What's new

Chengdu J-20 5th Generation Aircraft News & Discussions

How reliable is this? Most of us were expecting 2023 at the earliest.
This is looking more and more like the real deal. I expect a lot of fake stuff to be posted around now, like the image of the WS-10B TVC "implying" that it's the WS-15, but I believe the core rumour (a test flight with two WS-15 engines) is likelier to be true than not.
 
Like I said, there'll be a lot of dubious stuff posted where we won't know the real from the fake until much later. Like the Y-20 with WS-20 engines, there were a lot of rumours and a lot of fake pictures until we saw pictures and video of 7810. The fact that this picture is likely fake doesn't detract from the truth of the core rumour, similarly to the Y-20.

There was certainly activity recently at CAC and it jives well with the timelines and previous rumours. According to huitong, the J-20 was test-flown with a WS-15 in September 2019 - that was probably a flight with one engine. It makes sense that this would be a flight with two WS-15s.

The second most likely possibility is a TVC WS-10C flight test.

Edit: Huitong recently posted this update
The latest rumor (June 2021) suggested that a “full standard” J-20 (J-20C?) powered by the WS-15 turbofan engine flew for the first time.
As far as I'm concerned, this along with PiSigma's post does it.
 
Last edited:
So, there's been some interesting developments in the English PLA watching space vis-à-vis this topic. It seems the recent mentions of the WS-15 have been removed from huitong's blog (both the recent rumour and the September 2019 rumour of a test flight with one engine). He's now doing an "I dunno lol, maybe it's a twin seater J-20, maybe it's the naval AEW plane" routine.

Now, it could just be an honest correction on his part, but the conspiratorial part of me thinks that he and a bunch of others got a "suggestion" from .gov.cn that any mention of WS-15 test flights is unadvisable.
 
So, there's been some interesting developments in the English PLA watching space vis-à-vis this topic. It seems the recent mentions of the WS-15 have been removed from huitong's blog (both the recent rumour and the September 2019 rumour of a test flight with one engine). He's now doing an "I dunno lol, maybe it's a twin seater J-20, maybe it's the naval AEW plane" routine.

Now, it could just be an honest correction on his part, but the conspiratorial part of me thinks that he and a bunch of others got a "suggestion" from .gov.cn that any mention of WS-15 test flights is unadvisable.
Thanks for this informative report. Seems like the maiden flight story about WS-15 is real.
 
How many are there?
Chengdu Aircraft Company, with three production lines, produces 36 aircraft annually, and begins normal speed production in mid-2018. In three years, nearly 100 have been produced.
 
Thanks for this informative report. Seems like the maiden flight story about WS-15 is real.
I don't think we can claim that with complete confidence. Rather, several pieces of circumstantial evidence convince me that it's likelier than not that a J-20 was test flown with two WS-15 engines, and we may never see direct evidence for this. To review the circumstantial evidence:
  1. Early reports indicated that at least one senior official visited CAC. Some even indicated it was President Xi himself. Whether or not he did, this indicates that a major event occurred at that time. It's difficult to imagine that this was simply installing thrust vectoring nozzles on an existing engine. However, the first twin engine test flight of a new, next-generation engine is certainly a far more significant event - almost on par with the J-20's first test flight in 2011.
  2. Huitong's expunging of two passages related to the WS-15 from his blog. The later passage references this event, and had it been the only one deleted I would have put it down to him being dubious about the rumour. However, the much earlier passage dating to September 2019 was also deleted. This starts to look less like a normal edit and more like someone tapped huitong (or his sources) on the shoulder and told him in no uncertain terms that the WS-15 test schedule is not to be discussed.
  3. We know from a lecture given by Dr. Liu Daxiang that the WS-15 is expected to attain design certification around 2023 and be in mass production by 2025. If this schedule is to hold, we expected the WS-15 to be integrated with the J-20 airframe and be test flown around now.
I don't consider the posted picture to be any kind of evidence at all. It could be a test of a thrust vectoring nozzle from some time back, or it could simply be a shop.
 
China deploys J-20 stealth fighter jets to units monitoring Taiwan Strait


  • New brigade of upgraded J-20s deployed in ceremony forming part of Communist Party’s centenary
  • Deployment aimed at telling South Korea and Japan that China is strengthening its air defence, observer says
1624711504136.png


China has begun mass-producing the upgraded version of the J-20. Photo: 81.com
China has deployed its
most advanced stealth fighter jet
to air force units monitoring the Taiwan Strait and the East China Sea, state media said, in a move Chinese observers saw as a warning to South Korea and Japan, the US’ allies in the region.

The deployment indicated China had delivered at least four aviation brigades with a total of 150 J-20 fighter jets, including two training bases in Inner Mongolia and Hebei and two aviation brigades in the eastern and northern theatre commands, a military insider said.
“China will accelerate the deployment of the upgraded version J-20C, with probably at least one or two brigades in every theatre command to defend the country’s five strategic directions in the next five years,” the insider, who requested anonymity due to the sensitivity, told the South China Morning Post. The five directions referred to the
People’s Liberation Army’s
(PLA’s) five theatre commands, in the north, south, west, east and central.

“As one brigade needs at least 36 aircraft, it means the PLA Air Force will need more than 300 J-20s in the future,” they said. “But the progress will rely on the delivery of the home-built WS-10C engine and the latest development of the tailor-made WS-15 engine for the J-20s.”

China has stopped using
Russian AL-31F engines
originally fitted on the J-20s, replacing them with the
upgraded home-built WS-10C
, a stopgap choice, with development of the more powerful WS-15 engine affected by the
Covid-19 pandemic
.



The new aviation brigade, Military Development Vanguard Air Group, based in Anshan, Liaoning province, has been equipped with the upgraded J-20C jets in a ceremony, state broadcaster China Central Television reported last Friday.

That air group, under the Northern Theatre Command, became the second J-20 aviation brigade, after the Wuhu-based Wang Hai Flight Group under the Eastern Theatre Command in Anhui province, CCTV said.

The two brigades originated from the air force units of the People’s Volunteer Army (PVA) during the Korean war (1950-53).

“The J-20’s new deployment, announced ahead of the Communist Party’s 100th anniversary on July 1, is aimed at telling South Korea and Japan that China is strengthening its air defence along the coastal areas, warning them not to join Washington and intervene in the Taiwan issue,” Li Jie, a Beijing-based naval expert, said.

A ceremony for the deployment of J-20s was held on Friday at the former site of the air force’s cradle, the original Northeast China Democratic United Army Aviation School in Jilin province in the northeast, as part of the events marking the party centenary, CCTV said.

The PVA’s early pilots and engineers were trained at the school by Japanese pilots who surrendered to China after World War II. The Chinese pilots were trained for only dozens of hours before being sent to the Korean war to fight American counterparts, CCTV said.
Shanghai-based military expert Ni Lexiong said the deployment of J-20s to Wuhu and Anshan, respectively 800km (500 miles) and 1,700km from Taiwan, was aimed at preventing the bases there becoming targets for Taipei’s new home-built Hsiung Feng-2E (Brave Wing) cruise missile.

“The Hsiung Feng missile has a firing range of 600km, and its extended version could hit targets more than 1,000km away,” Ni said.
“The J-20 is the PLA’s most powerful and sophisticated weapon, and may become the first bombing target for Taipei if a war between mainland China and Taiwan were to happen.”

Beijing sees Taiwan as a breakaway province, to be brought under its control by force if necessary, and is opposed to other countries intervening in its “reunification mission”, planned for decades.

Li said the J-20s would not be the spearhead in a possible cross-strait war, with the mainland’s short and medium-range DF-11, DF-15 and DF-17 missiles expected to be deployed on the front line.
“None of the J-20s will be deployed near the coasts, because of their 2,000km-plus combat range, which is more than enough to cover the mainland coastal provinces and Taiwan,” Li said.

The upgraded version of the J-20C entered mass production last June, although Zhou Chenming, a researcher from the Yuan Wang military science institute in Beijing, said J-20s were currently believed to be in short supply.
“Once a war happens, the PLA needs to deal with all US allies in the region, meaning it needs at least 200 J-20s, given that Beijing expects Washington to deploy between 200 and 300 F-35s to Japan and South Korea by 2025,” Zhou said.

Beijing rushed the J-20, its first stealth fighter jet, into service ahead of schedule in 2017, when the US started deploying the F-35, its fifth-generation all-weather stealth multi-role fighter, to the Asia-Pacific region.
 
China deploys J-20 stealth fighter jets to units monitoring Taiwan Strait
  • New brigade of upgraded J-20s deployed in ceremony forming part of Communist Party’s centenary
  • Deployment aimed at telling South Korea and Japan that China is strengthening its air defence, observer says
Minnie Chan

View attachment 756719

China has begun mass-producing the upgraded version of the J-20. Photo: 81.com
China has deployed its most advanced stealth fighter jet to air force units monitoring the Taiwan Strait and the East China Sea, state media said, in a move Chinese
observers saw as a warning to South Korea and Japan, the US’ allies in the region.

The deployment indicated China had delivered at least four aviation brigades with a total of 150 J-20 fighter jets, including two training bases in Inner Mongolia and Hebei and two aviation brigades in the eastern and northern theatre commands, a military insider said.
“China will accelerate the deployment of the upgraded version J-20C, with probably at least one or two brigades in every theatre command to defend the country’s five strategic directions in the next five years,” the insider, who requested anonymity due to the sensitivity
[because its an pro American troll in Japan], told the South China Morning Post. The five directions referred to the
People’s Liberation Army’s
(PLA’s) five theatre commands, in the north, south, west, east and central.

“As one brigade needs at least 36 aircraft, it means the PLA Air Force will need more than 300 J-20s in the future,” they said. “But the progress will rely on the delivery of the home-built WS-10C engine and the latest development of the tailor-made WS-15 engine for the J-20s.”

China has stopped using
Russian AL-31F engines
originally fitted on the J-20s, replacing them with the
upgraded home-built WS-10C
, a stopgap choice, with development of the more powerful WS-15 engine affected by the
Covid-19 pandemic

.
The new aviation brigade, Military Development Vanguard Air Group, based in Anshan, Liaoning province, has been equipped with the upgraded J-20C jets in a ceremony, state broadcaster China Central Television reported last Friday.

That air group, under the Northern Theatre Command, became the second J-20 aviation brigade, after the Wuhu-based Wang Hai Flight Group under the Eastern Theatre Command in Anhui province, CCTV said.

The two brigades originated from the air force units of the People’s Volunteer Army (PVA) during the Korean war (1950-53).

“The J-20’s new deployment, announced ahead of the Communist Party’s 100th anniversary on July 1, is aimed at telling South Korea and Japan that China is strengthening its air defence along the coastal areas, warning them not to join Washington and intervene in the Taiwan issue,” Li Jie, a Beijing-based naval expert, said.

A ceremony for the deployment of J-20s was held on Friday at the former site of the air force’s cradle, the original Northeast China Democratic United Army Aviation School in Jilin province in the northeast, as part of the events marking the party centenary, CCTV said.

The PVA’s early pilots and engineers were trained at the school by Japanese pilots who surrendered to China after World War II. The Chinese pilots were trained for only dozens of hours before being sent to the Korean war to fight American counterparts, CCTV said.
Shanghai-based military expert Ni Lexiong said the deployment of J-20s to Wuhu and Anshan, respectively 800km (500 miles) and 1,700km from Taiwan, was aimed at preventing the bases there becoming targets for Taipei’s new home-built Hsiung Feng-2E (Brave Wing) cruise missile.

“The Hsiung Feng missile has a firing range of 600km, and its extended version could hit targets more than 1,000km away,” Ni said.
“The J-20 is the PLA’s most powerful and sophisticated weapon, and may become the first bombing target for Taipei if a war between mainland China and Taiwan were to happen.”

Beijing sees Taiwan as a breakaway province, to be brought under its control by force if necessary, and is opposed to other countries intervening in its “reunification mission”, planned for decades. [Reminder that half of the SCMP staff working for the USA is not allowed to call Taiwan part of China]

Li said the J-20s would not be the spearhead in a possible cross-strait war, with the mainland’s short and medium-range DF-11, DF-15 and DF-17 missiles expected to be deployed on the front line.
“None of the J-20s will be deployed near the coasts, because of their 2,000km-plus combat range, which is more than enough to cover the mainland coastal provinces and Taiwan,” Li said.

The upgraded version of the J-20C entered mass production last June, although Zhou Chenming, a researcher from the Yuan Wang military science institute in Beijing, said J-20s were currently believed to be in short supply.
“Once a war happens, the PLA needs to deal with all US allies in the region, meaning it needs at least 200 J-20s, given that Beijing expects Washington to deploy between 200 and 300 F-35s to Japan and South Korea by 2025,” Zhou said.

Beijing rushed the J-20, its first stealth fighter jet, into service ahead of schedule in 2017, when the US started deploying the F-35, its fifth-generation all-weather stealth multi-role fighter, to the Asia-Pacific region.
Everything marked in red is just outright false and fabrications and the usual SCMP hyberbole and straight out trolling.

English GT report:
Orginal CCTV report:
 
From 17:00 on


 
From 17:00 on



This does beg the question — where are the surplus Sukhois being sent to?
 
What thrust class is the WS 15 supposed to be in?
 
Back
Top Bottom