Bangladesh in no hurry to sign proposed defence agreements with US: FM Momen

[leonblack08]

no one can say no to uncle sam and get away with it.
As of now , America pretty much runs the global order. BAL needs to give them something so that they look the other way whenever the next ''elections'' are held.
(see the panic and reaction to RAB sanctions).

You think the corrupt officials are willing to give up their multiple 6 bedroom detached houses in (insert Canadian city name here). Of course not !
Lets see how BAL navigates through this.



now lets consider the other side of the coin, the advantages :

American equipment will give us access to the best training possible. American Airmen Training (AF and navy ) is without a doubt the best in the world. Airforces trained or built up using American help have always come out on top of their bigger and better funded/equipped adversaries. the USAF/USN work ethic and training, nothing comes close to it.
European training is good but doesn't come anywhere close.

BAF is in need of a mentality/culture shift.

Plus , nai mama theke kana mama bhalo.

On your first point you are right. The integrity is lacking with BD politicians, and we all know US under it's facade of integrity, does the most corrupt deeds to get to it's objective.

As for the second point, off course US tech and training is superior. And I was also a believer of having at least something from US than nothing. But US won't give us anything unless we join their bloc. Given that China has already expressed it's position on BD joining US alliance and what US actually did to protect Ukraine in case of war, it is crystal clear that we will be left on our own in case of any conflict. They have done it in the past. Did absolutely nothing meaningful when it came to Rohingya crisis.

So, regardless of how lucrative the option and opportunity of using US military hardware may be, Bangladesh should stay away and source from a mix of European and Chinese sources.

 

[Wergeland]

Clearly he is negotiating higher compensation.

LOL.

Actually maybe not so funny.

Seems like the US is working on South Asia now regarding Russia/Ukraine.

Easy peasy for America to control rest of the world. Just throw some money at any politicians as a carrot. Offer money, fame, women and luxury. 9 outta 10 times it will work flawlessly.

For 1/10 times when a individual cannot be bought. Simply defame, sanction or place a arrest order by interpol or Hague. If all those options fail then just escalate:

- Carrier battle group pays a friendly visit
- Regime change
- Civil War


And that without placing a single millitary boot on the ground. America only need to spend 1 billion USD and it will have achieved almost all of its objectives. Thats power of US intellect and practical minded society.

 

[Avicenna]

On your first point you are right. The integrity is lacking, and we all know US under it's facade of integrity, does the most corrupt deeds to get to it's objective.

As for the second point, off course US tech and training is superior. And I was also a believer of having at least something from US than nothing. But US won't give us anything unless we join their bloc. Given that China has already expressed it's position on BD joining US alliance and what US actually did to protect Ukraine in case of war, it is crystal clear that we will be left on our own in case of any conflict. They have done it in the past. Did absolutely nothing meaningful when it came to Rohingya crisis.

So, regardless of how lucrative the option and opportunity of using US military hardware may be, Bangladesh should stay away and source from a mix of European and Chinese sources.

Agree.

I was a strong proponent of buying US gear.

Mainly for the training opportunities.

But that's opening Pandora's box.

Better to go Euro and China.

And seek Turkish help to get close or at NATO standard.

 

[bluesky]

And I was also a believer of having at least something from US than nothing.

The land what is now Bangladesh has been receiving all kinds of aids and helps from the USA since after 1947. The total may be more than 15 or 20 billion dollars. Even Japan as its ally has relieved BD of $9 billion of loans. I have no exact figures for individual European countries but their combined aid may surpass Japan's. All because of Uncle Sam.

They have done it in the past. Did absolutely nothing meaningful when it came to Rohingya crisis.

Did you say, the USA did absolutely nothing on Rohingya? It has unilaterally donated $1.5 billion since the Rohingya issue surfaced. Only this year it has allocated $180 million.

All those fancy Rohingya facilities in Bhashan Char were built mostly with the US financial contributions.

 

[leonblack08]

The land what is now Bangladesh has been receiving all kinds of aids and helps from the USA since after 1947. The total may be more than 15 or 20 billion dollars. Even Japan as its ally has relieved BD of $9 billion of loans. I have no exact figures for individual European countries but their combined aid may surpass Japan's. All because of Uncle Sam.


Did you say, the USA did absolutely nothing on Rohingya? It has unilaterally donated $1.5 billion since the Rohingya issue surfaced. Only this year it has allocated $180 million.

All those fancy Rohingya facilities in Bhashan Char were built mostly with the US financial contributions.

Do you consider money donated to settle Rohingya in Bangladesh a meaningful solution?

No. It is not. They are Burmese citizens, not Bangladeshi citizens and they need to be repatriated to Myanmar. That is the only acceptable meaningful solution here. There was a genocide against these people and absolutely no one was punished for it. The aid and donations from US are all short term face saving measures, to maintain it's status as the global humanitarian. There has been no effective long term solution from US. It could have placed same type of sanctions on Myanmar if it wanted, as it did to Russia for Ukraine. But nothing of that sort ever happened. I can still see products made in Myanmar in the stores here in West.

Have anyone done a study on the economic impact on Bangladesh of housing Rohingya refugees since the 90s? I am not aware if any has been done. If I am guessing, the cost probably far outweigh whatever handout we received from the US. The amount of resources spent on housing the Rohingya refugee to date, whereas our own citizens in different parts of the country live with similar poverty and hardship. Has anyone taken the opportunity cost of that into account?

You can be happy with petty US handouts all you want, but unless there is something meaningful long term solution actually in effect, Bangladesh cannot and should not join US bloc.

And just so you know, no country ever does favour to another country. There is always strings attached. No one denies the donations and developments through US, the West and Japan and even China. But those also happen to be tools these countries use to gain influence. Nothing is ever free.

Here is something to think about as starter:

 

[bluesky]

Do you consider money donated to settle Rohingya in Bangladesh a meaningful solution?

No. It is not. They are Burmese citizens, not Bangladeshi citizens and they need to be repatriated to Myanmar. That is the only acceptable meaningful solution here. There was a genocide against these people and absolutely no one was punished for it. The aid and donations from US are all short term face saving measures, to maintain it's status as the global humanitarian. There has been no effective long term solution from US. It could have placed same type of sanctions on Myanmar if it wanted, as it did to Russia for Ukraine. But nothing of that sort ever happened. I can still see products made in Myanmar in the stores here in West.

BD is not a NATO country that the USA will impose sanctions on Burma to safeguard the NATO interest. Rohingya is an issue between BD and Burma. The USA can only help BD tackle the financial burden. So, it provided monetary assistance to BD.

We should ask for or expect the USA to help us more.

 

[leonblack08]

BD is not a NATO country that the USA will impose sanctions on Burma to safeguard the NATO interest. Rohingya is an issue between BD and Burma. The USA can only help BD tackle the financial burden. So, it provided monetary assistance to BD.

We should ask for or expect the USA to help us more.

Ukraine isn't a NATO country either, US still did a lot more to protect Ukrainian refugee than Rohingya refugee. They could have taken similar actions if they were really the great humanitarian they pose to be.

The fact of the matter is, for US, Rohingya issue is a negotiation tool to pull Bangladesh away from Chinese sphere of influence. Just like the sanctions it placed on RAB, using the same champion of human rights facade. They will help us and also take away these sanctions, if we sign the defence agreements and help them set up a base in St. Martins to counter China.

When they will be done using BD as their tool against China, they will discard us just like they did to Pakistan. Especially having seen what happened to Pakistan after supporting US for decades, we should learn the lesson and maintain independent foreign policy.

It is at this point almost a given that the Rohingya repatriation will never happen diplomatically. China has a conflict of interest with regards to BD-Myanmar issue, as they want both to be under their influence. And US wants us to sell our soul to provide any meaningful help. Even with US help, there is no guarantee whatsoever that Rohingya will ever be repatriated.

It's better Bangladesh accept the reality that these refugees will eventually need to be integrated to our population. That way, we at least can take away their tool to manipulate us.

 

[Bilal9]

The land what is now Bangladesh has been receiving all kinds of aids and helps from the USA since after 1947. The total may be more than 15 or 20 billion dollars. Even Japan as its ally has relieved BD of $9 billion of loans. I have no exact figures for individual European countries but their combined aid may surpass Japan's. All because of Uncle Sam.


Did you say, the USA did absolutely nothing on Rohingya? It has unilaterally donated $1.5 billion since the Rohingya issue surfaced. Only this year it has allocated $180 million.

All those fancy Rohingya facilities in Bhashan Char were built mostly with the US financial contributions.

Wow! I'd say these refugees don't live too bad a life compared to the rest of the world, especially how they are treated in Europe (except nice places like Spain). Rest of the EU countries act like scumbags in that regard (especially talking about some of the scumbags in Hungary).

But - at the end of the day, they are still refugees and would love to go back home.

I bet EU countries would love to keep them here, rather than go change the face of EU.

 

[bluesky]

Ukraine isn't a NATO country either, US still did a lot more to protect Ukrainian refugee than Rohingya refugee. They could have taken similar actions if they were really the great humanitarian they pose to be.

The fact of the matter is, for US, Rohingya issue is a negotiation tool to pull Bangladesh away from Chinese sphere of influence. Just like the sanctions it placed on RAB, using the same champion of human rights facade. They will help us and also take away these sanctions, if we sign the defence agreements and help them set up a base in St. Martins to counter China.

When they will be done using BD as their tool against China, they will discard us just like they did to Pakistan. Especially having seen what happened to Pakistan after supporting US for decades, we should learn the lesson and maintain independent foreign policy.

It is at this point almost a given that the Rohingya repatriation will never happen diplomatically. China has a conflict of interest with regards to BD-Myanmar issue, as they want both to be under their influence. And US wants us to sell our soul to provide any meaningful help. Even with US help, there is no guarantee whatsoever that Rohingya will ever be repatriated.

It's better Bangladesh accept the reality that these refugees will eventually need to be integrated to our population. That way, we at least can take away their tool to manipulate us.

People in poor countries become anti-America without valid reasons. Although east Pakistan was not a NATO country, America still sent millions of tons of staple food, powdered milk, and white fabrics free to the people of this country since 1947.

The powdered milk was distributed among the school students, the food was distributed free as well as through PL-480 scheme to use in the Food for Work programs. And the Markin fabrics were used to cover our body.

Someone should not compare Rohingya with Ukraine situation of today from where people are fleeing to the rich West European countries. On the contrary, America has helped Rohingya with more than $1.5 billion assistance so far.

 

[bluesky]

Wow! I'd say these refugees don't live too bad a life compared to the rest of the world, especially how they are treated in Europe (except nice places like Spain). Rest of the EU countries act like scumbags in that regard (especially talking about some of the scumbags in Hungary).

But - at the end of the day, they are still refugees and would love to go back home.

I bet EU countries would love to keep them here, rather than go change the face of EU.

We should not blame EU countries when the refugees belong to our stock of population? But, all of the European countries and America are helping Rohingyas settling newly in Bhashan Char under the auspices of the UN.

Rohingya women are being trained to work as garments producers, chicken and vegetable farming. Rohingya men would be given plots of land to rear buffalo, sheep and fish. A few hundred ponds were created when the BN raised the land the land there. They have started rearing fish in these ponds. They will also raise rice crops in the island which is about 39 sq. km. in area.

Many have opened small shops. Now, the supplies come from Noakhali proper. But, gradually, many of the staple needs will be produced in the island. Rohingya will become almost self-sufficient there.

Now, I ask people to show if refugees have ever been so earnestly dealt with in the rich European countries, or even in India and Pakistan? Please watch the video below and thank America, the UN and the GoB for giving them new lease of life. They are now a happy group of people no more destitute.

 

[Bilal9]

Now, I ask people to show if refugees have ever been so earnestly dealt with in the rich European countries

The answer unfortunately, is mostly NO.

Selfish Pigs.

Only some EU countries like Spain and Germany (and only some Scandinavian countries) have half a conscience. The US and Canada also gave plenty of rehabilitation - especially Canada. Kudos to these people

 

[Bilal9]

Bangladesh should adopt a policy similar to Israel, perhaps the US' closest ally in West Asia, which has opted for what an Israeli scholar, Eran Etzion, has called "strategic selfishness" - adopting a neutral posture as between the US and Russia and then diverting attention from its failure to back the US through some hectic interventions in Moscow and Kyiv as part of its "mediation" effort.

This is a brilliant approach, to keep both sides happy, which Bangladesh obviously needs to do.

 

[bluesky]

The answer unfortunately, is mostly NO.

Selfish Pigs.

Only some EU countries like Spain and Germany (and only some Scandinavian countries) have half a conscience. The US and Canada also gave plenty of rehabilitation - especially Canada. Kudos to these people

Actually, people without education and previous exposure to machine life in the developed countries will suffocate there. With village background, BD is just like Arakan and the Rohingya dialect is very near to Chittagong.

They feel homely in Bhashan Char with many modern facilities without the machinic pressure of a city center. I think Bhashan Char was a good decision. About 20,000 people have already been brought here and another 80,000 will be added to them.