Chengdu J-20 5th Generation Aircraft News & Discussions

[Ultima Thule]

We actually don't know the J-20s weight ... it could be lighter than both of them given the amount of composites used. Either way, the original WS-15 design ensured the J-20 was sufficiently powered as the F-22. But considering the F119 is an almost 30 year old engine, it is no surprise that the Chinese wanted to upgrade the WS-15 to become competitive with the F135 and the Russian Id. 30 engine.

Yes sir you're how much and what kind of composite used by J-20 and what is real weight of J-20 but according to Wikipedia F-22 has MAX weight of 80,000 LBS, if we assume that J-20 in a same weight class then you're right sir for J-20 F-119 class engine is best for J-20, but If they developing/want higher thrust class than F-119 than it doesn't means sir J-20 is heavier than F-22/Su-57, or they trying to overpowering J-20???

 

[Figaro]

Yes sir you're how much and what kind of composite used by J-20 and what is real weight of J-20 but according to Wikipedia F-22 has MAX weight of 80,000 LBS, if we assume that J-20 in a same weight class then you're right sir for J-20 F-119 class engine is best for J-20, but If they developing/want higher thrust class than F-119 than it doesn't means sir J-20 is heavier than F-22/Su-57, or they trying to overpowering J-20???

We don't know what the real weight of the J-20 is. But I think it is safe to assume it is in the same class as the Su-57 and F-22. With that being said, it is very possible the Chinese want to strive for a fighter more capable than the F-22 ... it is after all almost 30 years old. If the US were to make a twin engine fighter instead of the F-35, I'm certain they would've used two F135 engines. IIRC, the Russian Id.30 engine also offers around 170 to 180 kN of thrust and the Su-57 weighs around the same as the F-22 ... I think it is safe to say they also want better performance than the F-22. Just because the Chinese want an engine with higher thrust than the F-22 does not mean they are doing so to compensate for the J-20s weight.

 

[Ultima Thule]

We don't know what the real weight of the J-20 is. But I think it is safe to assume it is in the same class as the Su-57 and F-22. With that being said, it is very possible the Chinese want to strive for a fighter more capable than the F-22 ... it is after all almost 30 years old. If the US were to make a twin engine fighter instead of the F-35, I'm certain they would've used two F135 engines. IIRC, the Russian Id.30 engine also offers around 170 to 180 kN of thrust and the Su-57 weighs around the same as the F-22 ... I think it is safe to say they also want better performance than the F-22. Just because the Chinese want an engine with higher thrust than the F-22 does not mean they are doing so to compensate for the J-20s weight.

But with a F-119 class (150 KN) engine as you said in your above post, and if we assume J-20 has in the same weight as F-22/Su-57, J-20 has same Thrust to Weight Ratio/maneuverability/agility as rest of the 5th gen jets, so why J-20 expected WS-15 can add so much power, I don't understand the logic sir??? and F-135 have so much power because F-35 uses only one engine and can not super cruise because F-135 is a high bypass engine

 

[Figaro]

But with a F-119 class (150 KN) engine as you said in your above post, and if we assume J-20 has in the same weight as F-22/Su-57, J-20 has same Thrust to Weight Ratio/maneuverability/agility as rest of the 5th gen jets, so why J-20 expected WS-15 can add so much power, I don't understand the logic sir??? and F-135 have so much power because F-35 uses only one engine and can not super cruise because F-135 is a high bypass engine

What I meant to say was if the US decided to build a twin engined stealth fighter instead of the JSF for example, it would also use the F135 (albeit with a lower bypass ratio). I am sure that the US is more than capable of developing a F135 variant with 190 kN thrust and a bypass ratio similar to that of the F119. But that is just hypotheticals. If you want a better comparison, why not compare with the Russian Id.30 engine? That engine is said to have a thrust of around 175 kN and has a comparatively small bypass ratio. Obviously the Su-57 equipped with the Id.30 will offer better kinematic performance than the F-22 simply based on the additional thrust alone ...

 

[Ultima Thule]

What I meant to say was if the US decided to build a twin engined stealth fighter instead of the JSF for example, it would also use the F135 (albeit with a lower bypass ratio). I am sure that the US is more than capable of developing a F135 variant with 190 kN thrust and a bypass ratio similar to that of the F119. But that is just hypotheticals. If you want a better comparison, why not compare with the Russian Id.30 engine? That engine is said to have a thrust of around 175 kN and has a comparatively small bypass ratio. Obviously the Su-57 equipped with the Id.30 will offer better kinematic performance than the F-22 simply based on the additional thrust alone ...

USA developing VARIABLE CYCLE ENGINE for their next 6th gen fighter jets Sir
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variable_cycle_engine

 

[vi-va]

USA developing VARIABLE CYCLE ENGINE for their next 6th gen fighter jets Sir
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variable_cycle_engine

Both Russia and China did the same. There are at least 20 parallel engine projects going on in China, including variable cycle engine.

 

[Ultima Thule]

Both Russia and China did the same. There are at least 20 parallel engine projects going on in China, including variable cycle engine.

I know bro and good luck for these projects

 

[Figaro]

Both Russia and China did the same. There are at least 20 parallel engine projects going on in China, including variable cycle engine.

Apparently Chinese VCE verification engines models were already developed a long time ago
https://new.qq.com/omn/20181117/20181117A1KGDG.html

 

[vi-va]

Apparently VCE verification engines models were already developed a long time ago
https://new.qq.com/omn/20181117/20181117A1KGDG.html

Thanks.
What's public on news channels are usually old ones. The pioneers keep an close eye on modern technology development.

China is a weird combination. 2nd industrial revolution, 3rd industrial revolution, 4th industrial revolution mixed together, in a more or less same time frame.

 

[Figaro]

Thanks.
What's public on news channels are usually old ones. The pioneers keep an close eye on modern technology development.

China is a weird combination. 2nd industrial revolution, 3rd industrial revolution, 4th industrial revolution mixed together, in a more or less same time frame.

Right now the number one most important product in the Chinese aviation industry imo is the WS-15 ... I really can't wait to see it and of course the specs. I think it is the number one most anticipated development for the PLAAF in the first half of this decade.

 

[vi-va]

Right now the number one most important product in the Chinese aviation industry imo is the WS-15 ... I really can't wait to see it and of course the specs. I think it is the number one most anticipated development for the PLAAF in the first half of this decade.

Also CJ-1000A.

 

[Trailer23]

@K Shehzad
That article you posted - as a new Topic...

You know the one that got deleted by the Mods, is 5 Years old - from March 2015

Link: https://www.defenceaviation.com/2015/03/china-bans-export-of-chengdu-j-20.html

Try to stay current, if you don't want your Topics to be Deleted.

 

[Beast]

@K Shehzad
That article you posted - as a new Topic...

You know the one that got deleted by the Mods, is 5 Years old - from March 2015

Link: https://www.defenceaviation.com/2015/03/china-bans-export-of-chengdu-j-20.html

Try to stay current, if you don't want your Topics to be Deleted.

Very likely false flagger.

 

[Figaro]

Very likely false flagger.

What indications make you believe the Chinese want to export the J-20?

 

[Trailer23]

China 5th Gen J-20B Breathing Down India’s Neck; Can Rafales, Sukhois Match The ‘Stealth’ Jet?​

China joins Russia and the US after an upgraded version of the Chinese J-20B stealth fighter jet formally entered mass production. This poses a big risk for neighbours like India, Japan and other ASEAN nations.

Chinese stealth fighter jet – J-20B has undergone an upgrade to finally classify itself as a full-fledged fifth-generation aircraft. In doing so, it now aims to directly challenge the US dominance led by F-35 and F-22 fighter jets and dominate its neighbours.

An upgraded version of the Chinese J-20B stealth fighter jet has formally entered mass production. The modification has earned it the title of being a fifth-generation fighter jet. Fifth-generation fighters are defined by their stealth technology, supersonic cruising speed, super manoeuvrability, and highly integrated avionics.

Although J-20 has been on active duty since 2017, western aviation experts had described the jet as a “dedicated interceptor aircraft” because of its lack of agility. The modified J-20B was unveiled earlier this week. The ceremony was hosted by many senior military leaders including the Central Military Commission (CMC) vice-chairman General Zhang Youxia.

Speaking at the event, Zhang, who is also in charge of weapons development for the People’s Liberation Army, confirmed the mass production of the J-20B. He said that J-20B is now equipped with thrust vector control thus helping the jet achieve agility criteria required to ‘classify’ as a fifth-generation fighter jet.

Thrust vector control (TVC) allows pilots to better control the aircraft by redirecting engine thrust. Chinese advancement in TVC technology was first displayed in 2018 when Beijing debuted its J-10C multirole fighter at the air show in Zhuhai.

Besides challenging the US stealth fighter jets, the J-20s are anticipated to dominate the Asian skies and pose a direct challenge to soon to be acquired Japanese F-35s and Indian Rafale and other aircraft that New Delhi is in the process of acquiring.

J-20B vs F-35 and Rafale​

The mass production of J-20B has handed a massive boost to the Chinese Air Force. With adversaries like India, Japan and South Korea equipped with modern fighter jets such as Dassault Rafale and Lockheed Martin F-35, the original Chinese J-20 did not offer much competition.

However, with the mass production of J-20B, the Chinese Air Force would now have an aircraft that levels the playing field in the Asia-Pacific. According to experts, the J-20B could give a stiff challenge to the F-35s but would simply overwhelm the Taiwanese F-16s.


As EurAsian Times reported earlier, the US recently approved the sale of 105 F-35 joint strike fighters to Japan at an estimated cost of $23 billion. The approved package includes 63 F-35A conventional takeoff and landing aircraft and 42 F-35 short takeoff and landing variants as part of a December 2018 decision by Japan to increase its procurement of F-35s from 42 to 147.

India is set to receive 36 Rafale from France and would be purchasing more hi-tech jets as part of the MMRCA contract. This led to Beijing speeding up its own fighter jet program, experts argue.

Although the current J-20B is currently powered by Russian Saturn AL-31 engines, Beijing aims to power the jet with its domestic WS-15 engine.

Chinese engineers have been developing high-thrust turbofan WS-15 engines for the J-20 and it is expected to be ready in the next one to two years. The ultimate goal is to equip the J-20B fighter jets with domestic engines.

Chengdu Aerospace Corporation (CAC), which manufactures the J-20s, has already received ‘heavy orders’ from the PLA. CAC set up its fourth production line in 2019, each one with a capacity to make about one J-20 a month.

Once China is able to power its J-20B fighter jet with Chinese made engines, it will only become the third country after the United States and Russia to have a fully indigenously developed fifth-generation fighter jet.

Source: https://eurasiantimes.com/after-us-...fully-indigenous-5th-generation-jet-in-j-20b/

----------------------------------------------------​

So basically, now that CAC has 4 Production Lines, they can pump out Four J-20B's each Month.

04 by July
08 by August
12 by September
16 by October
20 by November
24 by December (if they want).

@LKJ86 @Beast