Breakdown of PTI era debt Rs17.8 trillion ($100B)

[hydrabadi_arab]

Rs4.4 trillion was because of N league era artificial exchange rate that was corrected in PTI era. 8.9 trillion paying debt. Basically 75% of PTI debt was spent on PPP/N era loans.

 

[Mav3rick]

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Rs4.4 trillion was because of N league era artificial exchange rate that was corrected in PTI era. 8.9 trillion paying debt. Basically 75% of PTI debt was spent on PPP/N era loans.

So PTI borrowed money interest free and no interest was paid by PTI on loans it acquired during it's almost 4 year tenure? And who will pay off the debt that PTI acquired.....Imran Khan or the people of Pakistan? Another thing that does not make any sense to a normal person is the BS around exchange rate and the fact that people are indeed so dumb that they are not able to comprehend a stronger local currency is beneficial when a large quantum of imports is required, which was required to establish an industrial base during PML Government!

The actual reason for increase in Public Debt under PTI is 1) Extreme Incompetency, 2) Nepotism/Favouritism/Personal interests, 3) Corruption!

 

[hydrabadi_arab]

stronger local currency is beneficial when a large quantum of imports is required

You should have wrote that first instead of wasting time.

1. Take huge amount of foreign debt in $$.
2. Pump that $$ to buy rupee from market.

Enjoy few years of low subsidised imports and then default like Sri Lanka. Nooni league is trader party of rent seekers, they cannot think beyond imports.

Under PTI debt to GDP ratio came down to 67% from 90%. PTI was paying $12-15b per year foreign debt vs Noon league $4-5b. Dar haramkhors toke huge debt to build some mega projects, take comission and left Pakistan bankrupt.

But now even Noonie league is fuckeed, they cannot do what they did in 2013. Thats how bad things are right now thanks to them. By next year they will be exposed because this time they cannot take anymore loans to pump rupee.

 

[Wood]

Is there a breakdown for the origin of these supposedly frivolous loans taken by PLM-N? Or by both parties in general?

IMF loans cannot be used for mass subsidy because the program will enforce restrictions to make sure that the money is spent in ways that allows for the recovery of loan.

 

[Wood]

Under PTI debt to GDP ratio came down to 67% from 90%. PTI was paying $12-15b per year foreign debt vs Noon league $4-5b. Dar haramkhors toke huge debt to build some mega projects, take comission and left Pakistan bankrupt.

This fall in debt in GDP ratio is based on GDP numbers that were before or after rebasing?

 

[hydrabadi_arab]

Is there a breakdown for the origin of these supposedly frivolous loans taken by PLM-N? Or by both parties in general?

IMF loans cannot be used for mass subsidy because the program will enforce restrictions to make sure that the money is spent in ways that allows for the recovery of loan.

PML-N toke huge amount of foreign loan by Pakistan standard. They used to take $10-12b foreign loans per year between 2013-18. Use half of that to pay debt and half for budget/projects.

PTI also toke foreign $12-14b/year loans but 90% of that went to loan repayments. Basically PTI was left with no fiscal space to do mega development projects. PTI inherited near Sri Lanka like situation.

 

[Wood]

PML-N toke huge amount of foreign loan by Pakistan standard. They used to take $10-12b foreign loans per year between 2013-18. Use half of that to pay debt and half for budget/projects.

PTI also toke foreign $12-14b/year loans but 90% of that went to loan repayments. Basically PTI was left with no fiscal space to do mega development projects. PTI inherited near Sri Lanka like situation.

This does not directly answer my question. I'm already aware that you are critical of PLM-N for taking loans in their tenure. It would be more interesting if you can trace the origin of the loans taken by PLM-N. That will perhaps give you an idea about how the money was spent - because each time the gov. takes a loan, it has to justify the purpose for it to the creditor. Until that is established, it is unfair to say that the gov. took loans and simply wasted money.

 

[Hyde]

This does not directly answer my question. I'm already aware that you are critical of PLM-N for taking loans in their tenure. It would be more interesting if you can trace the origin of the loans taken by PLM-N. That will perhaps give you an idea about how the money was spent - because each time the gov. takes a loan, it has to justify the purpose for it to the creditor. Until that is established, it is unfair to say that the gov. took loans and simply wasted money.

Just like PTI says that it took loan to pay off the loan of PML-N (although thats a seperate story the debt increased by 30 years worth of past loans combined)

PML-N also says the same thing that they took loan to pay off the loan of PPP

And PPP says when they came in power, the foreign reserves were depleted that they couldn't even afford to pay the salaries and they had no choice but to go IMF

Basically everyone blames their predecessors

 

[Wood]

Just like PTI says that it took loan to pay off the loan of PML-N (although thats a seperate story the debt increased by 30 years worth of past loans combined)

PML-N also says the same thing that they took loan to pay off the loan of PPP

And PPP says when they came in power, the foreign reserves were depleted that they couldn't even afford to pay the salaries and they had no choice but to go IMF

Basically everyone blames their predecessors

This may sound obvious, but the only way for Pakistan to break this cycle is to bring in investments (not more loans) that can result in profitable growth for the investors. If CPEC cannot bring investments (that are an equity risk) from China, then this should be from middle east or the western countries. Either this or Pakistan finds a mountain of resources (thinking of Reko Diq) that can be profitably extracted in the order of what middle eastern countries are blessed with.

Political uncertainty and an obstructive opposition is the last of what well wishers for Pakistan should hope for.

 

[notorious_eagle]

So PTI borrowed money interest free and no interest was paid by PTI on loans it acquired during it's almost 4 year tenure? And who will pay off the debt that PTI acquired.....Imran Khan or the people of Pakistan? Another thing that does not make any sense to a normal person is the BS around exchange rate and the fact that people are indeed so dumb that they are not able to comprehend a stronger local currency is beneficial when a large quantum of imports is required, which was required to establish an industrial base during PML Government!

The actual reason for increase in Public Debt under PTI is 1) Extreme Incompetency, 2) Nepotism/Favouritism/Personal interests, 3) Corruption!

I will only address this part of your post because the rest of your post is absolute chawal, this one is as well but others need to know what the facts are.

What this guy is stating is typical chawal patwari economics, or what you call Dar Economics. In easy words what he is saying is, keep borrowing money from the bank and maintain your lavish lifestyle with Land Cruisers because your kids will feel good and society will think you're doing well in life. That's essentially what Dar Economics was. He was thinking short term, typical 'Dihari Mentality'. Keep taking extremely expensive foreign loans and buy Pakistani Rupees in the open market which artificially keeps the price of Pakistani Rupee high. Eventually you have to pay back those loans, Dar wasn't thinking that far because he had the typical 'Dihari Mindset' of lets loot maar for 5 years because we will be out of power after 5 years. There was zero focus on improvement of Exports which is the real driver of FX along with Foreign Remittance.

Just wanted to address the Chawali of what you call Dar Economics.

 

[That Guy]

So PTI borrowed money interest free and no interest was paid by PTI on loans it acquired during it's almost 4 year tenure? And who will pay off the debt that PTI acquired.....Imran Khan or the people of Pakistan? Another thing that does not make any sense to a normal person is the BS around exchange rate and the fact that people are indeed so dumb that they are not able to comprehend a stronger local currency is beneficial when a large quantum of imports is required, which was required to establish an industrial base during PML Government!

The actual reason for increase in Public Debt under PTI is 1) Extreme Incompetency, 2) Nepotism/Favouritism/Personal interests, 3) Corruption!

The fact that you linked imports with creating a strong industrial bases automatically disqualifies your opinion from being valid in any way shape or form.

You have no idea how debt and economy work, I suggest you keep quiet.

 

[HaMoTZeMaS]

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Rs4.4 trillion was because of N league era artificial exchange rate that was corrected in PTI era. 8.9 trillion paying debt. Basically 75% of PTI debt was spent on PPP/N era loans.

that is what my first eye go through captured that...
3/4 went into just interest on loans and re-evaluation

that is fucking massive

 

[hydrabadi_arab]

This does not directly answer my question. I'm already aware that you are critical of PLM-N for taking loans in their tenure. It would be more interesting if you can trace the origin of the loans taken by PLM-N. That will perhaps give you an idea about how the money was spent - because each time the gov. takes a loan, it has to justify the purpose for it to the creditor. Until that is established, it is unfair to say that the gov. took loans and simply wasted money.

I already explained it, out of $10-12b half went to repayment and other half for budget. Thats why N launched so many mega projects worth billions like motorways, power plants etc. For example Multan-Sukkur motorway costed like $4b.

 

[Wood]

I already explained it, out of $10-12b half went to repayment and other half for budget. Thats why N launched so many mega projects worth billions like motorways, power plants etc. For example Multan-Sukkur motorway costed like $4b.

So he borrowed for investment; he was hoping to kick start construction boom, economic growth and provide mass employment to the population. I think that part of these loans would be under the ever so popular CPEC umbrella. If he had not opted to do so, then there would likely have been a lot less economic development in his tenure. Who is to say that would not been equally or more detrimental?

As for borrowing to service existing debt, he is neither the first nor the last ruler to kick that bucket down the road.

 

[Gorgin Khan]

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Rs4.4 trillion was because of N league era artificial exchange rate that was corrected in PTI era. 8.9 trillion paying debt. Basically 75% of PTI debt was spent on PPP/N era loans.

This is not the total debt of pakistan this is only foreign currency debt even if we consider your table correct , Actually the total debt of pakistan right now in dollar terms is somwhere 117 billion $ may be more regardless of exchange rate.

Your figure shows the foriegn debt increased by 17.8 billion that is true , where are the figures for domestic debt which is close to 70 bilion in dollar terms if we consider the current exchange rate .....Sub golmaal bhai Sub golmaal hay........ Nice try by using correct but half figures and wrong titles (manipulated data)........

P.S Exchange rate put a burden on pocket of a common man , it has nothing do to with debt repayments. Means you have to pay in dollars regardless of it is on 120 or 185 at the end common man and government has to pay it......