China Has Most New Billionaires in Forbes 2016 List

[vtnsx]

Nice to know you are actually a Chinese. They said you were Vietnamese, Mexican, or what ever. When was the last time you visit China?

Just imagine you have to use that $106K, though about average in the states, to support a family of 4. So the quality of life is a question,

Sorry, I guess I am lost in the discussion. Are we talking about family net worth or living standard? When I was talking about $80K, I was referring to average family net worth in Chinese cities, which covers about 50% Chinese population. It is not their annual income, which shold be much lower than that considering their GDP per capital is only about 8K. My point is Chinese are not as poor we in the states think they are, and average Americans are not that much better off. Just look how Chinese outbound tourists spent money (120 million of them last year), we know China has lots of rich people. By the way, they spent much more in average in Japan than American tourists to Japan.

If you make 80k a year in China, you are fkn rich! what are you guys even arguing about

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

Are you alone in the US? Your family does not have properties in the US? Or there are no one you can rely on in the US? Having family properties would basically save you up more than half your expenditure. I used to live with my family in the US, I don't need to pay rent, I don't need to pay for groceries, that's why if I earn way below par, I still lead a good life. I earn about 50,000 USD per year with the US Army, the only expense is 12,000 a year to my mum back in 2004/2005. After Tax and other small expenditure, I have about 20,000 USD saved up every year. (I got around 34,000 USD after tax)

Then I move to England for 2 years, I earn about 70,000 GBP a year working in private sector (About 106,000 USD). Well above what the average British Earn, then I need to pay rent which is about 300 quid per week in greater London (That's 18000 GBP there), and then food and transport cost me another ~100 pounds per week, that's 6,000 a year, and then you have all sort of expense, such as medical insurance. Home insurance (which I don't need to pay before), council bill, water, electric, phone, internet etc. That's another 5,000 a year. After tax, I got about 45,000 GBP left, after lodging, I got about 27,000 GBP left, and after weekly expenses, I got about 12,000 GBP left. Which is about 16,000 USD. Even tho I earn 2.5 times more then before, I have less money saved up....My colleague, earn a bit less than me, drive an Aston Martin...... I drove a Honda Civic....

And by the way, my family have a 3 story house in Dongguan, and I used to live there when I was a kid and studying middle school in Shenzhen

Disposable income and housing is always a wrench in calculations. If the government had a campaign that encouraged people to stay at home and live with their parents disposable income would shoot up. That $5000 in one month wouldn't be as much of an issue.

Of course you will pay a little more in taxes since you have less expense write-offs. Hmm...what an interesting way for the government to raise some money.

 

[Dungeness]

Disposable income and housing is always a wrench in calculations. If the government had a campaign that encouraged people to stay at home and live with their parents disposable income would shoot up. That $5000 in one month wouldn't be as much of an issue.

Of course you will pay a little more in taxes since you have less expense write-offs. Hmm...what an interesting way for the government to raise some money.

Disposable income, that is it! People I am talking about in the US and in China are comparable in their social economical status, but most Americans have 30-year mortgages and car loans, and most Chinese own their condos and cars free and clean. That is why they seem to have more money to spend on things that are not necessities.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

Disposable income, that is it! People I am talking about in the US and in China are comparable in their social economical status, but most Americans have 30-year mortgages and car loans, and most Chinese own their condos and cars free and clean. That is why they seem to have more money to spend on things that are not necessities.

I guess the question now becomes if property prices are comparable to the US but salaries are lower what property is the typical 25 year old living in. Are they living with parents, renting, or buying.

 

[Dungeness]

I guess the question now becomes if property prices are comparable to the US but salaries are lower what property is the typical 25 year old living in. Are they living with parents, renting, or buying.

No one I know of in China is living with their parents, they all live in their own condos, and many of them own more than one, including my retired parents. As there is no property tax in China, owning extra properties is THE way to protect your net worth.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

No one I know of in China is living with their parents, they all live in their own condos, and many of them own more than one, including my retired parents. As there is no property tax in China, owning extra properties is THE way to protect your net worth.

How much is the typical condo they are living in? If the prices are high and they don't have mortgages (so they have all this disposable income)...where did they get the money....

 

[jhungary]

Nice to know you are actually a Chinese. They said you were Vietnamese, Mexican, or what ever. When was the last time you visit China?

Just imagine you have to use that $106K, though about average in the states, to support a family of 4. So the quality of life is a question,

Sorry, I guess I am lost in the discussion. Are we talking about family net worth or living standard? When I was talking about $80K, I was referring to average family net worth in Chinese cities, which covers about 50% Chinese population. It is not their annual income, which shold be much lower than that considering their GDP per capital is only about 8K. My point is Chinese are not as poor we in the states think they are, and average Americans are not that much better off. Just look how Chinese outbound tourists spent money (120 million of them last year), we know China has lots of rich people. By the way, they spent much more in average in Japan than American tourists to Japan.

I means 80K "asset" for a family of 4. That is really not much, not enough to live a good (or even adequate life) in any State of the US.

Think about it. what 80k can get you in the US? A car is going to set you back 15-20k, TV would be about 500-1000, entertainment (Such as PS4, IPhone, Ipad, Computer) cost heck a lot. Furniture again will cost you about 10to20k. Then you got not much else to go on.

A family of 4 in the US would traditionally have 2 cars (1 for mum and dad each) 2 to 3 TVs, PS4 and/or Xbox. 3 to 4 beds, 1 to 2 sofas, 4 to 8 wardrobes, 2 computers, 2 laptop, 4 smart phones 2 to 4 portable devices. Clothing, Bicycle, sport equipment and so on, you cannot get all that if you only get 80k in your hand, If my family bought a house and only have 80k spare to spend on the rest, I would probably got basic furnishing (I can fully furnish my 3 bedroom home from IKEA for about 15-20G), and some mid range cars, probably not gonna get a SUV, and some entertainment, and that's it.

however, 80k spending money in China is a different story.

Now, I am not gonna say most people in the US is better off than most people in China, but the general circumstance is that money is a lot better well spend in China than in the US, and if you have to count generally, a family of 4 in the US, even with both parent flipping burger would earn about 30,000- 40,000 a year. You cannot get that in China, I once work in a MacDonald in Hong Kong, I earn $22HKD an hour), to get 30-40G USD per year, both of the parent would have to work in an office or something management level. however, 30-40G in US is a different concept as 30-40G in China.

Another aspect is that the Chinese people you saw in the State or any overseas destination are at least upper-middle level. The things is, if you do not have any money at all, you will not be in the States for other people to see, so if you are using what you saw in the States or anywhere else and compare to what you saw generally in China. Again, it cannot be done. I mean, would you travel if you don't have spare money?

And finally, I would be living like a king in the US if I had earned 106k a year, as I said, I do not need to pay anything and my mum and dad own 2 houses in the US. Instead of the 300 (about 420 USD) pound a week for that stupid 2 bedroom London flat. Plus, if I have a family of 4, my wife would have to work too, then my family of 4 will not only have 106k income a year, but probably double that amount, judging from the fact that my wife earn ALOT more than I do now, I would have been even able to afford an condo in upper east side.

The problem, as I can see is that, you are comparing the middle class in the US to the Middle class in China, which then generate a conclusion that America is not a lot better off than the Chinese. Problem is, there may have been 300 millions or whatever as big as the entire US population of middle class Chinese that are willing to spend money, but then, there are a lot more that simply cannot reach that level. When you talk about US as a whole, you consider US entirely, like I said, from the homeless guy living under the overpass, to that dude that own 16 beds 10 baths mansion. You cannot just look at the middle class Chinese and calls on China entirely. Even tho that population alone have the entire population of the US.

Disposable income and housing is always a wrench in calculations. If the government had a campaign that encouraged people to stay at home and live with their parents disposable income would shoot up. That $5000 in one month wouldn't be as much of an issue.

Of course you will pay a little more in taxes since you have less expense write-offs. Hmm...what an interesting way for the government to raise some money.

Oh well, if only, they pays

I should have stayed in the US instead of moving to Australia. My brother took the house my mum used to live and now he is buying properties like crazy in the US, China, Hong Kong and Singapore like playing monopoly, while I am stuck on a 20 years mortgage with my first homebuyer house..

But then his job pays 80 grand a year before penalty may help a little too....

 

[Dungeness]

How much is the typical condo they are living in? If the prices are high and they don't have mortgages (so they have all this disposable income)...where did they get the money....

My parents' have two. The one they living in is about 130 M2, current market price is about 30K RMB/M2. So it is about $650K, and they paid 1/8 of it about 15 years ago, cashed out from their savings and gov compensation for their old apartment. The other condo is about 80 M2, but 40K RMB/M2, because it is in best school district, it is a rental property, which they get about $500/m. They are living in a 2-3 tier city in south china.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

My parents' have two. The one they living in is about 130 M2, current market price is about 30K RMB/M2. So it is about $650K, and they paid 1/8 of it about 15 years ago, cashed out from their savings and gov compensation for their old apartment. The other condo is about 80 M2, but 40K RMB/M2, because it is in best school district, it is a rental property.

My parent's house is worth about $2M but a 25 year old can't afford it. How about those 25 year old friends of yours.....which is what I inquired about. What do they own and how'd they buy it if they don't have mortgages (so they have all this disposable income)

 

[jhungary]

My parents' have two. The one they living in is about 130 M2, current market price is about 30K RMB/M2. So it is about $650K, and they paid 1/8 of it about 15 years ago, cashed out from their savings and gov compensation for their old apartment. The other condo is about 80 M2, but 40K RMB/M2, because it is in best school district, it is a rental property, which they get about $500/m. They are living in a 2-3 tier city in south china.

lol, it's different........

My folks have 4 home in total, 2 in the US, 1 in Hong Kong, 1 in China, they used to own another home in Australia and Singapore but my brother sold it to cash in on the Australian Properties bloom in the early 2010s.

Problem is, that was a different time than now, my folks pays less than $100G for the 2 houses in US (1 in Kansas, another in Georgia) back in 1980s both in today value would have been more than1 millions USD and the flat in Hong Kong was bought in 1996 for 900,000 HKD and today have a quote for 4.6 millions HKD. The 3 stories mansion is even crazier, my mother went to China and purchase the land and build it for less than 110,000 RMB in early 90s, today valued at 12 Millions RMB for the 500 sqm land alone because they have build an industrial park and a few highway next to it.

 

[Dungeness]

My parent's house is worth about $2M but a 25 year old can't afford it. How about those 25 year old friends of yours.....which is what I inquired about. What do they own and how'd they buy it if they don't have mortgages (so they have all this disposable income)

Average age of first time home buyer in the US is 36, I would assume it is much earlier in China.

One of my relative just got married at 27 last year, his condo is 90 m2, worth about 2 million RMB. His parents sold one of their extra condo to pay for 50% down payment, he and his wife got about 500k rmb as gift for their marriage, so they only need to carry a 10-year mortgage for rest of 500K rmb. Their combined monthly salary is about 18K rmb per month.

I think this is the benefit of one-child policy, so kids do get a lot support from their parents.

lol, it's different........

My folks have 4 home in total, 2 in the US, 1 in Hong Kong, 1 in China, they used to own another home in Australia and Singapore but my brother sold it to cash in on the Australian Properties bloom in the early 2010s.

Problem is, that was a different time than now, my folks pays less than $100G for the 2 houses in US (1 in Kansas, another in Georgia) back in 1980s both in today value would have been more than1 millions USD and the flat in Hong Kong was bought in 1996 for 900,000 HKD and today have a quote for 4.6 millions HKD. The 3 stories mansion is even crazier, my mother went to China and purchase the land and build it for less than 110,000 RMB in early 90s, today valued at 12 Millions RMB for the 500 sqm land alone because they have build an industrial park and a few highway next to it.

That is what I am saying, lots of Chinese people got very much in the past 20-30 years, and their wealth will pass down to their next generation. It is certainly not hard to understand that many Chinese nowadays have lot of money to spend.

 

[jhungary]

That is what I am saying, lots of Chinese people got very much in the past 20-30 years, and their wealth will pass down to their next generation. It is certainly not hard to understand that many Chinese nowadays have lot of money to spend.

Well, the same is also true for anyone, money pass down by generation, and unless you somehow lost all of it when it's your turn, you will keep on passing it down. It's the same concept no matter where you are, not just in China tho.

 

[Dungeness]

Well, the same is also true for anyone, money pass down by generation, and unless you somehow lost all of it when it's your turn, you will keep on passing it down. It's the same concept no matter where you are, not just in China tho.

No necessarily true though. There is a inheritance tax for that, but China doesn't have it so far.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

Average age of first time home buyer in the US is 36, I would assume it is much earlier in China.

One of my relative just got married at 27 last year, his condo is 90 m2, worth about 2 million RMB. His parents sold one of their extra condo to pay for 50% down payment, he and his wife got about 500k rmb as gift for their marriage, so they only need to carry a 10-year mortgage for rest of 500K rmb. Their combined monthly salary is about 18K rmb per month.

I think this is the benefit of one-child policy, so kids do get a lot support from their parents.



That is what I am saying, lots of Chinese people got very much in the past 20-30 years, and their wealth will pass down to their next generation. It is certainly not hard to understand that many Chinese nowadays have lot of money to spend.

Well the next question is do you think that is the typical scenario for the typical 20 something in China.
The typical 27 year old married couple can buy a $300K condo because typical parents in China can sell one of their homes for $150K and their friends give them $75K as a wedding present. You then can float a $75K mortgage for 10 years on a $33K salary.

 

[Dungeness]

Well the next question is do you think that is the typical scenario for the typical 20 something in China.
The typical 27 year old married couple can buy a $300K condo because typical parents in China can sell one of their homes for $150K and their friends give them $75K as a wedding present. You then can float a $75K mortgage for 10 years on a $33K salary.

It is fairly common if they live in the same city as their parents. We are not talking about young university graduates who move to big cities like Shanghai Beijing or Shenzhen looking for entry level jobs as new immigrates . These people will typically start out renting a condo and share with others or living in company provided dormitories, but they do have option to go back to the cities they were from where their parents may have multi condos.