Chief of Air Staff Mujahid Anwar Khan calls on PM Imran Khan, professional matters discussed

[SQ8]

Lobbyists can work for us too biggest lobbyist for Pak is none the other LM it's job of our FO and local ambassador to US to hire these fellas.

LM wants to sell the much larger F-21 deal to India; you really think they will
Lobby for us?

 

[mingle]

LM wants to sell the much larger F-21 deal to India; you really think they will
Lobby for us?

Yeh true but what r theior chances??? ==zero

 

[Armchair]

LM wants to sell the much larger F-21 deal to India; you really think they will
Lobby for us?

They might if they feel the Indians are playing them or don't come through.

 

[mingle]

They might if they feel the Indians are playing them or don't come through.

India will not buy any new jetts they buying 18 more Su 30 s along Mig 29 surplus from Russia. It's theior Topi Drama nothing more

 

[Armchair]

that era is over. American hostility is mounting everyday
even without Indian effort because America has singled out the Chinese at its current and future opponent and Pakistan is too friendly to china.

the only possibility of F-16 carrot offer to Pakistan is if it offers itself to serve as a mercenary and vessel state to America when the Invasion on Iran begins in future.

We don't have to be a mercenary or a vassal state to see the benefit of, after American destruction of Iran, to take Sistan-Baluchestan as a buffer region, similar to Turkey in Syria.

I pray for two things:

1) JFT-Blk3 - gets an AESA radar that can pick up 3m2 targets at <200kms

2) The new platform coming in, is sanction proof.

India will not buy any new jetts they buying 18 more Su 30 s along Mig 29 surplus from Russia. It's theior Topi Drama nothing more

I'm not sure. I think the game has changed with Modi and Feb 27. I think India will go for something as a backup plan to Rafale. Let's see how it goes. They may even get "an offer they can't refuse" with the F-35.

The great game is becoming more volatile. We are at a point where the US will do almost anything to suppress China, and India will look to commit the next Muslim genocide, which may already have started. In this situation, countries will start arming themselves in a way not seen since the end of the Cold War.

 

[HRK]

India will not buy any new jetts they buying 18 more Su 30 s along Mig 29 surplus from Russia. It's theior Topi Drama nothing more

I believe India will go for more Rafale Jets as it seems the most logical choice, current purchase of additional 18 Su-30MKI and 21 MiG-29 are just to meet shortfall

 

[araz]

I know a trap, when I see one.
When all the fingers of your hand, become the same size, you let me know.

I agree that invading Iran is a totally different kettle of fish as compared to invading Iraq. Secondly why would you destroy the only perceived threat to the Mid Eastern kingdoms and lose the chance to extract billions of dollars in arms contracts. Clearly no one in the mid east at least at the Governmental level has the heart or desire to engage in a war by themselves. Their land mass and population numbers means they are not in a position to offer enough numbers for a war. This is why they go out hiring people from Paklands Bangladeshis and other nations to beef up their populace and forces.
A

 

[Irfan Baloch]

We don't have to be a mercenary or a vassal state to see the benefit of, after American destruction of Iran, to take Sistan-Baluchestan as a buffer region, similar to Turkey in Syria.




I'm not sure. I think the game has changed with Modi and Feb 27. I think India will go for something as a backup plan to Rafale. Let's see how it goes. They may even get "an offer they can't refuse" with the F-35.

The great game is becoming more volatile. We are at a point where the US will do almost anything to suppress China, and India will look to commit the next Muslim genocide, which may already have started. In this situation, countries will start arming themselves in a way not seen since the end of the Cold War.

you are right
F-35 is already on offer and Indians might get a free pass despite having S400

I agree that invading Iran is a totally different kettle of fish as compared to invading Iraq. Secondly why would you destroy the only perceived threat to the Mid Eastern kingdoms and lose the chance to extract billions of dollars in arms contracts. Clearly no one in the mid east at least at the Governmental level has the heart or desire to engage in a war by themselves. Their land mass and population numbers means they are not in a position to offer enough numbers for a war. This is why they go out hiring people from Paklands Bangladeshis and other nations to beef up their populace and forces.
A

I get you.
the bogeyman is currently Iran. if that goes .. then the Arab monarchies have no reason to buy expensive defence hardware that they have no interest or ability to even operate
and they been tranced into accepting that the Israeli state is not their enemy.
that said, the west is creative in inventing enemies it maybe any other country


disgraceful reality of selfish monarchies setup by British empire and situation is dire

 

[Zarvan]

It's been yrs that AHQ thinking to but 45 to 70 jetts a third type but not materialized due to Economic issues it's not on this forum but other PDF too and it's been on table when Tahir Butt was Air Cheif. Nothing wrong in @Zarvan part its been bad due to Economics I know about T90 M for long time but now it's getting to implement.
My take is F16 current scenario is best platform for PAF we know this plane inside out and its proven in battlefield. I am very we hopeful we r getting more F16s as now US Gen said today at senate about Pak means desire in US too IA we will get more.


Indian Bill for immunity over S400 is dead in house so things are not going good for them.
There is no pro or anti Congress it's all interests that's all except isreal and Japan not even with UK US relationship is fickle.


I got question r S400 and THAAD r comparable?? Or they r different??

My take is still that third platform will come. Due recent events and other such issues the third fighter jet is inevitable.

 

[IceCold]

Why cant we have a serious discussion and when will people get out of their F-16 fetishes? I mean seriously we dont the Fuckin money to even run the day to day affairs and PM is running to Friendly countries to keep Pakistan from defaulting and people are looking at US weapons.
What should be the point of discussion is how to get out of FATF, US withdrawal and Afghan settlement, increasing US investment in Pakistan and making sure US does not give voice to anti Pakistan elements like Pashteen etc, getting organisations such as Jamat Al-har which the US previously veto, a terrorist organisation, increasing trade to take advantage of China US trade rivalry, most importantly asking US to stop portraying Pakistan as the bad guy for their failures in Afghanistan and last but not least making sure Iran and US does not go to war.
These are things that matter and not F-16s. Weapon procurement from the US should be the last thing on our cards.

 

[araz]

It's been yrs that AHQ thinking to but 45 to 70 jetts a third type but not materialized due to Economic issues it's not on this forum but other PDF too and it's been on table when Tahir Butt was Air Cheif. Nothing wrong in @Zarvan part its been bad due to Economics I know about T90 M for long time but now it's getting to implement.
My take is F16 current scenario is best platform for PAF we know this plane inside out and its proven in battlefield. I am very we hopeful we r getting more F16s as now US Gen said today at senate about Pak means desire in US too IA we will get more.

I understand the need for 3-4 squadron of a third type of Aircraft. I also fully agree with the ease with which the 16s can be integrated into our system and the in built capacity we have for repair /ovehaul and spares. The main problem remains the diverging goal posts of US-Pak interests and the rabid need of the US to have a new enemy in China.
Pak is now too invested in China and we have a history spanning 5 decades of cooperation and converging mutual interests bringing and keeping the 2 countries close. Pak also fully understands the need for diversity so as not to become too dependent on China(various reasons for this can be offered)and hence the overtures to Russia, Turkey and Italy( just lumping them together for the sake of the narrative).
The question to which we do not have an answer, is whether the US will dangle a carrot or not? . If it does what are the terms of this carrot and how advantageous is it for Pak as well as US. IF the dangled carrot is allowing Pak to purchase MLUed platforms going on sale in EU, then do you take into consideration the 2 squadrons you can replace in 6 months to a year with little or no work up barring local check up . If the carrot is buying 18 new platforms with most of the money being paid by FMS funds which have been pending and you can buy 2 squadron of MLUed platforms from US stock/ or EU, who amongst you will not grab the bargain knowing fully well the ease of integration as we have in built capacity. However if you are required to procure platforms at cost from the US, I think it is safe to say all of us will choose to walk away.
We also need to take into consideration what conditions are puts on and whether they are palatable for us. If the only condition is facilitation of the Afghan exit, then it might be fine. If on the other hand it is provision of air base to attack Iran then would people here say yay or nay.
So in short there are various permutations of how this could all go down and our response needs to be tempered by what is on offer.
A

 

[Khafee]

disgraceful reality of selfish monarchies setup by British empire and situation is dire

Whose citizens, enjoy a much higher quality of life, than your democrazy imposed leeches, who have dug a hole so big, that the very people you hate, are bailing you out.

Oh the irony!

My take is still that third platform will come. Due recent events and other such issues the third fighter jet is inevitable.

@Irfan Baloch Pls note, and tell us which "selfish monarchy" is funding this 3rd platform.

 

[araz]

you are right
F-35 is already on offer and Indians might get a free pass despite having S400

I think they remain genuinely concerned about the mix up of technologies and the secrets falling into the Russian hands. They might not say so but the fear is very apparent.
If they denied Turkey in spite of it being a Nato vountry then they will not allow India just on the assumption it will face China. The reality is Indians may still refuse the offer as it imposes restrictions on them. With the exception of the Apaches they have not bought a single offensive weapon from the US which is a telling sign. They qould much rather deal with EU where the service will be without any questions asked.
A

I have been seeing this tableau of sabre rattling by America & Israel many times since Ayatullah Khomeini's Islamic revolution in the late 70's. But not a single invasion or bombing run over Iran has taken place to my knowledge. Iran has always been quite outspoken against the US and Israel. Sometimes I am not sure whether they truly mean to attack Iran. No other country, apart from North Korea, has shown the defiance belligerence that Iran has shown and has gone unpunished. Really curious.

Can I please leave you with an open ended question. Is it all a game with mutual consent of all parties concerned? Look at the permutation of what I say in response to the mid east situation and think your way through. See what you come up with.
A

I have been seeing this tableau of sabre rattling by America & Israel many times since Ayatullah Khomeini's Islamic revolution in the late 70's. But not a single invasion or bombing run over Iran has taken place to my knowledge. Iran has always been quite outspoken against the US and Israel. Sometimes I am not sure whether they truly mean to attack Iran. No other country, apart from North Korea, has shown the defiance belligerence that Iran has shown and has gone unpunished. Really curious.

Can I please leave you with an open ended question. Is it all a game with mutual consent of all parties concerned? Look at the permutation of what I say in response to the mid east situation and think your way through. See what you come up with.
A

I pray for two things:

1) JFT-Blk3 - gets an AESA radar that can pick up 3m2 targets at <200kms

2) The new platform coming in, is sanction proof.

Re the second wish it may well come true. The first one might be a little bit more difficult to comment on not knowing what radar is on the cards and what the actual specs are.

A

 

[The Eagle]

I agree with @Oscar that US Congress is all in Indian Pocket with majority and just recently, approved NATO type status for India. If this meeting has to do with anything, remember that any purchase will have to go through Congress and that is not a place for a favour after mentioning Pakistan.

We might be looking at requirement from US V/s message to tell them about our next route.

 

[araz]

LM wants to sell the much larger F-21 deal to India; you really think they will
Lobby for us?

The real question is whether IAF will bite. They have previously refused US overtures so how likely is it they will overturn a previously arrived at decision.
A