Abbottabad Bin Laden Raid

[Mrc]

Some people will say this. Who cares?

The war was concluded when Taliban accepted American condition for not supporting Al-Qaeda Network in its jihad against US and its interests. Understand this much.

And have they adhered to that condition for a single day?

And was any one in delusion that they will?

 

[jhungary]

This is understandable because the infamous Bali Bomber Umar Patek was found and arrested in Abbottabad in 2011.

You might have witnessed another manhunt episode going on at the time.

Sorry but American operation in Abbottabad is real and was not facilitated. Pakistan and US were not on good terms in 2011 due to Kiyani's strategic depth rationale back in the day.

Now the thing is... Pakistan Army does not feels the need to discuss its each and every activity with the Public. Disinformation is spread intentionally to divert attention from the real issue in some of the cases.

Operation Zarb-e-Azb is well-documented because Pakistan Army wanted the world to see that it is conducting an operation against all manner of militants in North Warziristan. This operation was supposed to take place in 2011 but Kiyani had not approved it.

No wonder Kiyani does not show up on TV. He has a lot to answer for.

Public is also sentimental. Who wants to deal with so many sentiments?

Transparency and debate are values of a mature society. Pakistani are lacking in these values on a broader level. You can see the language some members use on a regular basis.

Usually, I won't be posting in one of these threads. But this one probably takes the cake.

The problem here is, and a major one, if OBL is alive then where is he and why he simply disappear off airwave since 2011? That is also most conspiracy theorist doesn't want to answer or even speculate. Because a logical answer would have to admit that OBL is in cahoots with the American, and everyone, Pakistan and Afghanistan (Taliban not Ghani's Afghan) included, involved in this war had acted dishonorably because this is just one giant charade.

On the other hand, it would be naive to keep the whole body of OBL and give him a proper burial, it's like people after WW2 want to keep the body of Hitler......Bury at sea is not an uncommon and frankly a more expedient way to dispose of his body.

but then all these would not stop any conspiracy theory nutjob out there put in their 20 cents theory.

 

[LeGenD]

Usually, I won't be posting in one of these threads. But this one probably takes the cake.

The problem here is, and a major one, if OBL is alive then where is he and why he simply disappear off airwave since 2011? That is also most conspiracy theorist doesn't want to answer or even speculate. Because a logical answer would have to admit that OBL is in cahoots with the American, and everyone, Pakistan and Afghanistan (Taliban not Ghani's Afghan) included, involved in this war had acted dishonorably because this is just one giant charade.

On the other hand, it would be naive to keep the whole body of OBL and give him a proper burial, it's like people after WW2 want to keep the body of Hitler......Bury at sea is not an uncommon and frankly a more expedient way to dispose of his body.

but then all these would not stop any conspiracy theory nutjob out there put in their 20 cents theory.

Conspiracy theory has become a global trend unfortunately and Americans are equally responsible for this mess.

Recall Michael Moore? How he misled the world with his sophisticated editing skills by creating a 9/11 conspiracy documentary? He gained fame, made money, and stuffed his pockets, but he didn't realize that terrorist networks out there took advantage of his conspiracy theory to find more recruits to serve them and the War On Terror intensified for all stakeholders including Pakistan. Many more died in the process. Many are dying today as well.

Michael Moore is but one example. More took inspiration from him and followed suit. Hollywood effect?

Not only these people, some governments use disinformation and propaganda to create narratives and conceal truths. Authoritative regimes in particular. These are commonly found in Asia.

It is very difficult to set records straight even with good information and data on hand. Perhaps the era of a great deceiver is coming.

It is increasingly important to create Facts & Figures culture. It is increasingly important to move courts against those who are suspected of lying. It is increasingly important to conduct forensics of conspiracy contents.

 

[jhungary]

Conspiracy theory has become a global trend unfortunately and Americans are equally responsible for this mess.

Recall Michael Moore? How he misled the world with his sophisticated editing skills by creating a 9/11 conspiracy documentary? He gained fame, made money, and stuffed his pockets, but he didn't realize that terrorist networks out there took advantage of his conspiracy theory to find more recruits to serve them and the War On Terror intensified for all stakeholders including Pakistan. Many more died in the process. Many are dying today as well.

Michael Moore is but one example. More took inspiration from him and followed suit. Hollywood effect?

It is very difficult to set records straight even with good information and data on hand. Perhaps the era of a great deceiver is coming.

In the field of counter intelligence, this is called "Active Measures", and you can probably guess who started this, yes, Soviet Union, and rumour has it that it came directly from the man, one V Putin..

Active measures - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The problem is, there are no direct countermeasure for Active Measures, because as the old saying goes "idiots are the only resources every country will not run out of" by planting information in strategical local and pipe down strategically especially now with media outlet flooded the internet, everybody can start anything they want.

The only way to counter it? Stop listen to it, and as long as majority of people are not idiots, truth will eventually prevailed. That's the only way to look at it

 

[Abid123]

Sorry but American operation in Abbottabad is real and was not facilitated.

"Was not facilitated". For a guy that has no concrete evidence to present you are for talking quite loud. No reason to act like you know a lot more than the rest of us here.

 

[Neelo]

"Was not facilitated". For a guy that has no concrete evidence to present you are for talking quite loud. No reason to act like you know a lot more than the rest of us here.

He literally deleted my reply to his BS and claimed it was trolling. Lmfao.

Guy openly admits Pakistan's military failed miserably during the abbottabad raid and is proud about it.

Lmfao.

 

[LeGenD]

"Was not facilitated". For a guy that has no concrete evidence to present you are for talking quite loud. No reason to act like you know a lot more than the rest of us here.

I have a simple question: Why would US use stealth technology in a facilitated raid? I can ask more questions if necessary.

I have compiled a list of Facts below:

1. Abbottabad Commission Report
2. CIA 3D model of the Abbottabad compound
3. Dr. Shakeel Afridi
4. Dead bodies found in the compound; these people are identified in the Abbottabad Commission Report
5. Documents recovered from the Abbottabad compound
6. General Ehsan ul Haq's account
7. Pakistan showing the preserved part of the crashed helicopter to a Chinese team
8. Osama Bin Laden's family

Research is a skill, something you do not seem to have. Take your time to check each source and account. Try to connect dots in the end.

Seymour Hersh was not privy to this operation - his account is refuted by those who were privy to the operation in here, here, here, and here.

@Neelo FYI

He literally deleted my reply to his BS and claimed it was trolling. Lmfao.

Guy openly admits Pakistan's military failed miserably during the abbottabad raid and is proud about it.

Lmfao.

You are violating Forum Rules in your post. In the post that I removed, you said that you do not care about violating Forum Rules. This is unacceptable stance.

WE allow "Freedom of Expression" on PDF but this privilege must not be abused. There have been attempts to take down PDF. Do you give a damn about this issue?

You complain about Pakistan Army being subservient to the US all the time. You bash Pakistan Army all the time. When I pointed out that the reality is more complex and Abbottabad raid is not a good example to cite, you call me Faujeet and other words. Make up your mind because you are confused.

I do not read "impregnable defenses" scripts either because this is not true. There is a need to understand and draw correct lessons from developments in the past. Living a bubble reality is not helpful.

 

[Neelo]

Faujeets love diverting the topic away from the main issue.

Notice how Faujeets can't explain why and how American helicopters were allowed to fly 150 kilometres into Pakistani airspace, engage in a 45 minute gun battle down the road from the Pakistan Military Academy during which one of the helicopters were shot down, then proceeded to fly back to Afghanistan without the Pakistan military command even being alerted.

Not one PAF jet was scrambled.

See Faujeets like to try and divert attention away from the actual debate.

Whether or not Bin Laden was there or not there still puts the Pakistan military into question.

1. If he wasn't there, why did the Pakistan military not shoot down the American helicopters once they violated our air space? Why didn't the Pakistan government refute American claims?

2. If he was there, why was he being housed just meters away from PMA? If Pakistan claims to be a member of the American War on Terror then why wasn't he given to the Americans?

Either way you lose Faujeet

"Was not facilitated". For a guy that has no concrete evidence to present you are for talking quite loud. No reason to act like you know a lot more than the rest of us here.

Unfortunately not everyone understands the concept of quality vs quantity.

GHQ bots think writing paragraphs of English means they're smart.

Reality :

 

[LeGenD]

Faujeets love diverting the topic away from the main issue.

Notice how Faujeets can't explain why and how American helicopters were allowed to fly 150 kilometres into Pakistani airspace, engage in a 45 minute gun battle down the road from the Pakistan Military Academy during which one of the helicopters were shot down, then proceeded to fly back to Afghanistan without the Pakistan military command even being alerted.

Not one PAF jet was scrambled.

See Faujeets like to try and divert attention away from the actual debate.

Whether or not Bin Laden was there or not there still puts the Pakistan military into question.

1. If he wasn't there, why did the Pakistan military not shoot down the American helicopters once they violated our air space? Why didn't the Pakistan government refute American claims?

2. If he was there, why was he being housed just meters away from PMA? If Pakistan claims to be a member of the American War on Terror then why wasn't he given to the Americans?

Either way you lose Faujeet



Unfortunately not everyone understands the concept of quality vs quantity.

GHQ bots think writing paragraphs of English means they're smart.

Reality :
View attachment 945507

This topic has been discussed many times but people have short memories. The answers that you are seeking are in the links provided by me.

You claim to be smart but you do not even bother to read what is shared or posted. This is how smart people behave?

 

[Neelo]

Notice again how the issue isn't being addressed

Why and how American helicopters were allowed to fly 150 kilometres into Pakistani airspace, engage in a 45 minute gun battle down the road from the Pakistan Military Academy during which one of the helicopters were shot down, then proceeded to fly back to Afghanistan without the Pakistan military command even being alerted.

Not one PAF jet was scrambled.

Either the Pakistan military is incompetent or were complicit in the raid.

Pick and choose.

 

[Dalit]

Faujeets love diverting the topic away from the main issue.

Notice how Faujeets can't explain why and how American helicopters were allowed to fly 150 kilometres into Pakistani airspace, engage in a 45 minute gun battle down the road from the Pakistan Military Academy during which one of the helicopters were shot down, then proceeded to fly back to Afghanistan without the Pakistan military command even being alerted.

Not one PAF jet was scrambled.

See Faujeets like to try and divert attention away from the actual debate.

Whether or not Bin Laden was there or not there still puts the Pakistan military into question.

1. If he wasn't there, why did the Pakistan military not shoot down the American helicopters once they violated our air space? Why didn't the Pakistan government refute American claims?

2. If he was there, why was he being housed just meters away from PMA? If Pakistan claims to be a member of the American War on Terror then why wasn't he given to the Americans?

Either way you lose Faujeet



Unfortunately not everyone understands the concept of quality vs quantity.

GHQ bots think writing paragraphs of English means they're smart.

Reality :
View attachment 945507

The Pakistani generals were involved and took the blame. 100%.

 

[Neelo]

The Pakistani generals were involved and took the blame. 100%.

Exactly and we all know it. I'm just amazed how Faujeets keep pretending otherwise.

 

[Dalit]

Exactly and we all know it. I'm just amazed how Faujeets keep pretending otherwise.

Faujeets also benefit from the corruption of the generals. Pakistan is a bulwark of corrupt groups and individuals. This is an entire nexus of corruption. They take care of each other and look after their personal interests.

 

[LeGenD]

Notice again how the issue isn't being addressed

Why and how American helicopters were allowed to fly 150 kilometres into Pakistani airspace, engage in a 45 minute gun battle down the road from the Pakistan Military Academy during which one of the helicopters were shot down, then proceeded to fly back to Afghanistan without the Pakistan military command even being alerted.

Not one PAF jet was scrambled.

Either the Pakistan military is incompetent or were complicit in the raid.

Pick and choose.

I have a counter-question: Did US seek Mullah Omar's permission to invade Afghanistan and dismantle Al-Qaeda Network?

You need to stop asking stupid questions.

Ask questions that make sense.

 

[khansaheeb]

I recall during Benazir Bhutto rule there was news that Bin Laden had been caught in Pakistan it was buzzing everywhere and then there was silence and it seems the news was then suppressed /stamped out by the agencies.