Britain declares full military support to Turkey as Russia dispatches warship to the Mediterranean

[type93]

Don't be emotional bro. Starting with your first point, Who told you its only Britain who is behind Turkey on this?lol I merely mentioned Britain on this thread because it relates to my country. Apart from Great Britain, the other two main powers in NATO i.e U.S and France have also offered messages of support to Turkey and its right to defend its sovereignty against Russian aggression. France and the U.S also told Russia to focus only on ISIS instead of violating Turkey's borders for no good reason and bombing other Syrian rebel groups fighting ISIS. lol

. Obama, Pentagon Support Turkey’s Shooting Down Of Russian Jet | Your News Wire
Obama calls Erdoğan to express US support for Turkey’s self-defense
France, Italy support 'global agreement' with Turkey | Europe | Worldbulletin News
Obama, Hollande urge Russia to focus Syria attacks on Islamic State| Reuters


NATO in general backs Turkey since its has been a full member since the 1950s. So it has full NATO backing, reason Russia didn't and wont retaliate. So Britain is not the only one supporting Turkey right to defend itself and its borders.

For your information Russia has been doing the same thing to several Balkan/eastern European and Scandinavian countries by violating their borders almost everyday, reason Britain, France and Germany have deployed soldiers and fighter jets to the the Balkans to defend against Russian aggression.

Britain, France deploy 8 fighter jets to Lithuania and Poland — RT News
British troops to be sent to Baltic states on long-term deployment after Russian jets intercepted | Home News | News | The Independent
Britain to station troops in Baltic region 'to deter Russian aggression' | UK news | The Guardian
The Aviationist » German Typhoons have intercepted 7 Russian Air Force combat planes over the Baltic Sea today

So stop acting like you are some sort of saint. lol Russia has been on an aggressive mood for a long time now under Putin to the point where even historically peaceful SCANDINAVIAN COUNTRIES are now bolstering their defence budgets and ties with NATO and Britain against Russian aggression/provocations.

Sweden Considers Joining UK-led Joint Expeditionary Force | socialmedia News
Sweden Signs Defense Deal With Denmark, Amid Increased Fear Of Russia
Rising Tensions Boost Nordic, Baltic Spending


As for your point about me posting graphic image. The image was clearly blurred in sensitive graphic areas since it appeared on a news websites who regulates graphic images. So i don't see why you think i did anything on that.

As for your last point about violating Syrian airspace. well, using your logic then U.S,British and French fighters will also be shot down by Russia for violating Syrian airspace. lol Your fighters shouldn't be in Syria as well, but they are there doing their job and protecting your own country's interests(which i agree with), plus Syria is a country but in name as of now, since the country is mired in civil war with many rebel groups controlling their own territory. The government is there just in name, just like Somalia. lol So you cant compare it with a country like Turkey. Moreover the UNSC(including the P5, yes Russia included. lol) has already approved the world's major powers to intervene in Syria using 'all necessary means' . So any power presence/intervention in Syria is justified and legal. Violation of Syrian airspace in this case is null and void.
UN Security Council unanimously approves 'all necessary measures' against Isil in Syria - Telegraph
.



lol My Chinese friend, since when are a spokesman for ordinary British people? lol
I know you despise the Turks because of the Uygur issue and stuffs. But what we are discussing here is different from that issue altogether. lol

Anyway, as i said several times on this forum, a small proportion of people voicing their opinions online or forums/articles/news media has nothing to do with how countries all over the world carry out their foreign policy and forge alliances. If we were to use a small(or even large) proportion of public opinion to formulate a country's foreign policy then the world will be a totally difference place today and even the most strongest allies today will be enemies.For example i don't think China and Russia will even be partners to begin with, China will stop all relations, business and trade with the U.S, Vietnam and Japan, Russia will do the same with the U.S/E.U(though we already imposed sanctions ourselves. lol), India and Pakistan would have nuke each other long time ago, Malaysia will already be at war with Singapore, Mexico will take back its Texas from the U.S by all means necessary, Venezuela wouldn't be selling even one barrel of its oil to the evil U.S. etc etc. i can go on all day.

You say only our government bribed by GCC countries does? You mean your government follows your people/public opinion/views while forging their foreign policy and protecting your country's interests? Now coming from a Chinese that will be the funniest thing ever. Using your outdated delusional logic, why doesn't your government kick out all Japanese(or if you like Japs) companies/people in your country since quite a few number of Chinese people hate Japan and don't want anything to do with the 'evil' Japanese? Instead Japan is the largest foreign investor in your home country and many Japanese companies have a large presence in China lol etc. So before lecturing others, at least be sure your home country is better.

Geo politics , partnership/cooperation between countries has NOTHING AT ALL to do with how country forge their foreign policy and go about their business with other states, PERIOD. The public can whine as much as they want, but at the end of the day the decisions are made by the leaders/MPs.

So you are willing to die for turkey even after the turkish government murdered your side worker Jacky Sutton in a airport bathroom? Then you really are a tool

 

[mike2000 is back]

So you are willing to die for turkey even after the turkish government murdered your side worker Jacky Sutton in a airport bathroom? Then you really are a tool

It doesn't matter what i think, just like it matters even less what you think. Our government will simply carry out their foreign policy regardless of what you and i think. In short what you and i think is useless/insignificant. lol Foreign policy and Geo political games are never decided by the public opinion, but by the leaders of each country. That's the sad truth.

Additionally, an attack on ANY NATO country is an attack on ALL. So doesn't matter much what i think or not. I;m just stating facts, my opinion doesn't matter one bit, just like yours. lol.

You are talking about an insignificant event that Happened to a British citizen in Turkey to justify how we should shape our foreign policy/relations with Turkey?? Jesus Christ......are you even serious mate? You sound sometimes like superboy alias @ultron .
Using your funny logic, we should have cut off all relations with China instead of hailing China as a 'Good Partner' since one of your major leaders/politicians wife murdered/poisoned a British citizen/businessman in China. What a good logic.

Gu Kailai, wife of Chinese politician Bo Xilai, admits poisoning British businessman Neil Heywood | Daily Mail Online

 

[Vergennes]

@mike2000 is back @Steve781

Well @type93 isn't that wrong. Are British soldiers ready to die for a country like Turkey ?
I don't think so. @Abingdonboy
@flamer84 @Declein Are your guys ready to die against Russia for Turkey seriously ?
@Bundeswehr Are German soldiers ready to die against Russia for Turkey ?


This ISIS-supporter country could lead us to a major conflict,and i don't want to see our boys dying for them.

 

[flamer84]

@mike2000 is back @Steve781

Well @type93 isn't that wrong. Are British soldiers ready to die for a country like Turkey ?
I don't think so. @Abingdonboy
@flamer84 @Declein Are your guys ready to die against Russia for Turkey seriously ?
@Bundeswehr Are German soldiers ready to die against Russia for Turkey ?


This ISIS-supporter country could lead us to a major conflict,and i don't want to see our boys dying for them.

This is bigger than Turkey.If Assad doesn't fall,no new gas pipelines from the ME to Europe and Russia maintains its cvasi monopoly.

 

[TurAr]

@mike2000 is back @Steve781

Well @type93 isn't that wrong. Are British soldiers ready to die for a country like Turkey ?
I don't think so. @Abingdonboy
@flamer84 @Declein Are your guys ready to die against Russia for Turkey seriously ?
@Bundeswehr Are German soldiers ready to die against Russia for Turkey ?


This ISIS-supporter country could lead us to a major conflict,and i don't want to see our boys dying for them.

As if the French soldiers are ready to die for Britain, or vice versa... Soldiers fulfill orders, they wouldn't be asked if they are ready or not. That's why NATO has been a successful deterrent against any outside agression towards its members for over 50 years.

 

[type93]

As if the French soldiers are ready to die for Britain, or vice versa... Soldiers fulfill orders, they wouldn't be asked if they are ready or not. That's why NATO has been a successful deterrent against any outside agression towards its members for over 50 years.

France isn't constantly backstabbing the alliance. Nor is it causing all the problems in the Middle East. Nor is it trying to provoke world war 3.

 

[TurAr]

France isn't constantly backstabbing the alliance. Nor is it causing all the problems in the Middle East. Nor is it trying to provoke world war 3.

Yeah whatever... But ALL the problems in MIDDLE EAST? lol that's a fvcked up accusation to make against Turkey, even for a braindead Chinese troll.

 

[mike2000 is back]

@mike2000 is back @Steve781

Well @type93 isn't that wrong. Are British soldiers ready to die for a country like Turkey ?
I don't think so. @Abingdonboy
@flamer84 @Declein Are your guys ready to die against Russia for Turkey seriously ?
@Bundeswehr Are German soldiers ready to die against Russia for Turkey ?


This ISIS-supporter country could lead us to a major conflict,and i don't want to see our boys dying for them.

As i said before, your opinion and mine doesn't matter one bit what our leaders decide to do or not. Every country foreign policy is decided by the leaders PERIOD. If public opinion or what a proportion of some people think was used to forge our foreign policy then we wont even have any relations with Saudi Arabia much less having them as our biggest arms buyer, same with France. The hell im sure many U.S citizens were against the Iraq invasion and U.S soldiers dying in Iraq. However, did that stop the U.S from invading Iraq and staying there for over a decade? NOPE. Soldiers just receive orders and follow them. The rest is secondary.

Moreover, as i said, you are not looking at the big picture here, since this is more than just about ISIS. Its more of a Geo political war/chess power play between Britain/U.S/France and Russia(with its small proxies/allies Iran/Hezbollah/Assad). If you really believe this conflict is just about ISIS then i think you must be quite naive bro. ISIS is just a small part/element of a much larger game going on in the region. As i said even France didn't offer a message of support to Turkey for nothing. You need to understand what is going on here . Plus if you don't want to die for other country in NATO THEN JUST KICK THEM OUT OF NATO. i'm sure there also some people in Greece who wouldn't want to die for Germany if Russia attacked Germany, many people in Turkey wouldn't want to die for Greece either etc etc, but that doesn't means their leaders wouldn't follow NATO rules and send in troops/support in case any of these countries was attacked irregardless of what some of their people might think.

Finally you forget ISIS isn't Russia's priority in Syria, Russia's priority is to keep bombing/targeting other Syrian rebel groups(including these fighting ISIS) and maintain its military base and its ally Assad in power, reason they have bombing these rebels far more than anything they have done against ISIS. To think Russia is in Syria because of ISIS is a huge joke. You need to look at things from the big picture mate.

 

[type93]

It doesn't matter what i think, just like it matters even less what you think. Our government will simply carry out their foreign policy regardless of what you and i think. In short what you and i think is useless/insignificant. lol Foreign policy and Geo political games are never decided by the public opinion, but by the leaders of each country. That's the sad truth.

Additionally, an attack on ANY NATO country is an attack on ALL. So doesn't matter much what i think or not. I;m just stating facts, my opinion doesn't matter one bit, just like yours. lol.

You are talking about an insignificant event that Happened to a British citizen in Turkey to justify how we should shape our foreign policy/relations with Turkey?? Jesus Christ......are you even serious mate? You sound sometimes like superboy alias @ultron .
Using your funny logic, we should have cut off all relations with China instead of hailing China as a 'Good Partner' since one of your major leaders/politicians wife murdered/poisoned a British citizen/businessman in China. What a good logic.

Gu Kailai, wife of Chinese politician Bo Xilai, admits poisoning British businessman Neil Heywood | Daily Mail Online

Article 5 states that an attack on one member would be attack on all. This was to prevent the Soviet Union from invading Western Europe . The goal posts have been move quite a bit since then as the Soviet Union no longer exists. If one member state of NATO was engaged in empire building and someone went to stop them, would article 5 still be relevant. If one member was using that membership in NATO to their advantage and wanted to build the caliph, would article 5 still be relevant? And would every NATO country want to send their troops to fight for a caliph that will eventually threaten them all one day? There needs to be some serious amendments to article 5 would you agree?

 

[saiyan0321]

NATO general did say that they would support turkey. The very concept of NATO and EU would die down if the members of these respective nations wouldn't come to the aid of their members. Thus its hardly surprising that British has announced full support for turkey..

 

[Viper0011.]

We must also stand with Greece that faced more than 2.000 violations of its airspace by Turkey in 2014 alone !

NATO internal issue, can be resolved by discussions of NATO members over some Wine and Beer. Doesn't require anyone's jets to be taken out. Totally separate issue compared to the topic at hand

 

[mike2000 is back]

Article 5 states that an attack on one member would be attack on all. This was to prevent the Soviet Union from invading Western Europe . The goal posts have been move quite a bit since then as the Soviet Union no longer exists. If one member state of NATO was engaged in empire building and someone went to stop them, would article 5 still be relevant. If one member was using that membership in NATO to their advantage and wanted to build the caliph, would article 5 still be relevant? And would every NATO country want to send their troops to fight for a caliph that will eventually threaten them all one day? There needs to be some serious amendments to article 5 would you agree?

All what you said are merely hypothesis. NATO, its true was formed to act as a deterrent against the aggressive Soviet Union alias the 'evil empire'.lol Reason article 5 was formulated. The goal post might have changed but the objective/rule is still the same. In short, yes any attack against one member by a foreign power will be an attack on ALL. Its still valid until further notice/proven otherwise.

Moreover, your hypothesis about one NATO member using NATO for its own gain today could also be valid when NATO was formed during the cold war era. The hell, even today you could say any country invoking an article on NATO when faced with a foreign threat is also 'using NATO for its own advantage', this could apply to any country in NATO, not just one member.
This is one thing people forget: THERE IS NO WAY IN HEAVEN EVERYBODY IN ANY NATO MEMBER COUNTRY WILL BE HAPPY ABOUT SENDING THEIR SOLDIERS TO DIE FOR ANOTHER COUNTRY BE IT GERMANY,FRANCE, BRITAIN, ITALY, SPAIN, GREECE ETC ETC. As far as a country has not been directly attacked, then its citizens will obviously be reluctant to want their soldiers to join the war, doesn't matter which country that is.
However, the leaders will still be the ones to make the final decision, not the public.

 

[Hyperion]

Have to give it to the Brits. Masterfully played. They'll get Turkey burnt to the ground, and in the end have the last laugh @ the cost of maybe just a dozen aircraft of their own.

 

[type93]

All what you said are merely hypothesis. NATO, its true was formed to act as a deterrent against the aggressive Soviet Union alias the 'evil empire'.lol Reason article 5 was formulated. The goal post might have changed but the objective/rule is still the same. In short, yes any attack against one member by a foreign power will be an attack on ALL. Its still valid until further notice/proven otherwise.

Moreover, your hypothesis about one NATO member using NATO for its own gain today could also be valid when NATO was formed during the cold war era. The hell, even today you could say any country invoking an article on NATO when faced with a foreign threat is also 'using NATO for its own advantage', this could apply to any country in NATO, not just one member.
This is one thing people forget: THERE IS NO WAY IN HEAVEN EVERYBODY IN ANY NATO MEMBER COUNTRY WILL BE HAPPY ABOUT SENDING THEIR SOLDIERS TO DIE FOR ANOTHER COUNTRY BE IT GERMANY,FRANCE, BRITAIN, ITALY, SPAIN, GREECE ETC ETC. As far as a country has not been directly attacked, then its citizens will obviously be reluctant to want their soldiers to join the war, doesn't matter which country that is.
However, the leaders will still be the ones to make the final decision, not the public.

It's not a hypothesis but the truth. A difficult truth that unfortunately no one is willing to confront. People have been killed and imprisoned for exposing turkeys links to Isis. When the US raided a Isis leaders house, they found evidence of turkeys link to Isis

 

[Hyperion]

Quoted your post for posterity............

We shall do a postmortem on your comments in couple of months time!

You all need to chill out. Russia is just making empty threats, i would like to see them even fire a single shot at Turkey unless they dont want the entire might of NATO fighting them. Putin is retarded, but not that retarded.