
No, it does not. And it does not because I never made a point about it. The word 'copy' is not restricted to the legal arena. So once again, if the US military is so sh1tty, then why is the PLA copying US?

PLA is a lot better than you think

You never have won a major war since WW2 - FACT!
Then why is the PLA copying US? :lol:
 
This is about GPS satellite constellation, of which I explained briefly on why there is a need for a constellation instead of being restricted to geostationary orbit. Baidu 2 is going that path. Or are you denying that fact?


No, it does not. And it does not because I never made a point about it. The word 'copy' is not restricted to the legal arena. So once again, if the US military is so sh1tty, then why is the PLA copying US?


Then why is the PLA copying US? :lol:

Isnt that obvious? They learn best practices from US . Call it selective learning. That is hardly a chinese thing.
 
This is about GPS satellite constellation, of which I explained briefly on why there is a need for a constellation instead of being restricted to geostationary orbit. Baidu 2 is going that path. Or are you denying that fact

Orbital altitudes are the wishes of the operators. I have never denied that


No, it does not. And it does not because I never made a point about it. The word 'copy' is not restricted to the legal arena. So once again, if the US military is so sh1tty, then why is the PLA copying US?

that is your side of crying and whinging into the next millenium. My points have been stated.

Then why is the PLA copying US? :lol:

You cant prove it then shut up! One thing to brighen you up: if we copy it from the usa, then you should know all of our parameters. Why should we hand over ourselves to you on a plate?

Isnt that obvious? They learn best practices from US . Call it selective learning. That is hardly a chinese thing.

Outsiders/novices/cheerleaders look at usa as the dreamland.
We look at it from our angle and we run our own system
 
Orbital altitudes are the wishes of the operators. I have never denied that
So what happened to all that glee about me and my 'blunders'? :lol: When it comes down to it, you guys do not have the brains to handle the technical details, whether they are consequential or parallel, in any engineering endeavor. Simple and casual language is the best you guys can do and I got no problems admitting that I have used such in order to deal with the Chinese members here.

that is your side of crying and whinging into the next millenium. My points have been stated.
No one is 'crying and whining'. We are mocking you and your arguments. Smarter people than you Chinese members here sees through your cheap insults that the US military 'failed' in Afghanistan and Iraq.

You cant prove it then shut up! One thing to brighen you up: if we copy it from the usa, then you should know all of our parameters. Why should we hand over ourselves to you on a plate?
Sure I can. Look at the Chinese sailors on the Chinese aircraft carrier. Have 'US Navy' all over, buddy... :lol:

And yes, since the PLA copied so much from US, that mean we have a pretty good idea on how the PLA will perform in a war.

Outsiders/novices/cheerleaders look at usa as the dreamland.
We look at it from our angle and we run our own system
Meaningless...
 
So what happened to all that glee about me and my 'blunders'? :lol: When it comes down to it, you guys do not have the brains to handle the technical details, whether they are consequential or parallel, in any engineering endeavor. Simple and casual language is the best you guys can do and I got no problems admitting that I have used such in order to deal with the Chinese members here.

it only certifies you are surrendering to the arguments
there is no glee just sad at some keyboard vets who spend their time arguing in vain with their own nonsense on the net - one failures after another, sunken to the bottom but still want to stick their heads out for the last breathe


No one is 'crying and whining'. We are mocking you and your arguments. Smarter people than you Chinese members here sees through your cheap insults that the US military 'failed' in Afghanistan and Iraq.
there is no cheap insult but expensive failure on the part of us militaries - the trauma of failure of one war after another


Sure I can. Look at the Chinese sailors on the Chinese aircraft carrier. Have 'US Navy' all over, buddy... :lol:
Bring on your CVNs, the more the better for expansion of under water coral habitats for fishes
at last you are doing some good things to the world with our help

And yes, since the PLA copied so much from US, that mean we have a pretty good idea on how the PLA will perform in a war.

then practise shooting at yourselves, just paint them red so you have many immediate enemies
a good way to build up your shattered confidence and lets see how long can that holds

Meaningless...

are you smoking chillum with audio?

I was not replying to you
 
it only certifies you are surrendering to the arguments
there is no glee just sad at some keyboard vets who spend their time arguing in vain with their own nonsense on the net - one failures after another, sunken to the bottom but still want to stick their heads out for the last breathe
Then what are YOU, conscript reject?

there is no cheap insult but expensive failure on the part of us militaries - the trauma of failure of one war after another
Then why is the PLA copying US?

Bring on your CVNs, the more the better for expansion of under water coral habitats for fishes
at last you are doing some good things to the world with our help
That would be the PLAN's new aircraft carrier. Copying the USN is one thing, real combat naval experience is another. But of course, losses do count in the combat experience ledger so once the PLAN's aircraft carriers did contributed to preserving marine life, you can rest easy knowing that the PLAN do have combat experience.

then practise shooting at yourselves, just paint them red so you have many immediate enemies
a good way to build up your shattered confidence and lets see how long can that holds
Shattered confidence? :lol: That would be the PLA's leadership after their prediction about US in Desert Storm. Again, why is the PLA copying the US military, one with 'shattered confidence'? Your 50-cent army shift stupor-visor must be running out of scripts for you.

are you smoking chillum with audio?

I was not replying to you
Do not care. If it is meaningless, it should be pointed out.
 
Then what are YOU, conscript reject?

you are a sad fellow. copying and paste all the seemingly relevant materials fooling around about GEO/MEO/LEO etc and post them here pretending you are very knowlegeable and then use the internet material to blame us for "mistakes" in which we have not made a relevant comment on your "attack".

I am what I am. If I want to join the PLA, I will be a high ranking officer


Then why is the PLA copying US?

you remind me of an old neighbour who asked me three times in a day, morning noon and night if I ate my breakfast
You have broken his records, congrats!!!

That would be the PLAN's new aircraft carrier. Copying the USN is one thing, real combat naval experience is another. But of course, losses do count in the combat experience ledger so once the PLAN's aircraft carriers did contributed to preserving marine life, you can rest easy knowing that the PLAN do have combat experience.

I want to have a look at our new aircraft carrier. Post it here if you have one!
No we dont have aircraft carrier combat experience. Can you share your losers' experience with us of how to avoid defeat in your wars and battles?

Shattered confidence? :lol: That would be the PLA's leadership after their prediction about US in Desert Storm. Again, why is the PLA copying the US military, one with 'shattered confidence'? Your 50-cent army shift stupor-visor must be running out of scripts for you.

again prediction are way of the past you are repeating again and again " copying" as if you have planted a chip inside of your cranial area that is etched with the word

How many ptsd centers are there in usa? how many poor us gis are committing suicide every day? RIPs!

Do not care. If it is meaningless, it should be pointed out.

none of your business in the dialogue. Shut up!
 
you are a sad fellow. copying and paste all the seemingly relevant materials fooling around about GEO/MEO/LEO etc and post them here pretending you are very knowlegeable and then use the internet material to blame us for "mistakes" in which we have not made a relevant comment on your "attack".

I am what I am. If I want to join the PLA, I will be a high ranking officer




you remind me of an old neighbour who asked me three times in a day, morning noon and night if I ate my breakfast
You have broken his records, congrats!!!



I want to have a look at our new aircraft carrier. Post it here if you have one!
No we dont have aircraft carrier combat experience. Can you share your losers' experience with us of how to avoid defeat in your wars and battles?



again prediction are way of the past you are repeating again and again " copying" as if you have planted a chip inside of your cranial area that is etched with the word

How many ptsd centers are there in usa? how many poor us gis are committing suicide every day? RIPs!



none of your business in the dialogue. Shut up!


Calm down, Bro.

He is a high school drop out. Since he said EM wave behaving similar to mechanic waves (air or water) I have learnt to save energy by just letting the fool running amuck...
 
Calm down, Bro.

He is a high school drop out. Since he said EM wave behaving similar to mechanic waves (air or water) I have learnt to save energy by just letting the fool running amuck...
The science and engineering communities are still waiting for YOUR thesis that the 10-lambda rule regarding the creeping wave behavior violate Born Approximation and therefore inappropriate for 'stealth' shaping.

Those communities include these Chinese engineers...

radar_creeping_wave_yan-xu.jpg


Please give us links to your submission as well as to rebuttals, no matter how polite or impolite on whatever 'Chinese physics' you presented.
 
you are a sad fellow. copying and paste all the seemingly relevant materials fooling around about GEO/MEO/LEO etc and post them here pretending you are very knowlegeable and then use the internet material to blame us for "mistakes" in which we have not made a relevant comment on your "attack".

I am what I am. If I want to join the PLA, I will be a high ranking officer
Yeah, right...:lol:...If you are that certain, then the US military have nothing to worry about.

you remind me of an old neighbour who asked me three times in a day, morning noon and night if I ate my breakfast
You have broken his records, congrats!!!
The difference here is that you know what you ate for breakfast while you know nothing about military issues, of which you admitted you know nothing.

So again: If the US military is so sh1tty, why is the PLA copying US?

I want to have a look at our new aircraft carrier. Post it here if you have one!
No we dont have aircraft carrier combat experience. Can you share your losers' experience with us of how to avoid defeat in your wars and battles?
The only way to share experience is to actually get into a situation that will result in said experience. In other words, war and combat experience cannot be shared, they can only be experienced together. So petition your PLA to get into a fight with US and you will know what is it like to lose. :lol:

again prediction are way of the past you are repeating again and again " copying" as if you have planted a chip inside of your cranial area that is etched with the word

How many ptsd centers are there in usa? how many poor us gis are committing suicide every day? RIPs!
We can only wonder how many PLA generals suffered PTSD for fear of execution after their failed predictions about US in Desert Storm.

none of your business in the dialogue. Shut up!
This is an open forum. Whatever you post is everyone's business. Do not like it? Shut up.
 
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