Beijing comes to rescue: China to inject billions of dollars into EU fund

[Bussard Ramjet]

This is what I am afraid of actually.

Many thinks money can buy you soft power, but in reality, most country will just take your money and go, and if another big enough offer string along, they will simply move on. Better yet, when you stop supporting them, they will simply turn on you

There is a reason why the aforementioned countries turned on the west, while Venezuela turn on US after they stop buying their crude oil (Which due to lower quality and harder to refine) to UK did not bail Argentina out of their financial crisis. Both country were friends, buddy even before said watershed event.

We also see this type of situation happened over and over again during modern US History, this is the believe US actually believe in during the greater part of 20s to 70s and we can see a string of country betrayed US range from Cuba in 1950s, Iran in 1970s, Afghanistan in 1980, Iraq in 1990. I just hope the polly in China can learn from this and stop thinking to use money to buy soft power.

After all, I do still paying tax to Hong Kong Government and indirectly paying for Chinese government, it's okay to use my tax money to build more business but I don't want to see what happened to US during 1950-1990 happened to China

I am a relatively new member here, Can you explain your fags? And the fact that you are paying taxes to HKSAR?

You appeared to be an American to me at first.

 

[Audio]

........What a fun way to say China come into the Rescue with 315 Billions.....

315 billion is European money, which i'm still not entirely sure they managed to scrape up. Afaik they were "trimming the fat of" other programmes already financed to get to this number. It is intended as sort of "seed money", to start some project up and attract more investors.
What Chinese or any other investor wil add to this is as of now unknown.

If i'm allowed to joke a bit, i say this programme is Juncker collecting brownie points from country governments. You know, when the new "king" comes he must shower everyone better than the previous king. For how this works, we can turn to recent Saudi example where the new king increased pay for publuic officials.

 

[jhungary]

I am a relatively new member here, Can you explain your fags? And the fact that you are paying taxes to HKSAR?

You appeared to be an American to me at first.

Dude, what a rude thing to say that I am fags.

315 billion is European money, which i'm still not entirely sure they managed to scrape up. Afaik they were "trimming the fat of" other programmes already financed to get to this number. It is intended as sort of "seed money", to start some project up and attract more investors.
What Chinese or any other investor wil add to this is as of now unknown.

If i'm allowed to joke a bit, i say this programme is Juncker collecting brownie points from country governments. You know, when the new "king" comes he must shower everyone better than the previous king. For how this works, we can turn to recent Saudi example where the new king increased pay for publuic officials.

I would think the 315 billions is not entirely invested (or direct investment) to EU, some of those fund may divert to building new infrastructure in China to support the EU investment, such as building the new silk road.

Or they are expecting a trade volume of 315 billion euro for the entire project. (Which seems kind of strange)

Because as far as I know, China Central bank need special permission to invest in foreign infrastructure, and the only money China can indeed allocated is either fund from AIIB or BRICS bank. But seeing AIIB only have 100 billions capital and even less stake in BRICS, I would say the 315 bil is for both infrastructure investment in China and EU, not a direct China to EU Trade

 

[The enlightened]

Dude, what a rude thing to say that I am fags.

That hair-style does create doubt.

 

[Audio]

Dude, what a rude thing to say that I am fags.



I would think the 315 billions is not entirely invested (or direct investment) to EU, some of those fund may divert to building new infrastructure in China to support the EU investment, such as building the new silk road.

Or they are expecting a trade volume of 315 billion euro for the entire project. (Which seems kind of strange)

Because as far as I know, China Central bank need special permission to invest in foreign infrastructure, and the only money China can indeed allocated is either fund from AIIB or BRICS bank. But seeing AIIB only have 100 billions capital and even less stake in BRICS, I would say the 315 bil is for both infrastructure investment in China and EU, not a direct China to EU Trade

I don't think you understand. This isn't a fund for trade. And is specifically targeted at European south.

Although, i need to correct myself.....315 billion is not yet guaranteed.

 

[jhungary]

That hair-style does create doubt.

cause that was a woman in the photo

I don't think you understand. This isn't a fund for trade. And is specifically targeted at European south.

Although, i need to correct myself.....315 billion is not yet guaranteed.

lol I did not think the 315 bil is for trade (Which is why I said it would be strange) as I said, I think the 315 bil if they are indeed the amount is for all the project that directly related to the new silk road. In and Outside EU

 

[Shotgunner51]

This is what I am afraid of actually.

Many thinks money can buy you soft power, but in reality, most country will just take your money and go, and if another big enough offer string along, they will simply move on. Better yet, when you stop supporting them, they will simply turn on you

There is a reason why the aforementioned countries turned on the west, while Venezuela turn on US after they stop buying their crude oil (Which due to lower quality and harder to refine) to UK did not bail Argentina out of their financial crisis. Both country were friends, buddy even before said watershed event.

We also see this type of situation happened over and over again during modern US History, this is the believe US actually believe in during the greater part of 20s to 70s and we can see a string of country betrayed US range from Cuba in 1950s, Iran in 1970s, Afghanistan in 1980, Iraq in 1990. I just hope the polly in China can learn from this and stop thinking to use money to buy soft power.

After all, I do still paying tax to Hong Kong Government and indirectly paying for Chinese government, it's okay to use my tax money to build more business but I don't want to see what happened to US during 1950-1990 happened to China

I appreciate your concern. On soft power, you are absolutely right that it can't be bought, actually money is just a type of hard power for being a tangible asset. In contemporary Beijing, there is a saying 3rd class companies manufacture, 2nd class companies do marketing, and 1st class companies set standards and ecosystem. In old Chinese saying there are 4 levels of making money, 4th level is working for money (挣钱), 3rd level is use money to generate money (赚钱), 2nd level is using proprietary assets and other people to make money (生钱), 1st level is about setting environment and profits on other people when they make money (来钱).

If you look at the contemporary geopolitical environment, currency/debt game and international trade on energy/commodities, I guess you know what they mean. Your advices are valuable, nice learning for others. Have some confidence on your tax money bro!

lol I did not think the 315 bil is for trade (Which is why I said it would be strange) as I said, I think the 315 bil if they are indeed the amount is for all the project that directly related to the new silk road. In and Outside EU

Check my post #16:

• The fund was proposed last year by European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker.
• Various EU sovereign governments have put in seed money, by now France, Germany, Italy and Poland have each announced they will contribute 8 billion euros, while Spain and Luxembourg have pledged smaller contributions.
• The fund, designed at 315 billion, is not yet fully vested as to-date. Invited by EU, several Chinese companies among other funds/banks are doing DD / feasibility study.
  
• The bloc is relying mainly on private investors and development banks to fund projects selected from an initial list of almost 2,000 submitted by the 28 member states, from airports to flood defences, that are together worth 1.3 trillion euros.

 

[jhungary]

I appreciate your concern. On soft power, you are absolutely right that it can't be bought, actually money is just a type of hard power for being a tangible asset. In contemporary Beijing, there is a saying 3rd class companies manufacture, 2nd class companies do marketing, and 1st class companies set standards and ecosystem. In old Chinese saying there are 4 levels of making money, 4th level is working for money (挣钱), 3rd level is use money to generate money (赚钱), 2nd level is using proprietary assets and other people to make money (生钱), 1st level is about setting environment and profits on other people when they make money (来钱).

If you look at the contemporary geopolitical environment, currency/debt game and international trade on energy/commodities, I guess you know what they mean. Your advices are valuable, nice learning for others. Have some confidence on your tax money bro!



Check my post #16:

• The fund was proposed last year by European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker.
• Various EU sovereign governments have put in seed money, by now France, Germany, Italy and Poland have each announced they will contribute 8 billion euros, while Spain and Luxembourg have pledged smaller contributions.
• The fund, designed at 315 billion, is not yet fully vested as to-date. Invited by EU, several Chinese companies among other funds/banks are doing DD / feasibility study.
  
• The bloc is relying mainly on private investors and development banks to fund projects selected from an initial list of almost 2,000 submitted by the 28 member states, from airports to flood defences, that are together worth 1.3 trillion euros.

Well, about making money, I agree that it take money to make money

But still Political environment as far as I concern should move as far away as possible to trade relationship. Well, my family have business in Mexico and Argentina and well, let just say from what I see, we did not have a good impression to Argentinian Business environment.

And about the Funds, so that's a Joint EU-Chinese Venture fund which each country supposed to seed some of the money and grew into a pot? Or they are solely seeded by Chinese Private sectors?

Again, as far as I know Governmental sector cannot invest in foreign entity without permission from CPC, that's why I raise my concern for the supposed 315 billions fund and the origin of the money...

 

[Shotgunner51]

But still Political environment as far as I concern should move as far away as possible to trade relationship. Well, my family have business in Mexico and Argentina and well, let just say from what I see, we did not have a good impression to Argentinian Business environment.

Great!

And about the Funds, so that's a Joint EU-Chinese Venture fund which each country supposed to seed some of the money and grew into a pot? Or they are solely seeded by Chinese Private sectors?
Again, as far as I know Governmental sector cannot invest in foreign entity without permission from CPC, that's why I raise my concern for the supposed 315 billions fund and the origin of the money...

Note it isn't a venture capital which usually do equity investment in high-growth-high-risk private start-ups, it is an infrastructure fund that invests in state-backed long-term equity/loan projects.

Chinese SOE can invest in foreign entity with approval from SARFT (PRC government branch, under premier-led State Council, not CPC) and need clearance from PBOC (i.e. central bank) to if they need to buy forex with onshore assets. For investment using offshore assets, that's company decision and no government approval required (e.g. China Investment Corporation which has a similar structure like Tamesek Holdings of Singapore).

With most leading EU countries involved in establishment of AIIB, and now China being invited to EFSI, it's indeed an interesting time to see the two co-operating on building infrastructures across Eurasia, let's stay tuned and see how these events will unfold in the coming months.

 

[Audio]

I think the 315 bil if they are indeed the amount is for all the project that directly related to the new silk road. In and Outside EU

The Investment Plan for Europe aims to revive investment in strategic projects around Europe

Investment Plan for Europe

I would not know financing scheme for Silk road project. That said, infrastructure connections on this side are probably adequate, new members have been getting cohesion funds for years precisely to improve infra.

First loan already started:

which will produce 1.3 million tonnes of pulp per year. The project includes the generation of energy from renewable sources and an innovative bark gasification plant that will allow the mill to be fossil fuel free. The expected renewable energy generation capacity corresponds to 1% of Finland’s current electricity consumption.
This project represents one of the largest industrial investments ever undertaken in the country. It is expected to create some 6 000 jobs during the construction phase and sustain another estimated 2 500 jobs in the forestry sector.

First loan under Investment Plan for Europe in Finland: EIB supports construction of large-scale bio-product mill

 

[TaiShang]

It's true that China tries to keep the EU alive because the it believe in multipolar system. But Europe's got big problems. Eastern blocs, most of the EU's members, depend too much on Germany -- Romania, Bulgaria & others. Eastern EU members are too corrupt, EU can't feed them for too long. Not only Germany, but Austria & Netherlands should work hard and also others should work hard & reduce corruption. Otherwise they'll loose.

Finally EU shouldn't accept TTIP.

 

[Shotgunner51]

Other than EFSI, now European Bank for Reconstruction and Development (EBRD) also come under discussion.

China applies to join European reconstruction bank, board likely to recommend approval

@Edison Chen