Chengdu J-10 Multirole Fighter Air Craft News & Discussions

[hk299792458]

I already told you to bring it on.

Well, I didn't want to end you up that quick, as you bring me a lot of fun, but it's time to go to bed, 5h30 in the morning it's "late".

So, let's remind everyone what you said before :

But J-10B never used PESA; it used AESA from the day one.

Now, would you mind to translate clearly what is written in this picture, so that everyone could understand well ?

And, actually it is not difficult to understand, except the fact that you didn't want to listen to us since the begining... If you come back to the original video of the academician of CETC, and make a link between some of his word, you will find a certain logic -

The explaination is, the first J-10Bs were (or still are) equiped with PESA radar. Then while the new AESA radar is stabilized, the coming aircrafts a re upgraded with it.

Read more, listen more, and learn more.

Have a good night, and see you next time for another funny topic.

Henri K.

 

[Tiqiu]

Well, I didn't want to end you up that quick, as you bring me a lot of fun, but it's time to go to bed, 5h30 in the morning it's "late".

Likewise. Believe me If you spend less time here and more time elsewhere, you would have achieved the financial independence a long long time ago. Since now I can live to play, so you can tag me anytime you want except on my sleeping time. It's 4 pm on my clock now.

I don't want to answer any question of yours about radar until you answer my last question to you. Just to be fair you know.

 

[帅的一匹]

You guys are rich

 

[Tiqiu]

Now, would you mind to translate clearly what is written in this picture, so that everyone could understand well ?

Just saw your other post made one week ago in which you gave this facial expression to express your thoughts of this meyet site. And now you seek materials from this site to rebut me? A certain part of the traits of yours can never stop amusing me.

Meyet...

Henri K.

BTW, I have all the answers for the questions you asked, I ll give you only after you answer this simple question: did Mr. De say “We did develope PESA. For instance, J-10 is equipted with PESA.”

 

[hk299792458]

Likewise. Believe me If you spend less time here and more time elsewhere, you would have achieved the financial independence a long long time ago. Since now I can live to play, so you can tag me anytime you want except on my sleeping time. It's 4 pm on my clock now.

I don't want to answer any question of yours about radar until you answer my last question to you. Just to be fair you know.

呵呵，既然你拉扯到我个人身上来，那我好歹都要回两句吧。

从一开始你的观点已经是错误的，如果不是看到你回应的态度有点不正常，又不肯好好思考和接纳星海和我所提的论据，我本来是可以直接给你答案的，而不是逗着你来玩儿。

你们中国广东一带好像有一句谚语说：脸是人家给的，架是自己丢的。

你好好自己想去，不要四十好几的也是这样少年心态，人太冲不好。

看事情不要以偏概全，要连成一片来想。谁对谁错，群众的眼睛是雪亮的。别再给我一个外国人看你笑话。

好了，该说不该说的我都已经说了，你本来的问题也已经有了答案，自己去好好反省一下。下次有什么好玩的再聊，世界上又不止是你一个经济独立，在澳大利亚搞房地产的吗？

Henri K.

 

[帅的一匹]

Easy, easy guys!

 

[Tiqiu]

呵呵，既然你拉扯到我个人身上来，那我好歹都要回两句吧。

从一开始你的观点已经是错误的，如果不是看到你回应的态度有点不正常，又不肯好好思考和接纳星海和我所提的论据，我本来是可以直接给你答案的，而不是逗着你来玩儿。

So now you admit you have been mocking with me all along? Is this your understandings of "be respectful" to me and others by doing what you are doing now?

All your evidences and proving were based on that ifeng video containing Mr De's words. All you need to do is just say if Mr.De said "We did develope PESA. For instance, J-10 is equipted with PESA”.

Any people have knowledge about China know ifeng( or other local TVs) are not official PLA channel. And Mr.De is not the only expert in radar field, the interview I provided bear equal, if not more weight because it was made by the Deputy chief designer of AWACS and the researcher at China Electronic Technology Group Corporation.

So if you enjoyed your so called "mocking with me", I enjoy it too if no objection from others.

你们中国广东一带好像有一句谚语说：脸是人家给的，架是自己丢的。

Don't know if it is from Cantonese, but I understand the meaning of it quite well. That is why I was often invited to participate events that some could only dream of.

visiting CPC Central Committee Party School (中共中央党校)

paying tribute to Xi's father

你好好自己想去，不要四十好几的也是这样少年心态，人太冲不好。

You should overcome your compulsion for making assumption. I wish I am still "四十好几"; "人太冲不好" doesn't work on me.

看事情不要以偏概全，要连成一片来想。谁对谁错，群众的眼睛是雪亮的。别再给我一个外国人看你笑话。

Exactly people following our discussion outright would and will be able to make a judgement of their own. We can always re-visit here again when time is right.

"You are the laughing stock for foreigners now", seriously? You really meant to say this? But actually i think it is the another way around. I quite envy the affection between you and your mate and enjoy the couple dance opera (二人转).

好了，该说不该说的我都已经说了，你本来的问题也已经有了答案，自己去好好反省一下。下次有什么好玩的再聊，世界上又不止是你一个经济独立，在澳大利亚搞房地产的吗？

No, that is too boring, no challenge. We are one of the world leading listed strategic metal mining co.s and producers.


Given you are someone who maybe older, plus you are caring what happens in China, so out of courtesy, I will break my words and answer the questions you raised once more.

Now, would you mind to translate clearly what is written in this picture, so that everyone could understand well ?

It only reads:"J-10B PESA Fire Control Radar"

Assume it is genuine, it does not prove that J-10B is equipped with a China-developed PESA. It doesn't specify the model name of this radar. For instance,behind the nameplate you can put a Zhuk-F/Zhuk-PH radar, a radar was developed starting in the late 80's featuring a PESA antenna instead of a slotted planar array, and never made it into service or out of development despite being offered for export.

In a same way, If you put an AF-31F engine behind the nameplate of "J-10A engine" and don't show the engine image, can you assume the engine " China-made"?

I asked you to translate the interview given by Cao Chen, Deputy chief designer of AWACS, researcher at China Electronic Technology Group Corporation on the official PLA news channel " Ordnance Knowledge"-兵器知识, but you were unwilling to do it. So I will do it for you just to make it a record here for others to judge.

The interview is in this edition of Ordnance Knowledge.

My translation of his first two sentences(from the beginning to the second full stop)

Cao: At present in the world, it has become a common trend that airborne radars are developed towards the direction of an Active Electronically Scanned Array(AESA), it is so either for airborne early warning radars, or for airborne fire control radars, both of which are the main field of airborne radars 。Using the development of airborne early warning radar as a breaking point, our country achieved the leap forward from mechanically-scanned to AESA for our airborne radar system, without developing PESA, became the first country in the world to equip a two-dimensional AESA (for early waring & control), in other words the radar wave can scan horizontally and vertically, which drove the use of the AESA on fighter jets 。

Although he is not yet an Academician of Chinese Academy of Engineering like Mr. De, but he is the prominent researcher at the head office of the 14th institute. And if you truly have knowledge about China, you know sometimes these young people are doing better jobs than some Academician of Chinese Academy of Engineering.

After Felcon was cancelled in 2000, Tikhomirov NIIP provided a model of PESA radar for testing. Are you aware of that?

 

[hk299792458]

@Tiqiu to be honnest I didn't read through your answer, especially when I see theater picture which has nothing to do with the topics in this forum.

Start from the original point which, I remind once again what you said to @Deino, which is FALSE :

But J-10B never used PESA; it used AESA from the day one.

And you lost the right to talk about "respect" with me once you've pronounced this kind of things first :

not from a pseudo-journalist in Chinese military affairs like you.
The difference between Deino and you is he lacks of audacity than you .

Sounded very Impressive. But your contribution here didn't seem to add up to your claim.Or maybe you just enjoy free-riding.
You didn't read the comments of your reader on your site, did you? And without the lead and info provided by many your socalled "fanboys" here, you have nothing to write about the Chinese military affairs.

I knew you would hide behind your mate's shadow waiting for @星海军事 to answer for you , that is why I asked you to quote what the man said in that video. You are too predictable.

You provided nothing since you just gave me a link of a video which you could not understand a single word of it.

Now I would also add a picture :

Recognize your error first, then I can teah you something useful, especially help you to understand the difference between a fire control radar and an AWACS one.

Henri K.

 

[Tiqiu]

Start from the original point which, I remind once again what you said to @Deino, which is FALSE :

Everybody here would understand "used" means " equipped" in my conversation with Deino about the difference of the J-10B and C but you.

The picture has everything to do with our discussion since I have a strong hunch about something awkward between you and your mates after your long reply above in Chinese. By the way do you want me to translate it to others to see if you were trolling or not?

And you lost the right to talk about "respect" with me once you've pronounced this kind of things first :

Talking about first , then who said the following before our conversation even started?

I always ask myself why there is always a small group of fanboys who just can't listen to the fact, and prefer believe what they want to believe ?

A real strange phenomenon for me.

then who said these

now young boy

But if you want to continue this game, be sure that I'll be here. For the time being I've a lot of time to lose.

Now, if you have difficulties in understanding your mother tongue, I can give you some courses for free.

Very pleased to continue with you, young boy of 40 years-old... At least I got a lot of fun.

You know you are a funny guys ? Do you understand why I call you young boy now ?

You know you are funny young boy ?

Don't worry, this game can last for years... Ready ?

不要四十好几的也是这样少年心态，人太冲不好。

Henri K.

As usual, you diverted from facing my questions again as expected.To save time for all, Just say if this statement made by your mate true or not?
“We did develope PESA. For instance, J-10 is equipted with PESA.” -- N.A. Ben De, chief designer of the 14th institute, first man of Chinese phased array radar

 

[hk299792458]

Everybody here would understand "used" means " equipped" in my conversation with Deino about the difference of the J-10B and C but you.

The picture has everything to do with our discussion since I have a strong hunch about something awkward between you and your mates after your long reply above in Chinese. By the way do you want me to translate it to others to see if you were trolling or not?


Talking about first , then who said the following before our conversation even started?


then who said these








As usual, you diverted from facing my questions again as expected.To save time for all, Just say if this statement made by your mate true or not?
“We did develope PESA. For instance, J-10 is equipted with PESA.” -- N.A. Ben De, chief designer of the 14th institute, first man of Chinese phased array radar

Dont' divert and recognize your error in the original point which, I remind once again what you said to @Deino, which is FALSE :

But J-10B never used PESA; it used AESA from the day one.

And don't revert the reality, I started to say funny things with you AFTER your disrespectful words. Since then, you lost the right to talk about "respect" with me, even for now.

As far as you didn't admit your initial error, our conversation can last for years and years. And I will remind in each conversation the same point.

Henri K.

 

[AlyxMS]

I'm impressed by your patience, Henri K.

I nearly abandoned this forum months ago when these fanboys started attacking "foreigners" for saying something that contradicts their claims.

Of course I tried to change their minds by quoting some facts, and as expected it had absolutely no effect on them.

Now every time someone without a Chinese flag under their avatar says something they disagree, they'll immediately jump to the standard response of "I speak Chinese, you don't, so I have access to more sources." I guess it's a good thing that I am Chinese so I don't get this "standard treatment".

As you see here, they'll never change their mind nor will they show you their "secrete Chinese source", even when they are surrounded by your sources and references.

I'm sure deep in their mind, they know they screwd up and was wrong about a lot of things, but they can't admit it because they don't want to "lose face".

I agree with you that the mods are being a bit too easy on them. Although tolerance is a good thing as it encourages criticism and allows people to present opinions that differ from the majority, but at this point they are driving actual Chinese military enthusiasts away from here. It is no longer possible to have a discussion here without being attacked on a personal or national level.

But seems like you have plenty of time and you are getting some enjoyment from this, so keep going, I guess.

 

[Deino]

@AlyxMS

Thank You so much for Your post !

 

[Akasa]

I'm impressed by your patience, Henri K.

I nearly abandoned this forum months ago when these fanboys started attacking "foreigners" for saying something that contradicts their claims.

Of course I tried to change their minds by quoting some facts, and as expected it had absolutely no effect on them.

Now every time someone without a Chinese flag under their avatar says something they don't disagree, they'll immediately jump to the standard response of "I speak Chinese, you don't, so I have access to more sources." I guess it's a good thing that I am Chinese so I don't get this "standard treatment".

As you see here, they'll never change their mind nor will they show you their "secrete Chinese source", even when they are surrounded by your sources and references.

I'm sure deep in their mind, they know they screwd up and was wrong about a lot of things, but they can't admit it because they don't want to "lose face".

I agree with you that the mods are being a bit too easy on them. Although tolerance is a good thing as it encourages criticism and allows people to present opinions that differ from the majority, but at this point they are driving actual Chinese military enthusiasts away from here. It is no longer possible to have a discussion here without attack on a personal or national level.

But seems like you have plenty of time and you are getting some enjoyment from this, so keep going, I guess.

After being accused of being an Indian "false-flagger", I fully concur with what you've observed. It's as if these people are completely closed to opinions different from their own (which is why so few forums are of good quality anymore).

 

[Tiqiu]

Dont' divert and recognize your error in the original point which, I remind once again what you said to @Deino, which is FALSE :

You were showing me you couldn't not help but make your foolish assumption again.

I will always stick to that the statement made by @星海军事 "Therefore, the only fighter that is equiped with PESA fire control radar ought to be J-10B" is wrong.

I will always stick to what I said " But J-10B never used PESA; it used AESA from the day one." made in my rebuttal that J-10B is not equipped with PESA based on this.

And don't revert the reality, I started to say funny things with you AFTER your disrespectful words. Since then, you lost the right to talk about "respect" with me, even for now.

Now I think you are a funny man now. Do you really understand the caption words in the images?
First: for instance on our J-10
Second: It used to use it
So is this your only evidence to support " J-10B is equipped with China-developed PESA"?

Like me give you a quick walk through history about China's radar development:
1) China's radar R&D and production facilities(including institute 14, 607) were set up by the help of the USSR back in 60s
2) China developed its own PD airborne radar KLJ-1 in 80s but still kept using NO01E/P PD imported from Russia
3)in 1997 China got one PERO PESA from Russia to update NO01 to NO01EPF (PESA)
4) in 2000 China also got one ZHUK-MSFE SKOL antenna from NIIP
5) in 2008, as China made a break through on AESA and tested on jets. so China -Russia co-op on PESA stopped

So because that J-10 did try some PERO PESA in the past, it doesn't mean It is quipped with PESA.

I'm impressed by your patience, Henri K.

I nearly abandoned this forum months ago when these fanboys started attacking "foreigners" for saying something that contradicts their claims.

Of course I tried to change their minds by quoting some facts, and as expected it had absolutely no effect on them.

Now every time someone without a Chinese flag under their avatar says something they disagree, they'll immediately jump to the standard response of "I speak Chinese, you don't, so I have access to more sources." I guess it's a good thing that I am Chinese so I don't get this "standard treatment".

As you see here, they'll never change their mind nor will they show you their "secrete Chinese source", even when they are surrounded by your sources and references.

I'm sure deep in their mind, they know they screwd up and was wrong about a lot of things, but they can't admit it because they don't want to "lose face".

I agree with you that the mods are being a bit too easy on them. Although tolerance is a good thing as it encourages criticism and allows people to present opinions that differ from the majority, but at this point they are driving actual Chinese military enthusiasts away from here. It is no longer possible to have a discussion here without being attacked on a personal or national level.

But seems like you have plenty of time and you are getting some enjoyment from this, so keep going, I guess.

I am not surprised at all that someone like you would always find a way to stand out from the rest in the right moment.
What has surprised my is your poor skills to back your claims, compared to your excellent marketing tactics.

 

[hk299792458]

You were showing me you couldn't not help but make your foolish assumption again.

I will always stick to that the statement made by @星海军事 "Therefore, the only fighter that is equiped with PESA fire control radar ought to be J-10B" is wrong.

I will always stick to what I said " But J-10B never used PESA; it used AESA from the day one." made in my rebuttal that J-10B is not equipped with PESA based on this.

Now I think you are a funny man now. Do you really understand the caption words in the images?
First: for instance on our J-10
Second: It used to use it
So is this your only evidence to support " J-10B is equipped with China-developed PESA"?

Like me give you a quick walk through history about China's radar development:
1) China's radar R&D and production facilities(including institute 14, 607) were set up by the help of the USSR back in 60s
2) China developed its own PD airborne radar KLJ-1 in 80s but still kept using NO01E/P PD imported from Russia
3)in 1997 China got one PERO PESA from Russia to update NO01 to NO01EPF (PESA)
4) in 2000 China also got one ZHUK-MSFE SKOL antenna from NIIP
5) in 2008, as China made a break through on AESA and tested on jets. so China -Russia co-op on PESA stopped

So because that J-10 did try some PERO PESA in the past, it doesn't mean It is quipped with PESA.
View attachment 361189 View attachment 361190


I am not surprised at all that someone like you would always find a way to stand out from the rest in the right moment.
What has surprised my is your poor skills to back your claims, compared to your excellent marketing tactics.

Dont' divert and recognize your error in the original point which, I remind once again what you said to @Deino, which is FALSE :

But J-10B never used PESA; it used AESA from the day one.

Learn first there is a huge difference between AWACS radar (that you quoted) and fire control radar (that's the topic here). Once you can't understand this point, all other arguments you could say are pull shit.

And, as far as you didn't admit your initial error, our conversation can last for years and years. And I will remind in each conversation the same point.

Henri K.

P.S. I see that you know at least copy an old post from 小飞猪 dated 2012 ? You see, you started to do some information research. Go ahead, you can nearly proof that your initial point is FALSE.