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American sponsored Taliban and implications for Pakistan

If the author hasn't learned anything in last 30some years, then he or she never will, the only interest that should be looked after is Pakistan's interest, everything else should be secondary.

May Allah give such wisdom to the Movers and Shakers of Pakistan....So far decisions have been made not in Pakistan's Interest, but in the interest of beloved Establishment.
 
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In my opinion, I don’t think any amount of posturing to Taliban is going to get them on the US side. Neither can the US sell this at home or abroad, having demonized them into villainous caricatures who can only be taught by violence and destruction.

US will have to withdraw from Afg, and they will do their best to prop up their failed Kabul city state. However, the writing is on the wall.

China, Russia, CARs will have to accept a Taliban Afghanistan again, regardless of how much they may dislike it.

Actually in this scenario, Pakistan has the most to gain as Afghanistan will become solidly anti-Indian again and support the Kashmir cause. This would turn Pakistan solely eastward and transform us into a regional power as we are only defensive now.

Maybe this time we can finally resolve our outstanding issue of the Durand Line and begin pipelines through Afghanistan to tap CAR, independent of relying on only China.


I hate the Taliban but I dont give a shit what stays in Afghanistan stays in Afghanistan as long as Pakistan,PRC,CAR,and Russia dont get any spillover from Afghanistan I think Pakistan made one mistake in 1996 we did not groom the Taliban to rule we did not moderate them from a fundamentalist group to more of nationalistic party to rule Afghanistan, instead we gave them free roam then they got unpopular then by 2001 Mushy other mistake was letting go of support so this time they need to moderate and they are slowly
 
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It is then shocking how the Pakistani leadership has willingly given away its influence in Afghanistan........ What could have been a strategic advantage has been turned into potential risk.

The only ray of hope today is the Russian and Chinese interest. ........ At this point, we can only hope that our allies will gain influence and control over a region that was once considered our backyard.

Am I correct in assuming from your concluding remarks that, in your analysis, Pakistan has given up on a lost cause? Hoping for succor without active involvement is not a good strategy here in my view. Pakistan must remain actively engaged in the process.
 
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NOTE: This is an analysis piece that utilizes publicly available information to draw conclusions. The author does not have access to any secret, classified, or non-publicly disclosed information. As is the case with all such analysis, there is a margin of error in the conclusions drawn. The reader is advised to take this into consideration and use personal intellect and knowledge to draw individual conclusions.

America has a well known history of contracting marriages of convenience with fundamentalist Islamic regimes. From Saudi Arabia to Iran, Islamists have been brought to power under American auspices. Currently, we are seeing an increasing dialog between America and Taliban in Afghanistan. Here we try to interpret recent developments in the region and understand their implications for Pakistan.

The fundamental problem that America has faced in Afghanistan is corruption and incompetence of the government. In contrast, the Americans have observed the consistent rise of Taliban based on constant capability development and cunning planning. Coupled with a fundamentally principled approach that sets them apart from the likes of ISIS, an impartial American observer must give guarded respect to the temerity, audacity, and tenacity of the Afghan Taliban.

Before proceeding further, let us recap US interests in Afghanistan. The ultimate American aim is to control and influence the geographical region from South Asia (Pakistan) to Central Asia. As part of this grand aim, the US wants to see a secular, denuclearized Pakistan that has definite Western leanings, and poses no threat to the regional American pawn against China - India.

So what would be the most extreme step the US may take to control Afghanistan? Make friends with the competent enemy. To this effect, the rise of an American sponsored Taliban is definitely possible. If Russia and China fail to woo them, this possibility will certainly transform into reality.

What would be the features of such an alliance? First of all, America would enter a peace agreement that guarantees the Taliban will neither attack Western interests, nor harbor elements that plan and conduct such attacks. It is to be noted, that the recent pronouncement of the European Union stating blasphemy is not free speech sets up a favorable environment for such an agreement. In return, America would grant both military and economic aid to the Taliban to establish an Islamic government. Of course, this economic aid will come from mining Afghanistan's extensive mineral wealth, just as the Saudi petrodollars come from oil.

What would be the implications for Pakistan if this comes to pass? Let us recall that Pakistan today holds little to no leverage over the Afghan Taliban. What we have today is a history replete with unreliability in providing support, deceitful manipulation by withholding the news of Mullah Omar's demise, and cunning control by holding their top leadership prisoners. Today, those prisoners are free men slated for power backed by the Americans. This author hopes they were treated well during their stay in Pakistan!

As counterpoint to this development, we see an increasingly secular Pakistan, whose top leadership has a limited, Westernized notion of Islam. They have already shown their true colors on the matter of Asia Mal'oona, and are expected to further act on the Western agenda in guise of the National Action Plan. And to top it all off, the fence being erected along the Afghan border is not acceptable to any stakeholder in Afghanistan, including the Taliban. Pakistan today is not a natural ally to any faction in the political mess that is Afghanistan. As a matter of fact, the one and only natural ally that a secular Pakistan will find in the entire region is China.

And so the picture emerges. A well equipped, well trained, competent Taliban holding anti-Pakistan sentiments, who have historical bones to pick with us and over whom we hold no leverage. To top it off, the Tehrik-e-Taliban Pakistan now enjoys sanctuary in Afghanistan, along with elements of ISIS. Add a bit of CIA pot stirring into the mix, and we have a potent mixture that will blow up on our faces. Causing a conflict between a highly Islamic Afghanistan and an increasingly secular and liberal Pakistan would be the ultimate revenge by the US which accuses Pakistan of double cross and back-stabbing.

It is then shocking how the Pakistani leadership has willingly given away its influence in Afghanistan. From releasing the Taliban top leadership on American demands, to construction of the fence, to completely distancing itself from the Afghan endgame, to failure in ensuring the safety of Maulana Sami-ul-Haq, Pakistan's vested interests have been systematically destroyed. The reader should make no mistakes - America will do everything in its power to ensure Pakistan is no longer a stakeholder in Afghanistan. What could have been a strategic advantage has been turned into potential risk.

The only ray of hope today is the Russian and Chinese interest. Both great powers understand the implications of an American backed Taliban in their neighborhood. For China, the stakes are higher because of the proximity of Xinjiang and the potential of Taliban action. At this point, we can only hope that our allies will gain influence and control over a region that was once considered our backyard.
Imo, pak has lots of influence over Taliban. V can see this in two perspectives. One, if Pakhad lost all of its Power then Pak would not b the part of any meeting held on AFGHANISTAN resoulution. 2nd, if pak had lost all of its influence then pak would b getting attacked by Afghan taliban as well in border skirmishes so the argument stating pak had lost influence over taliban comes 2 naggation here.

Scenario which the writer describes that "US will install its taliban" is somewhat like 180degree angle. Look the Moscow format where Taliban demanded the withdrawal of US forces so if Taliban r at upper hand then how could US install someone who is more powerful than US itself? Second, it wud b like as US loosing the structure it developed wd trillion of dollars in Afghanistan so no sane person would accept that.

In all, imo, article can b a unique angle of thinking but it can't b tthe representation of reality.
 
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I hate the Taliban but I dont give a shit what stays in Afghanistan stays in Afghanistan as long as Pakistan,PRC,CAR,and Russia dont get any spillover from Afghanistan I think Pakistan made one mistake in 1996 we did not groom the Taliban to rule we did not moderate them from a fundamentalist group to more of nationalistic party to rule Afghanistan, instead we gave them free roam then they got unpopular then by 2001 Mushy other mistake was letting go of support so this time they need to moderate and they are slowly

What did they do to you?
 
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NOTE: This is an analysis piece that utilizes publicly available information to draw conclusions. The author does not have access to any secret, classified, or non-publicly disclosed information. As is the case with all such analysis, there is a margin of error in the conclusions drawn. The reader is advised to take this into consideration and use personal intellect and knowledge to draw individual conclusions.

America has a well known history of contracting marriages of convenience with fundamentalist Islamic regimes. From Saudi Arabia to Iran, Islamists have been brought to power under American auspices. Currently, we are seeing an increasing dialog between America and Taliban in Afghanistan. Here we try to interpret recent developments in the region and understand their implications for Pakistan.

The fundamental problem that America has faced in Afghanistan is corruption and incompetence of the government. In contrast, the Americans have observed the consistent rise of Taliban based on constant capability development and cunning planning. Coupled with a fundamentally principled approach that sets them apart from the likes of ISIS, an impartial American observer must give guarded respect to the temerity, audacity, and tenacity of the Afghan Taliban.

Before proceeding further, let us recap US interests in Afghanistan. The ultimate American aim is to control and influence the geographical region from South Asia (Pakistan) to Central Asia. As part of this grand aim, the US wants to see a secular, denuclearized Pakistan that has definite Western leanings, and poses no threat to the regional American pawn against China - India.

So what would be the most extreme step the US may take to control Afghanistan? Make friends with the competent enemy. To this effect, the rise of an American sponsored Taliban is definitely possible. If Russia and China fail to woo them, this possibility will certainly transform into reality.

What would be the features of such an alliance? First of all, America would enter a peace agreement that guarantees the Taliban will neither attack Western interests, nor harbor elements that plan and conduct such attacks. It is to be noted, that the recent pronouncement of the European Union stating blasphemy is not free speech sets up a favorable environment for such an agreement. In return, America would grant both military and economic aid to the Taliban to establish an Islamic government. Of course, this economic aid will come from mining Afghanistan's extensive mineral wealth, just as the Saudi petrodollars come from oil.

What would be the implications for Pakistan if this comes to pass? Let us recall that Pakistan today holds little to no leverage over the Afghan Taliban. What we have today is a history replete with unreliability in providing support, deceitful manipulation by withholding the news of Mullah Omar's demise, and cunning control by holding their top leadership prisoners. Today, those prisoners are free men slated for power backed by the Americans. This author hopes they were treated well during their stay in Pakistan!

As counterpoint to this development, we see an increasingly secular Pakistan, whose top leadership has a limited, Westernized notion of Islam. They have already shown their true colors on the matter of Asia Mal'oona, and are expected to further act on the Western agenda in guise of the National Action Plan. And to top it all off, the fence being erected along the Afghan border is not acceptable to any stakeholder in Afghanistan, including the Taliban. Pakistan today is not a natural ally to any faction in the political mess that is Afghanistan. As a matter of fact, the one and only natural ally that a secular Pakistan will find in the entire region is China.

And so the picture emerges. A well equipped, well trained, competent Taliban holding anti-Pakistan sentiments, who have historical bones to pick with us and over whom we hold no leverage. To top it off, the Tehrik-e-Taliban Pakistan now enjoys sanctuary in Afghanistan, along with elements of ISIS. Add a bit of CIA pot stirring into the mix, and we have a potent mixture that will blow up on our faces. Causing a conflict between a highly Islamic Afghanistan and an increasingly secular and liberal Pakistan would be the ultimate revenge by the US which accuses Pakistan of double cross and back-stabbing.

It is then shocking how the Pakistani leadership has willingly given away its influence in Afghanistan. From releasing the Taliban top leadership on American demands, to construction of the fence, to completely distancing itself from the Afghan endgame, to failure in ensuring the safety of Maulana Sami-ul-Haq, Pakistan's vested interests have been systematically destroyed. The reader should make no mistakes - America will do everything in its power to ensure Pakistan is no longer a stakeholder in Afghanistan. What could have been a strategic advantage has been turned into potential risk.

The only ray of hope today is the Russian and Chinese interest. Both great powers understand the implications of an American backed Taliban in their neighborhood. For China, the stakes are higher because of the proximity of Xinjiang and the potential of Taliban action. At this point, we can only hope that our allies will gain influence and control over a region that was once considered our backyard.
USA will never destroy Afghan taliban although it can competely wipe out the Taliban in just few days.

An unstable Afghanistan is surely profitable for USA.
 
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I just want to be useful idiots to keep the Yanks out @Indus Pakistan would agree



Lets see they barley knew how to manage a country leading to more namak hararmis to cross the border

A new more representative Afghanistan will be more pro-Pakistan and anti-Indian. Plus, US and NATO will withdraw which will ease pressure on Pakistan.

I am of the view that the new generation of Afghanistan will shed anti-Pakistanism as a matter of survival and recovering their history and identity from foreigners.

We can help that change in Afghanistan by evicting illegal Afghans gracefully and forcing Afghan government to give them a stake in their government.
 
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A new more representative Afghanistan will be more pro-Pakistan and anti-Indian. Plus, US and NATO will withdraw which will ease pressure on Pakistan.

I am of the view that the new generation of Afghanistan will shed anti-Pakistanism as a matter of survival and recovering their history and identity from foreigners.

We can help that change in Afghanistan by evicting illegal Afghans gracefully and forcing Afghan government to give them a stake in their government.

Practically what I wanted the Afghanis are just useful idiots from there no more worries of bombing of pipelines and infrastructure that could connect Pak to Eurasia
 
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This is interesting analysis.

In fact, I have stated something similar in another thread: https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/us-ambassador-pakistan-visit-orya-maqbool-jan-harf-e-raaz.587016/

US have definitely thought this through; Afghan Taliban have a role to play in the future. To what end, is something we can only speculate about at the moment.

Well, this is all about the fuy we have in PM seat. If he is a cuckold like Musharaf then yeh, I can see nukes being sold. But if we have decent PM and a COAS with nuts all he has to do is place his fingers on the green button and watch how fast they all run away, including Americans. Ultimately it's all about having a strong, secular government that has nurtured strong alligience with athiest Chinese and where mullahs are muzzled or better exported to Chinese internment camps. Under such scenario no amount of US pressure would buckle Pakistan.

Moral of story. Let us unite under a secular, progressive, pro China Pakistan.
Pakistan should not be a vassal state to any other - this trajectory does not end well for the vassal state in particular. Look at the condition of DPRK.
 
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Pakistan should not be a vassal state to any other - this trajectory does not end well for the vassal state in particular. Look at the condition of DPRK.[/QUOTE]

DPRK screwd themselves thorugh the years on their own they basically were like Enver Hoxha Albanian have no relations with anyone or very little they failed to do domestic economic reforms on their own
 
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Am I correct in assuming from your concluding remarks that, in your analysis, Pakistan has given up on a lost cause? Hoping for succor without active involvement is not a good strategy here in my view. Pakistan must remain actively engaged in the process.

It's more the case that our own decisions have led to losing the cause. We have vested interests in Afghanistan and so far, publicly available information shows that we are hurting those interests through poor decision making. Hopefully, there is some deeper leverage that we hold, but so far, that does not seem to be the case.

Imo, pak has lots of influence over Taliban. V can see this in two perspectives. One, if Pakhad lost all of its Power then Pak would not b the part of any meeting held on AFGHANISTAN resoulution. 2nd, if pak had lost all of its influence then pak would b getting attacked by Afghan taliban as well in border skirmishes so the argument stating pak had lost influence over taliban comes 2 naggation here.

Scenario which the writer describes that "US will install its taliban" is somewhat like 180degree angle. Look the Moscow format where Taliban demanded the withdrawal of US forces so if Taliban r at upper hand then how could US install someone who is more powerful than US itself? Second, it wud b like as US loosing the structure it developed wd trillion of dollars in Afghanistan so no sane person would accept that.

In all, imo, article can b a unique angle of thinking but it can't b tthe representation of reality.

Sitting in a meeting shows nothing. Even Indian delegates have been part of these meetings.

Merely losing leverage over Taliban doesn't lead to an outright attack. The OP suggests that the environment has been created due to mismanagement on our part and is ready to be exploited by our enemies.

Americans take U-turns without needing to justify them. They are a ruthless and conniving enemy, so we need to remain vigilant.
 
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It's more the case that our own decisions have led to losing the cause. We have vested interests in Afghanistan and so far, publicly available information shows that we are hurting those interests through poor decision making. Hopefully, there is some deeper leverage that we hold, but so far, that does not seem to be the case.



Sitting in a meeting shows nothing. Even Indian delegates have been part of these meetings.

Merely losing leverage over Taliban doesn't lead to an outright attack. The OP suggests that the environment has been created due to mismanagement on our part and is ready to be exploited by our enemies.

Americans take U-turns without needing to justify them. They are a ruthless and conniving enemy, so we need to remain vigilant.
My friend the impression u r giving is that v have lost complete influence,imo,this isn't case. If india participated there then it had some stake in the process othrwise it would not b invited. Btw, central asian countries also participated so v can say that these hadn't any influence? Every country participated had influence.
If pak hadn't influence then why would US spare us? It would get us sanctioned through UN n plz don't think US is sparing us bcz of China or transportation facility.

Yup I agree,upto extent, that v mismanaged but i think v have enough clout even today that without us Afghan anomaly is not gonna b solved. Taliban got divided n every country has its own factions n v aren't exception.

In politico, nobody is ruthless n nobody is innocent its your strategies which make u saint or otherwise. N i think pak has played its cards outstandingly. The mere existence of Pak n the mere survival of Taliban r the obvious examples. Think where n how Taliban r getting Arms n amunition.?
 
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My friend the impression u r giving is that v have lost complete influence,imo,this isn't case. If india participated there then it had some stake in the process othrwise it would not b invited. Btw, central asian countries also participated so v can say that these hadn't any influence? Every country participated had influence.
If pak hadn't influence then why would US spare us? It would get us sanctioned through UN n plz don't think US is sparing us bcz of China or transportation facility.

Yup I agree,upto extent, that v mismanaged but i think v have enough clout even today that without us Afghan anomaly is not gonna b solved. Taliban got divided n every country has its own factions n v aren't exception.

In politico, nobody is ruthless n nobody is innocent its your strategies which make u saint or otherwise. N i think pak has played its cards outstandingly. The mere existence of Pak n the mere survival of Taliban r the obvious examples. Think where n how Taliban r getting Arms n amunition.?

Taliban are getting arms and ammunition from Russia and Iran in addition to captured ammo dumps of Afghan government.

Now provide proof of your claim that Pakistan holds any leverage.
 
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Taliban are getting arms and ammunition from Russia and Iran in addition to captured ammo dumps of Afghan government.

Now provide proof of your claim that Pakistan holds any leverage.
Russia n iran r providing ammo definitely but 2 their factions. Historically, these countries inclined towards northern alliance but recently these developed relations n intersts wd Taliban so saying that these r full filling the demands of ammo isn't altogether right.


The only proof of our influence on Taliban is that we have not been sanctioned till now n the recent Pentagon's contact with our Foreign office after the tweet Trump did.
 
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