Carl Vinson Carrier Strike Group Checks in to US 5th Fleet

[SvenSvensonov]

Excellent to hear. I've been reading about the contingency responses to DF-21 threats; most importantly to carriers. This is a concern for us because we are currently expect to utilize the Izumo Light Carriers for operations abroad as well as in the Pacific. The DF-21 is a concern, but I hope SM-3s and SM-6s can take care of such a threat.

In regards to THAAD, this becomes useful. I hope that with the American placement of THAAD systems in South Korea, this can take care of any ballistic missile threats coming from Shenyang, Beijing, Jinan and Nanjing Military Regions. Practically neutralizing any threats from the Eastern Seaboard.

I just hope that a deployment to South Korea actually happens. Sites have been scouted, talks held, but something (wink, wink) has been holding up the process with its fears of encirclement. Still, it would represent a major boost to the regional missile defense capabilities of Japan, South Korea and the US personal, all of whom would be covered by the system.

 

[F-22Raptor]

Several US systems such as THAAD, Aegis Ashore and SM-3 have been successfully tested against medium and intermediate range ballistic missiles. The DF-21D falls under these catagories. The US uses the "Hera" rocket as its medium/intermediate range ballistic missile stand in. The Hera is a combination of the Minuteman II and the Pershing II (the inspiration for the DF-21D and a missile that was planned to become an anti-ship ballistic missile prior to several arms limitation treaties with the Soviets/Russians. The Hera can mimic the flight profile of the DF-21D.

The SM-6 is an evolution of the SM-2 (same body, but the seeker of the AIM-120 C, just enlarged by 6 inches (cubed)). It has a longer range, higher speed and more advanced seeker than the SM-3, testing is ongoing for its anti-missile properties. While I don't have too much information, I would suspect that the SM-6 also has interception capabilities.

Hera

This link provides info on the Hera, though it's limited.

THAAD Missile Test Successful | Video Library | Defense News

The video at the preceding link was a test of the THAAD and one that tested it's effectiveness against "a short range missile", several test have also been done against larger and more maneuverable ballistic missiles (i'll try to dig up some videos).

The success of THAAD is also another reason why we're looking to deploy a THAAD battery to South Korea.

 

[Aepsilons]

The success of THAAD is also another reason why we're looking to deploy a THAAD battery to South Korea.

South Korea has to learn and remember its role in this trilateral alliance system. The administration under Park Geun-hye need to remember that they are still living under a state of war with the North Korean establishment. Who themselves are fueled , protected, encouraged, and stroked by Beijing. This is a precarious situation. South Korea and Japan, as East Asian states have cultural and economic relations and high output activity with China, but we have to be pragmatic about the entire equation. China benefits from its favorable position it has with Tokyo and Beijing (total trilateral trade between Japan-China-S.Korea stands around $670 billion per annum). But at the same time, it is a strategic competitor and threat. The nuclear armament of Nokor is because of the Chinese, and they use the Nokor as a pawn for their proxy engagement with Sokor and Japan. Sokor has to understand the realities of the situation; and the passing of any FTA between Sokor and China is irrelevant if the latter still provides military and political support to the North Koreans.

South Korea must remember its responsibilities first. Park and other Korean politicians are milking the Japanese history situation for their own political agenda; but this is, holistically, damaging the cohesion and dynamic of the trilateral alliance between Japan-US-Sokor. In fact, South Korea exists as a state because of the sacrifices of the United States and the United Nations during the Korean War. They need to remember that. They exist because of the United States. And their industrial capacity is due to the huge investments Japan had made on Korea when it was an Imperial Colony of the Japanese Empire for 50 years; not to mention the technology transfers Japan gave to Korea during the post-war years.

But , of course, they forget these acts. And choose to remember the historical aspects.

 

[F-22Raptor]

Excellent to hear. I've been reading about the contingency responses to DF-21 threats; most importantly to carriers. This is a concern for us because we are currently expect to utilize the Izumo Light Carriers for operations abroad as well as in the Pacific. The DF-21 is a concern, but I hope SM-3s and SM-6s can take care of such a threat.

In regards to THAAD, this becomes useful. I hope that with the American placement of THAAD systems in South Korea, this can take care of any ballistic missile threats coming from Shenyang, Beijing, Jinan and Nanjing Military Regions. Practically neutralizing any threats from the Eastern Seaboard.

As I've said previously, the US can intercept any type of Chinese missile. The problem is that China will rely on saturation attacks, which is why we've seen a large increase in their ballistic an cruise missile arsenals. Saturation is nothing new...the Soviets used the same tactic. It's why I support the development of Japans own arsenal to counteract China's.

 

[Aepsilons]

As I've said previously, the US can intercept any type of Chinese missile. The problem is that China will rely on saturation attacks, which is why we've seen a large increase in their ballistic an cruise missile arsenals. Saturation is nothing new...the Soviets used the same tactic. It's why I support the development of Japans own arsenal to counteract China's.

To address this situation, I hope that the Japanese-American Alliance will realize the following necessities:

1) Japanese Self Defense Force must implement a 'First Strike Initiative'

2) Allow Offensive Capabilities on all maritime units of the JMSDF; ergo, implementation of cruise missiles

3) Introduce land base SM-3s , SM-6s throughout the Japanese Main Islands

4) Development of Japan's own Ballistic Missile Program. This will effectively inhibit any Sino-Russian threat.

 

[SvenSvensonov]

As I've said previously, the US can intercept any type of Chinese missile. The problem is that China will rely on saturation attacks, which is why we've seen a large increase in their ballistic an cruise missile arsenals. Saturation is nothing new...the Soviets used the same tactic. It's why I support the development of Japans own arsenal to counteract China's.

Yep, back in the day it was swarms of barely guided, high-speed cruise missiles. We learned to deal with it. Now it's swarms of high precision, high-speed cruise missiles and ballistic missiles. We learned to deal with it. LPH-10 is used as a launch pad for ballistic missiles on interception testing over water, perhaps a few tests were designed to test the US response to ASBMs. Also, and I'm sure you know this so it's not directly directed at you, just a bit of information for those interested, but the US has super sonic, maneuverable target drones and missiles that it uses for weapons testing. There isn't a lot of information about the most recent, but for those interested previous US Navy supersonic target drones include the;

Beech BQM-126

AQM-37(C) EP Drone Target

and the most recent

ATK reveals details, export interest in supersonic target drone - 1/13/2011 - Flight Global

so it's not as if supersonic, manuverable missiles are either new or unexpected or unplanned for.

 

[F-22Raptor]

To address this situation, I hope that the Japanese-American Alliance will realize the following necessities:

1) Japanese Self Defense Force must implement a 'First Strike Initiative'

2) Allow Offensive Capabilities on all maritime units of the JMSDF; ergo, implementation of cruise missiles

3) Introduce land base SM-3s , SM-6s throughout the Japanese Main Islands

4) Development of Japan's own Ballistic Missile Program. This will effectively inhibit any Sino-Russian threat.

The US Army has also recently discussed deploying mobile ground based anti-ship missiles to the Western Pacific at key shipping lanes. This is just in the early stages though.

 

[Aepsilons]

Yep, back in the day it was swarms of barely guided, high-speed cruise missiles. We learned to deal with it. Now it's swarms of high precision, high-speed cruise missiles and ballistic missiles. We learned to deal with it. LPH-10 is used as a launch pad for ballistic missiles on interception testings over waters, perhaps a few tests were designed to test the US response to ASBMs. Also, and I'm sure you know this so it's not directly directed at you, just a bit of information for those interested, but the US has super sonic, maneuverable target drones and missiles that is uses for weapons testing. There isn't a lot of information about the most recent, but for those interested previous US Navy supersonic target drones include the;

Beech BQM-126

AQM-37(C) EP Drone Target

and the most recent

ATK reveals details, export interest in supersonic target drone - 1/13/2011 - Flight Global

so it's not as if supersonic, manuverable missiles are either new or unexpected or unplanned for.

Thanks for these links, @SvenSvensonov . Just very humbling to see how advanced US military technology really is.

 

[F-22Raptor]

Yep, back in the day it was swarms of barely guided, high-speed cruise missiles. We learned to deal with it. Now it's swarms of high precision, high-speed cruise missiles and ballistic missiles. We learned to deal with it. LPH-10 is used as a launch pad for ballistic missiles on interception testings over waters, perhaps a few tests were designed to test the US response to ASBMs. Also, and I'm sure you know this so it's not directly directed at you, just a bit of information for those interested, but the US has super sonic, maneuverable target drones and missiles that is uses for weapons testing. There isn't a lot of information about the most recent, but for those interested previous US Navy supersonic target drones include the;

Beech BQM-126

AQM-37(C) EP Drone Target

and the most recent

ATK reveals details, export interest in supersonic target drone - 1/13/2011 - Flight Global

so it's not as if supersonic, manuverable missiles are either new or unexpected or unplanned for.

I have no doubt we've been testing against supersonic target missiles/vehicles and successfully at that, but our ships can fire only so many missiles before we have to reload.

 

[SvenSvensonov]

I have no doubt we've been testing against supersonic target missiles/vehicles and successfully at that, but our ships can fire only so many missiles before we have to reload.

And that still the greatest danger. We can deflect, destroy or diminish the threat of many missiles, but China and Russia and Iran have many more than our ships do or can muster. And this is why we have tactics designed to counter these threats, though there is no way in hell I'll discuss those here on PDF.

 

[Genesis]

To address this situation, I hope that the Japanese-American Alliance will realize the following necessities:

1) Japanese Self Defense Force must implement a 'First Strike Initiative'

2) Allow Offensive Capabilities on all maritime units of the JMSDF; ergo, implementation of cruise missiles

3) Introduce land base SM-3s , SM-6s throughout the Japanese Main Islands

4) Development of Japan's own Ballistic Missile Program. This will effectively inhibit any Sino-Russian threat.

I'm not going to say whether you should or not, or whether I like it or not, but I'll say this, China and Russia has this and more, is it deterring anyone? You or US?

Why would we fear it if you have it?

Oh and you are either way overestimating the Japanese capability or underestimating Chinese ones, or Russian ones, but this isn't the place to discuss that. Unless you want to.

 

[F-22Raptor]

To address this situation, I hope that the Japanese-American Alliance will realize the following necessities:

1) Japanese Self Defense Force must implement a 'First Strike Initiative'

2) Allow Offensive Capabilities on all maritime units of the JMSDF; ergo, implementation of cruise missiles

3) Introduce land base SM-3s , SM-6s throughout the Japanese Main Islands

4) Development of Japan's own Ballistic Missile Program. This will effectively inhibit any Sino-Russian threat.

I want to add that Japan doesn't have to go missile to missile with China. Japans force just needs to be large enough to pose unacceptable costs to Chinese forces.

 

[SvenSvensonov]

I want to add that Japan doesn't have to go missile to missile with China. Japans force just needs to be large enough to pose unacceptable costs to Chinese forces.

Just like Vietnam war was for the US, if Chinese people refuse to work and start rioting at the economic and man cost of a war, the war will end more quickly. I don't see a lot of political, economic or civilian interest in a war so if one broke out I would expect the public backlash in both Japan, the US and China to be immense (even if the hawks on PDF indicate otherwise).

 

[Aepsilons]

I want to add that Japan doesn't have to go missile to missile with China. Japans force just needs to be large enough to pose unacceptable costs to Chinese forces.

It behooves me to think that some Chinese members would think it necessary for Japan to build as many as China or Russia. Just enough that would make China and Russia think twice about considering anything irreversible.

 

[SvenSvensonov]

It behooves me to think that some Chinese members would think it necessary for Japan to build as many as China or Russia. Just enough that would make China and Russia think twice about considering anything irreversible.

The US didn't need to build more aircraft to achieve parity with the Soviets, just better ones. Quality reduces the need for quantity and Japanese military arms are of very high quality.