Chengdu J-20 5th Generation Aircraft News & Discussions

[Ultima Thule]

To sit down and think why we need to develop 15th gen from 5th if they are same as you thought of?
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There always have new challenge to hide the aircraft or any other things from radar.
We need to change a lot of things to cheat the new developed radar working in different band, mechanism, thus, we need to find out the new theories to achieve it.

The hide and seek game will never stop. There has no one theory last forever.
You have to made a new aircraft to win the later developed radar.
This is one of the reason that's why F-117 retired , F-22 stacked at airbase as well production line demolished, and F-35 must be made at any cost.

that is what i am talking about you may add new material, new avionics and new engine,but laws of physics does'nt changed and BTW US had lots experience for designing and building a stealth aircraft,does china have that experience? no you haven't this is your first project

 

[Beast]

that is what i am talking about you may add new material, new avionics and new engine,but laws of physics does'nt changed and BTW US had lots experience for designing and building a stealth aircraft,does china have that experience? no you haven't this is your first project

From the rapid build up of reduced RCS warship to conducting 2 5th gen fighter program and stealth drone. I don't think China lack expertise when regards to stealth technology.

 

[Ultima Thule]

From the rapid build up of reduced RCS warship to conducting 2 5th gen fighter program and stealth drone. I don't think China lack expertise when regards to stealth technology.

Ok but you are extremly new on this field, your first project about stealth i may remember is WZ-9/WZ-2000 in 1999, your reduce RCS ship project is started after 2000, and BTW US had decades of experienceon designing and building stealth aircrafts, drone and ships, do you have that experience?

 

[Beast]

Ok but you are extremly new on this field, your first project about stealth i may remember is WZ-9/WZ-2000 in 1999, your reduce RCS ship project is started after 2000, and BTW US had decades of experienceon designing and building stealth aircrafts, drone and ships, do you have that experience?

China is no novice when comes to aviation. Our country pours huge money into R&D which speeds up many years of catchup. Even US destroyer still uses PESA for their alreigh burke destroyer while our Type052C and D uses AESA. USAF E-3 uses electronic scanned while our KJ-2000 uses fixed AESA.

Our drone technology is young but we are already a mature drone export and developed country. There is a reason why we pursue powerful supercomputer and our tianhe 2A which is fastest in the world helps to process the best possible scenario and structure for all our weapons and stealth.

 

[Ultima Thule]

China is no novice when comes to aviation. Our country pours huge money into R&D which speeds up many years of catchup. Even US destroyer still uses PESA for their alreigh burke destroyer while our Type052C and D uses AESA. USAF E-3 uses electronic scanned while our KJ-2000 uses fixed AESA.

Our drone technology is young but we are already a mature drone export and developed country. There is a reason why we pursue powerful supercomputer and our tianhe 2A which is fastest in the world helps to process the best possible scenario and structure for all our weapons and stealth.

but it doesn't mean that US is less advance than china, what is the prove that alreigh burke class uses PESA,in every site stated they uses AESA and as for E-3 they know their capability of their system, they are fit their bill,may be J-20 will have different tactics than F-22, i think it will be shoot and run tactics, not design for dogfight with other aircrafts.

 

[Beast]

but it doesn't mean that US is less advance than china, what is the prove that alreigh burke class uses PESA,in every site stated they uses AESA and as for E-3 they know their capability of their system, they are fit their bill,may be J-20 will have different tactics than F-22, i think it will be shoot and run tactics, not design for dogfight with other aircrafts.

You dont know Alreigh Burke uses PESA? Why not you comfirmed with your dear gambit?

AN/SPY-1 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

'The array is a passive electronically scanned system and is a key component of the Aegis Combat System."

Longlong says very clear, F-22 is designed in the 80s which many supercomputer or aided is still not that updated. F-35 eliminated all the deficiency of F-22 but unfortunately due to the 3 tri service requirement and as non air superior, it is still not perfect. If even a chances for F-22 to redesign, you will see the gap cavity being eliminated.

 

[gambit]

You dont know Alreigh Burke uses PESA? Why not you comfirmed with your dear gambit?

AN/SPY-1 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

'The array is a passive electronically scanned system and is a key component of the Aegis Combat System."

Longlong says very clear, F-22 is designed in the 80s which many supercomputer or aided is still not that updated. F-35 eliminated all the deficiency of F-22 but unfortunately due to the 3 tri service requirement and as non air superior, it is still not perfect. If even a chances for F-22 to redesign, you will see the gap cavity being eliminated.

Please......Your desperation makes you look pathetic.

The Arleigh Burke class ships were designed and built long before YOU were borned...

Arleigh Burke-class destroyer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The first ship of the class was commissioned on 4 July 1991.

China was probably wondering what the heck was a 'radar'.

The ESA technology was not new but for a ship deployment -- it was new. The passive technology was the best at that time and the next iteration of the Arleigh Burke class will have the active technology.

The Heart of the Navy's Next Destroyer - USNI News

When the first new Flight III Arleigh Burke-class destroyer enters service with the U.S. Navy in 2019, it will be equipped with a new radar roughly 30 times more powerful than the long-serving Lockheed Martin SPY-1 system found on current Aegis warships.

Unlike the SPY-1, which is a passive phased-array radar with one large transmit/receive (T/R) element, the AMDR will use many thousands of small T/R modules to form its antenna.

It is only in your childish mind that the US is somehow 'behind' China when smarter people than you guys here know that combined with actual combat experience and the decades of operation of the older passive technology, when the newer Arleigh Burke class ships are deployed the US Navy will continue to be the leader in this area.

Newer technology does not guarantee combat successes, kid, people are equally important and right now, if there is a shooting war between the USN and the PLAN, an older Arleigh Burke class ship can and will run circles around the PLAN's latest.

 

[Beast]

Please......Your desperation makes you look pathetic.

The Arleigh Burke class ships were designed and built long before YOU were borned...

Arleigh Burke-class destroyer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

China was probably wondering what the heck was a 'radar'.

The ESA technology was not new but for a ship deployment -- it was new. The passive technology was the best at that time and the next iteration of the Arleigh Burke class will have the active technology.

The Heart of the Navy's Next Destroyer - USNI News

It is only in your childish mind that the US is somehow 'behind' China when smarter people than you guys here know that combined with actual combat experience and the decades of operation of the older passive technology, when the newer Arleigh Burke class ships are deployed the US Navy will continue to be the leader in this area.

Newer technology does not guarantee combat successes, kid, people are equally important and right now, if there is a shooting war between the USN and the PLAN, an older Arleigh Burke class ship can and will run circles around the PLAN's latest.

We now uses AESA on our destroyer. AESA on our AWAC. How many countries has that?

 

[Deino]

The J-20's Radar testbed spotted again ....

 

[Bussard Ramjet]

I am not sure if Chinese members here are right, but they do sure overestimate their capability.

They were making fun of Russian systems, and were talking how S400 is obsolete for them, and that China will never buy it, but when official confirmation came in, they completely changed their tune.

Why was that?
Don't you think you may do the mistake of overestimating yourself, and underestimating your rival?

You said that you are superior to Russia now in all fields, yet you are buying, with quite some money, S400, at a time when they will be upgrading to S500. And all Chinese newspapers ran this news, that S400 was required and that China is not good at missile defense.

This would imply that by 2017, you will be a whole generation behind the Russians in missile defense.

@Beast @AndrewJin

 

[Akasa]

I am not sure if Chinese members here are right, but they do sure overestimate their capability.

They were making fun of Russian systems, and were talking how S400 is obsolete for them, and that China will never buy it, but when official confirmation came in, they completely changed their tune.

Why was that?
Don't you think you may do the mistake of overestimating yourself, and underestimating your rival?

You said that you are superior to Russia now in all fields, yet you are buying, with quite some money, S400, at a time when they will be upgrading to S500. And all Chinese newspapers ran this news, that S400 was required and that China is not good at missile defense.

This would imply that by 2017, you will be a whole generation behind the Russians in missile defense.

@Beast @AndrewJin

On the contrary, the S-400 deal has not yet been verified by a government source yet; all the reporting has been done either by the media or the Russians.

None of those reports stated that China "wasn't good" at air defense, but there is a niche to be filled.

Do distinguish between air defense and missile defense. While the PLA hasn't unveiled anything equivalent to the S-400, they are testing midcourse and terminal anti-ballistic missiles that are far ahead of anything Moscow has unveiled thus far.

 

[Bussard Ramjet]

On the contrary, the S-400 deal has not yet been verified by a government source yet; all the reporting has been done either by the media or the Russians.

None of those reports stated that China "wasn't good" at air defense, but there is a niche to be filled.

Do distinguish between air defense and missile defense. While the PLA hasn't unveiled anything equivalent to the S-400, they are testing midcourse and terminal anti-ballistic missiles that are far ahead of anything Moscow has unveiled thus far.

It has been confirmed by very senior Russian officials. It has been very widely reported by Chinese media, People's Daily, Xinhua etc. They also wrote commentaries from some military officers about this.

PLA to buy advanced missiles from Russia - China - Chinadaily.com.cn

 

[Akasa]

It has been confirmed by very senior Russian officials. It has been very widely reported by Chinese media, People's Daily, Xinhua etc. They also wrote commentaries from some military officers about this.

PLA to buy advanced missiles from Russia - China - Chinadaily.com.cn

Military officers and Chinese media are not the ones who are in charge of weapons procurement.

Are those the same senior Russian officials who "confirmed" the false Su-35 purchase?

 

[Bussard Ramjet]

To quote from the above article

"The S-400 is definitely one of the top anti-aircraft weapons in the world. It will greatly supplement the People's Liberation Army's air defense system, which now has some loopholes in long-range, high-altitude defense of airplanes or ballistic missiles," said Wang Ya'nan, deputy editor-in-chief of Aerospace Knowledge magazine.

"The system has multiple types of missiles with various ranges, enabling it to safeguard a very large area of airspace. Some of its missiles are even specifically designed to intercept ballistic missiles," Wang said. "Moreover, some of its launch tubes can store and launch several different missiles, which makes it very convenient and fast to use."

Russia has a long history of developing anti-aircraft and missile defense weapons, so the S-400 is a concentration of some of the most advanced missile technologies Russia has, such as an active electronically scanned array radar, according to Wang.

"China still lacks experience in the development of long-range air defense systems, especially those that can intercept ballistic missiles. There is no shortcut because the development of such sophisticated weapons requires a great number of experiments and tests. It is a matter of time and resource input," he added.

According to Russian media reports, the S-400 is a new-generation, anti-aircraft weapon system capable of engaging any aerial target, including airplanes, helicopters and drones, as well as cruise and tactical ballistic missiles, with a maximum speed of 4.8 km per second. The system's 40N6 missile can destroy airborne targets at ranges up to 400 km.

Anatoly Isaikin, chief executive of the Russian state-run arms trader Rosoboronexport, confirmed on Monday that China has a contract with his company for the purchase of the S-400 air defense systems.

"I will not disclose the details of the contract, but yes, China has indeed become the first buyer of this sophisticated Russian air defense system. It underlines once again the strategic level of our relations," Isaikin told the Russian newspaper Kommersant.​

Military officers and Chinese media are not the ones who are in charge of weapons procurement.

Are those the same senior Russian officials who "confirmed" the false Su-35 purchase?

No, these are not random Russian officials. I remember, @Beast said at one stage that he will only accept anything when Rosoboronexport releases it.

Here, it is said by the chief executive of that arm.

Also, when did Chinese media run false commentary about Su-35? Here, you have all kinds of papers. Also, quite some Chinese military officials are also quoted.

Why are you so adamant in accepting this? I think you are overestimating yourself due to your ego, which will be very wrong. Don't underestimate anyone.

China was smacked like anything by Imperial Japan, even though it was only a small fraction economically.

 

[Akasa]

No, these are not random Russian officials. I remember, @Beast said at one stage that he will only accept anything when Rosoboronexport releases it.

Here, it is said by the chief executive of that arm.

And yet they were the same organizations that put out reports of the PLAAF buying the Su-35, which never materialized.

Also, when did Chinese media run false commentary about Su-35? Here, you have all kinds of papers. Also, quite some Chinese military officials are also quoted.

That is my point; despite all of this "talk" emanating from these supposedly-authoritative outlets, the deal never happened.

Why are you so adamant in accepting this? I think you are overestimating yourself due to your ego, which will be very wrong. Don't underestimate anyone.

China was smacked like anything by Imperial Japan, even though it was only a small fraction economically.

What "acceptance" is being referenced here, and what does the Sino-Japanese war have to with this?