kenyannoobie
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For almost a month or so I've been searching for a gun making school for a close relative srsly searching for a career change-he's decided on firearms tech not just gun smithing. Anyway the top 2 schools,the Oxford/Cambridge or Harvard/Yale of gun making are both European,Euregio HTLBVA Ferlach,Austria and Leon Mignon,Liege Belgium. Had a thread here:https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/firearms-production-technology-degree-courses-anyone.663651/
The US has nothing on this level. There are community schools teaching gun smithing,the repair and/or modification of guns but schools teaching AUTOCAD/CNC and commercial manufacturing techniques combined with attachment at the big boys do not exist. I've consulted some US players at the educational side and I'm still mildly shocked.
I'll be the first to admit I lack knowledge of firearms tech/gun making but I've picked up real info which points uneeringly to an interesting conclusion:most US based gun makers are at best pedestrian. Their products are basically the same at best derivative of the same designs we've seen for 50 years!
How many AR 10/15 makers are out there? There are over 10 major makers of these platforms in varying quality from 5.56 mm to .458 SOCOM. Everyone from Daniel Defense,Bravo company,Barrett Rifles,Rock River,Colt, S&W etc,etc. They're the same standard platform from the early 60s but for minor tweaking and cosmetic changes. Imagine if Toyota were still selling the 1963 E10!?
Despite professional hype and infantile fan girlism many US outfits are pushing crap onto the market. Some of the platforms beyond the yt vids and shiny brochures are surprisingly shoddy. Look at the Petra,the 7000$ .300 Win Mag built by an ex NEMO engineer with space shuttle technology.
"Now as Falkor is concerned, in 2016, against my better judgment and that of my peers, I approached Falkor about using one of their .308 gas guns for the 2016 US Army ISC. Again you'd think if you're going to spot light your company you'd at least put your best foot forward but at last the apple didn't fall far from the Nemo tree. Falkor ended up having to sending me two different rifles over the course of our train up. After 1500-2000 rounds between the 2 guns and 4 deferent shooters we could not get either one to hold sub 1.5 MOA. I ended up driving to the ISC with no rifle, luckly found an OBR on the way down, boresighted it on the highway and finished 3rd that year"
https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/threads/falkor-petra-on-its-way.6874975/
And that's a sniper talking! His opinion on the NEMO rifles is worth reading. When was the last truly new American design-IIRC it was the .50 Barrett in the early 90s. Since then we've had the Glock,btw,based in Ferlach just outside Euregio HTLBVA and new auto rifle designs from Switzerland late 80s,the excellent 550 and 540 in 7.62.
The maker,Swiss arms was bought by Sig and their latest SAPRI 751 is a 4000$ piece of true excellence. Observe the low recoil!
A decade ago the SCAR series from Belgian FN hit the market. Despite what 'experts' say users love its modularity and light recoil;fyi,I know one KDF guy here in the KDF who looooves it!
"The best pistol Las Vegas Shot Show 2019 was the Laugo alien. The makers' website indirectly explains how they conceptualised a radically new approach.
We wanted to think out of box with no boundaries, use the best todays approaches, technologies and materials and bring the future to shooters. This was not possible in big corporates, that is why we enterprised Laugo Arms Czechoslovakia. To make the best firearms in the world."
http://www.laugoarms.com/about.html
"After the success with M8A SMG Laugo was closely cooperating with CZ factory to adopt M8A into mass production as CZ Scorpion EVO 3. However the world of mass production of obsolete designs was very limiting and not satisfying at all. Therefore in 2013, Laugo ceased its cooperation with CZ."
Imo,its indisputable that US gun makers have grown complacent-maybe its the huge patriotic market. Is it the conservative corporate culture-WHAT COULD IT BE? Americans pls chime in as I think we should thrash this out but ofc anyone with a logical observation is welcome.
The US has nothing on this level. There are community schools teaching gun smithing,the repair and/or modification of guns but schools teaching AUTOCAD/CNC and commercial manufacturing techniques combined with attachment at the big boys do not exist. I've consulted some US players at the educational side and I'm still mildly shocked.
I'll be the first to admit I lack knowledge of firearms tech/gun making but I've picked up real info which points uneeringly to an interesting conclusion:most US based gun makers are at best pedestrian. Their products are basically the same at best derivative of the same designs we've seen for 50 years!
How many AR 10/15 makers are out there? There are over 10 major makers of these platforms in varying quality from 5.56 mm to .458 SOCOM. Everyone from Daniel Defense,Bravo company,Barrett Rifles,Rock River,Colt, S&W etc,etc. They're the same standard platform from the early 60s but for minor tweaking and cosmetic changes. Imagine if Toyota were still selling the 1963 E10!?
Despite professional hype and infantile fan girlism many US outfits are pushing crap onto the market. Some of the platforms beyond the yt vids and shiny brochures are surprisingly shoddy. Look at the Petra,the 7000$ .300 Win Mag built by an ex NEMO engineer with space shuttle technology.
"Now as Falkor is concerned, in 2016, against my better judgment and that of my peers, I approached Falkor about using one of their .308 gas guns for the 2016 US Army ISC. Again you'd think if you're going to spot light your company you'd at least put your best foot forward but at last the apple didn't fall far from the Nemo tree. Falkor ended up having to sending me two different rifles over the course of our train up. After 1500-2000 rounds between the 2 guns and 4 deferent shooters we could not get either one to hold sub 1.5 MOA. I ended up driving to the ISC with no rifle, luckly found an OBR on the way down, boresighted it on the highway and finished 3rd that year"
https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/threads/falkor-petra-on-its-way.6874975/
And that's a sniper talking! His opinion on the NEMO rifles is worth reading. When was the last truly new American design-IIRC it was the .50 Barrett in the early 90s. Since then we've had the Glock,btw,based in Ferlach just outside Euregio HTLBVA and new auto rifle designs from Switzerland late 80s,the excellent 550 and 540 in 7.62.
The maker,Swiss arms was bought by Sig and their latest SAPRI 751 is a 4000$ piece of true excellence. Observe the low recoil!
A decade ago the SCAR series from Belgian FN hit the market. Despite what 'experts' say users love its modularity and light recoil;fyi,I know one KDF guy here in the KDF who looooves it!
"The best pistol Las Vegas Shot Show 2019 was the Laugo alien. The makers' website indirectly explains how they conceptualised a radically new approach.
We wanted to think out of box with no boundaries, use the best todays approaches, technologies and materials and bring the future to shooters. This was not possible in big corporates, that is why we enterprised Laugo Arms Czechoslovakia. To make the best firearms in the world."
http://www.laugoarms.com/about.html
"After the success with M8A SMG Laugo was closely cooperating with CZ factory to adopt M8A into mass production as CZ Scorpion EVO 3. However the world of mass production of obsolete designs was very limiting and not satisfying at all. Therefore in 2013, Laugo ceased its cooperation with CZ."
Imo,its indisputable that US gun makers have grown complacent-maybe its the huge patriotic market. Is it the conservative corporate culture-WHAT COULD IT BE? Americans pls chime in as I think we should thrash this out but ofc anyone with a logical observation is welcome.
