Carter: China Isolating Itself in Pacific

[rcrmj]

Very few countries today are getting along well with China in ASEAN. Almost all are giving US support in the region. Many are trying to hedge against China by all means, economically, politically, strategically.

in your vivid dream lol

there are way more countries call America the 'enemy' than China would be called```it is only matter of time for U.S to pack up and go home with regards, and all those little trouble makers will be put where they really belong

commerce is the foundation of all that matters between countries```unless you are living in a deluded world called Utopia

 

[Bussard Ramjet]

in your vivid dream lol

there are way more countries call America the 'enemy' than China would be called```it is only matter of time for U.S to pack up and go home with regards, and all those little trouble makers will be put where they really belong

commerce is the foundation of all that matters between countries```unless you are living in a deluded world called Utopia

Are you habitually stupid? I know for a fact that Chinese leaders are very smart. Thank God China doesn't have democracy, or idiots like you will get a chance in influencing policy, and that will be horrendously wrong for China.

 

[Bussard Ramjet]

I love China's new stance.... There are efforts to industrialize India from US and Japan with science and Tech cooperation and Intergovernmental groups working on sectors like robotics to defence......... Thanks China.... JICA is also investing in 11 Industrial zones.


Due to the one child policy a lot of chinese have grown up a) Absolutely spoiled and b) With reduced family circle of cousins etc. The effects of this on the society are undocumented. I have a sister and 5 1st cousins. can't imagine life without them.

Your second paragraph is as much bull shit as the guy I replied to. One child policy for a limited period, until 2005, was a good policy. The effect on children is that they are provided with more resources. Some are spoiled as well, hence the tradition of spoiled prince and princesses.

 

[70U63]

Of course they wish everyone to isolate China, but everyone is busy making business with China while having too much internal shxt to deal with

 

[rcrmj]

Of course they wish everyone to isolate China, but everyone is busy making business with China while having too much internal shxt to deal with

lol exactly, I think these lot got too much time to delude themselves in this and that hypotheses

 

[AugenBlick]

Your second paragraph is as much bull shit as the guy I replied to. One child policy for a limited period, until 2005, was a good policy. The effect on children is that they are provided with more resources. Some are spoiled as well, hence the tradition of spoiled prince and princesses.

Umm no .... these things have a profound social effects that are not easy to grasp. The feminist revolution in the west where suddenly the individual was placed at the center and family was just an add on, reduced the economic output capacity of the west. I will say it again , these things act in ways you can only make sense in hindsight. give it a few decades. All the press in the West says they are unable to get the birthrate up as it is a problem of "attitude change". No one would have thought in the 70s they would encounter this kind of problems.

 

[TheTruth]

To be very frank, even China realizes its previous mistake of sabber-rattling worked against its interests. It has made all the neighbors nervous, and led them to the US camp.

Before 2012, China had the image of a responsible partner, and nation. US was the one who had lost all credibility. Today the reverse is happening in Asia.

Most Asian nations are pro-Chinese. That's a fact you'll have to live with. Singapore and Malaysia are not calling for more US action, not broadly. The fact is, Singapore and Malaysia will both pick China any day of the year if forced to choose sides.

Umm no .... these things have a profound social effects that are not easy to grasp. The feminist revolution in the west where suddenly the individual was placed at the center and family was just an add on, reduced the economic output capacity of the west. I will say it again , these things act in ways you can only make sense in hindsight. give it a few decades. All the press in the West says they are unable to get the birthrate up as it is a problem of "attitude change". No one would have thought in the 70s they would encounter this kind of problems.

They mean "spoiled" by Chinese standards. The typical overseas Indian or Western brat is considered insufferable to all Chinese societies.

 

[Bussard Ramjet]

Most Asian nations are pro-Chinese. That's a fact you'll have to live with.

Apart from Pakistan, I don't find any nation pro-Chinese. Perhaps, North Korea, but do you even count that as a Nation?

Japan- very anti-China
Korea- neutral China, still allied with US, and its anti-China alliance
Mongolia- anti-China, but since it is surrounded and can't do much, it is bound to be neutral-China
Taiwan- very anti-China, though not a nation, I write about it here, because it is a defacto state, and also supported by US, which can use it for all kinds of things.

Vietnam- Very anti-China
Philippines- Very anti-China
Malaysia- neutral to weary about China
Singapore- neutral to weary about China
Indonesia - neutral China, but the civil society of Indonesia is weary China.
Thailand- neutral to pro China, population also, neutral to pro China, Chinese perceptions soiled by bad behavior of Chinese tourists

Myanmar- neutral to weary China, population weary China, they seriously are made to believe by the junta that all the problems in border areas has been fostered by Chinese.

India- weary to anti China, civil society and security establishment- very anti China

Australia- weary China

Most Asian nations are pro-Chinese. That's a fact you'll have to live with. Singapore and Malaysia are not calling for more US action, not broadly. The fact is, Singapore and Malaysia will both pick China any day of the year if forced to choose sides.



They mean "spoiled" by Chinese standards. The typical overseas Indian or Western brat is considered insufferable to all Chinese societies.

Manners please. You could have delivered your message without using "brat."

 

[TheTruth]

@Bussard Ramjet

Korea is allied with the US against North Korea. Not China.
Mongolia sells almost all of her natural resources to China. Whether or not some drunken idiots hate Chinese people is irrelevant.
Taiwan is the Republic of China. They support Chinese claims to the SCS and have low-key cooperation there.

I have no idea whatsoever where you got your information on Sing/MY/Indonesia and Thailand. You're dead wrong here, not only are overwhelming majority of their respective publics pro-China, their elites are especially so.

You also forgot most of India's neighbors, who all like China more than India, or the States. Then there are Central Asians, who have been cooperative on every single one of China's strategic goals.

And it's laughable hearing the likes of "AugenBlick" call Chinese children spoiled.

 

[terranMarine]

That Indian kid really have some issues especially declaring himself a future Sinologist. What makes him come to the conclusion the Mongolian, South Korean and the majority of SEA governments are anti China to begin with?

 

[Bussard Ramjet]

@Bussard Ramjet

Korea is allied with the US against North Korea. Not China.
Mongolia sells almost all of her natural resources to China. Whether or not some drunken idiots hate Chinese people is irrelevant.
Taiwan is the Republic of China. They support Chinese claims to the SCS and have low-key cooperation there.

I have no idea whatsoever where you got your information on Sing/MY/Indonesia and Thailand. You're dead wrong here, not only are overwhelming majority of their respective publics pro-China, their elites are especially so.

You also forgot most of India's neighbors, who all like China more than India, or the States. Then there are Central Asians, who have been cooperative on every single one of China's strategic goals.

And it's laughable hearing the likes of "AugenBlick" call Chinese children spoiled.

Korea is allied with US, and US combat troops are present in Korean territory. Not only this, there is unprecendented military links, and one can say that if hell break loose, Korea will side with US, for its territory will anyways be used by US in combat. (Also, Korea is allied with US to protect itself. The enemy isn't mentioned apart from North Korea, but at one China was implicitly included)

Mongolia- The feeling of being entrapped by China is deep seated. And I completely concur, that Mongolia is in no position to alter any calculus, or make any meaningful change.

Taiwan- Their is a whole army supported by the US, whose only apparent purpose is to hold back PLA. Also, if the current KMT government goes, you will get a DPP government that is totally anti-China, and will eagerly invite US in.

Singapore PM and Government host US military bases, and keep urging regular US patrols. Singaporeans in general don't identify with China. Also, all governments are inviting US to continue presence in the region. Hence, I said neutral to weary. Weary means slightly scared or concerned.

That Indian kid really have some issues especially declaring himself a future Sinologist. What makes him come to the conclusion the Mongolian, South Korean and the majority of SEA governments are anti China to begin with?

When did I say Mongolian or Korean government are anti-China?

My exact statement for Mongolia is, "anti-China, but since it is surrounded and can't do much, it is bound to be neutral-China"

Which means that out of necessity, Mongolia is neutral China, yet the overall populace has deep rooted fears of losing their sovereignty, and of being too dependent on China etc.

 

[TheTruth]

@Bussard Ramjet

China is not going to attack the US. So if "all hell breaks loose" it means the US has attacked China. NO COUNTRY in Asia will support this, knowing they'll be utterly destroyed if they do.

The DPP absolutely will not invite the US in, unless they want to be thrown out on their asses. The military is deep, deep blue.

Singapore gives the US lipservice and is accommodating but they do it for financial reasons. They absolutely will never go to war with China and to think otherwise borders on insanity. Singaporeans in general, as in SPGs and other sell-out scum, do not represent Singapore's elites such as LKY who were notably not anti-China.

 

[Namin]

I didn't underestimate anything, you are being influenced by these American nationalists, who else would post on here, the problem is far smaller than it is.

The 9 dash line isn't even understood, or if it is, not being talked about the right way by these guys, they drum up these non existent threats that we pose when in reality it is not true.

China isn't looking to take Indian land in reality, or else things would be vastly different. China isn't using military vessels in South China Sea, and China is negotiating with Japan clearly as we speak.

Some like to increase the "threat" we pose and the "threat" others feel, but in reality it's hardly like that.

If the actual threat was as big as that, then I agree, but it's not, hence my confidence in my statements.



The US is the reigning super power, we be going against them either way if we want our place in the sun. Their 11 carriers isn't going to disappear because they don't have 500 guys and gals in some Philippines island.

What needs to be said is that having bases increase one's ability to project their forces, it doesn't increase their force. As long as we find solutions for all 11 carriers, which we would need to regardless of where they are, what does it matter if they have some bases here and there.

The imagined 9 dash line can not be understood.
China claims that they own the sea inside 9 dash line from Han dynasty but just 200 years ago, when we are at the sea, we can not know exactly where we are. So even we are right above the 9 dash line, we also don't know. In the ground, people can use some marks to specify the borderline but in the sea, we cannot without modern technology. However China claimed based on Historic evidences from two thousands years ago.
China also don't explain why inside the 9 dash line, there were Chinese Historic activities but outside the 9 dash line there were not. Coordinates of each dot was also not clear.
And importantly just 200 years ago, Even If Chinese Emperor went to the sea, He also didn't know where are the positions of that imagined borderline. Even Zheng Hua crossed over that imagined borderline, he also can not recognize.
Remember that we only know where we are in the sea to respect the EEZ with the help of modern GPS. That's why there was no concept of sea borderline in the past.
Only Chinese think they can specify a borderline in the sea from hundreds years ago.

 

[TheTruth]

@Namin

China doesn't claim the entire sea.

 

[Raphael]

Great to see the mods have taken action against OP's title manipulation. Next time, try to work within the rules and norms of the system. Don't be a pariah.