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A whiter shade of pale

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Contact Levercare executive

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email: lever.care@unilever.com

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Mail:
Fair & Lovely Foundation
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Toll free no: 1-800 220 130 / 1-800 209 9899

Email:
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Fair and Lovely
 
You're right, that's probably what happened. What I am advocating here is that we don't live in another people's reality.

Often when two people meet, the course of a relationship is determined by who's reality is stronger. (if that makes any sense)

In a perfect world, that might be true. People are happiest in a reality which is very subjective. In Indian philosophy we have a description of that, but i will leave it for now.
But people determine REALITY on their perception of reality. The world is full of that, this forum is no exception. Even the o.p. is afflicted.
 
I don't think they have a problem with the video, rather the fact that you posted it with malicious intent. A contact number isn't helpful.

How can you or anyone acertain I have a malicious intent by posting this? This is the mentality of indians. Everything is racism, and by posting this thread it is automatically a racist thread. Thats why skin whitening creams sales are so rampant in india. This thread more than just proves that how dark a person in india is a major problem among indians. JUST AS THE VIDEO/ARTICLE STATES.

What the video/article states can be seen in real time in this thread and if it wasn't a problem 1.) it would have been laughed off or 2.) no one would have replied


........as opposed to getting angry.
 
What worries me most about whitening your skin is an inherent denigration/rejection of your own identity. By conscienously or unconsciously admitting you want to look like a white person, you are valuing them above your own race. Everyone should be proud of their individuality, the world would be a pretty dull place if we systematically weed out diversity in people and culture.

Also I personally don't agree with plastic surgery because of its potential for abuse by people with body image problems. Skin whiting creams may be no different.

Only if you think it that way. Why not a white person who's getting tanned is rejecting his identity as well? Because in your subconscious mind, you're considering a white person to be inherently superior than a brown one, so when he is getting tanned he is just stooping to a brown man's level, thus not not dis-valuing himself.

I guess we are born with these complexes and it can't be uprooted so easily.
 
What worries me most about whitening your skin is an inherent denigration/rejection of your own identity. By conscienously or unconsciously admitting you want to look like a white person, you are valuing them above your own race. Everyone should be proud of their individuality, the world would be a pretty dull place if we systematically weed out diversity in people and culture.

Also I personally don't agree with plastic surgery because of its potential for abuse by people with body image problems. Skin whiting creams may be no different.

How about crash diets or medicins to become slimmer?

Or simply makeup that 50% of earth's population spends 10% of their life on? Isnt that rejection of ones true identity by painting one's features in colors and creams?

A crappy thread for a crappy purpose.. But then it was S_O_C_O_M's thread so it figures..
 
I don't think they have a problem with the video, rather the fact that you posted it with malicious intent. A contact number isn't helpful.

@CardSharp
Speaking for myself, i don't care about the poster or his actions. I enjoy it to the extent, that it shows how people love to live in a world of make-believe (Maya-Jaal). If you feel curious about that expression first ask Chinese-Dragon about it, he understands it quite well. i believe it helps to view the world with equanimity to say the least.
:cheers:
 
A case in point to prove my previous post.

An indian was called "fat" and all the indians even the indian government called him a racist. Its so deep rooted in the indian's mentality that everything is racist.

New Zealand broadcaster sorry for calling official 'fat Indian' - FOCUS Information Agency

Read the whole news article. But I am sure you did before selcting the snippets that suited your purpose.. By any chance, are you related to another poster whose musings we havent seen for some time?
 
Only if you think it that way. Why not a white person who's getting tanned is rejecting his identity as well? Because in your subconscious mind, you're considering a white person to be inherently superior than a brown one, so when he is getting tanned he is just stooping to a brown man's level, thus not not dis-valuing himself.

I guess we are born with these complexes and it can't be uprooted so easily.

Because you have to understand the roots of why tanning became popular. A year round tan became a status symbol when the rich in America would escape winters in Florida or Southern California. John and the rest of the Kennedys were noted for their tans, and they being virtually American royalty, were imitated by the rest of society.

Similar case in European court, rich and royal women did no work so they were extremely pale and the rest of society and sought to makes themselves pale, to the point were some women thought it was fashionable to have tuberculosis because it made them pale.

In every society, people look up to and admire their social betters. If Indians (and others) are looking to whiten their skin, they are placing being white as a quality of their social betters. This is a dangerous hold over from British colonialism.
 
There is a difference between going to the gym and using chemicals to bleach your skin. Also why is the fact that there are white people in your population matter to this discussion? Think about it, why would you bring that up?

If we can escape physical colonialism, and not mental colonialism, we still lose in the end.


(Also please please please stop using those ............pet peeve)

well what I was trying to point out is that like people covet social position , wealth , talents etc ,fair skin complexion is also coveted by all(not just Indians ),its a human tendency and in our time and age ,it is unacceptable/mean to discriminate on the basis of skin colour , the human tendencies pretty much remain the same,

for instance Michael jackson underwent plastic surgery even in the face of criticism from black groups about his black heritage,in fact a few years back I was viewing the shanghai masters or some such tennis tourno in China where I heard a female Chinese player being interviewed, lament that because of her intensive tennis practice sessions in the heat , she could not be expected to be as fair as other girls...she was laughing about it but the fact that she brought it up shows that such tendencies exist everywhere.....

what I 'm trying to say is that such a problem is not exclusive to india....I'm sure if a survey was to be conducted in other parts of the world....especially in the Arab world ( seeing as it is Al Jazeera makes up such reports)...we shall find such similar tendencies....

(about the ......thingy sorry, force of habit ;) )
 
Read the whole news article. But I am sure you did before selcting the snippets that suited your purpose.. By any chance, are you related to another poster whose musings we havent seen for some time?

why don't you go yell at al-jazeera and all the indians who participated in the video and who sell the skin whitening creams?

Or do you think I was the commentator in the video and i am the ceo of all the skin whitening creams sold in india?

If this was not a major problem in india

1.) no skin whitening creams would be on sale there

2.) numerous articles stating race issues among indians would not be published.

3.) the indians on this forum would not be getting angry and writing cunning posts in an attempt to conceal the realities on the ground of india and to further purport that india is the best perfect place in the whole world.

Take a case in point of the U.S.A. if there was an article that says white people in the U.S.A. are poor and are responsible for crimes and are generally hated upon by other races, no one would reply to that thread or just laugh because they know it is not true. But all the indians have to reply angrily because it is true.
 
Because you have to understand the roots of why tanning became popular. A year round tan became a status symbol when the rich in America would escape winters in Florida or Southern California. John and the rest of the Kennedys were noted for their tans, and they being virtually American royalty, were imitated by the rest of society.

Similar case in European court, rich and royal women did no work so they were extremely pale and the rest of society and sought to makes themselves pale, to the point were some women thought it was fashionable to have tuberculosis because it made them pale.

In every society, people look up to and admire their social betters. If Indians (and others) are looking to whiten their skin, they are placing being white as a quality of their social betters. This is a dangerous hold over from British colonialism.

While I agree it's a kind of colonial hang-over, but it's now become a part of Indian psyche, in a way you can say it's now an indigenous belief system in South Asia. Like you said above, tanning represents status symbol in Western society, as that is not the case in India, we are not exactly sucking up to westerns rather subscribing to our own social life parameters. It's futile to discuss the source of the belief system, let bygones be bygones.
 
why don't you go yell at al-jazeera and all the indians who participated in the video and who sell the skin whitening creams?

Or do you think I was the commentator in the video and i am the ceo of all the skin whitening creams sold in india?

If this was not a major problem in india

1.) no skin whitening creams would be on sale there

2.) numerous articles stating race issues among indians would not be published.

3.) the indians on this forum would not be getting angry and writing cunning posts in an attempt to conceal the realities on the ground of india and to further purport that india is the best perfect place in the whole world.


Take a case in point of the U.S.A. if there was an article that says white people in the U.S.A. are poor and are responsible for crimes and are generally hated upon by other races, no one would reply to that thread or just laugh because they know it is not true. But all the indians have to reply angrily because it is true.


Firstly its people's attitudes that will change with time , the way you project it as a major problem in India makes it sound like
Its an insurgency or corruption problem.

and secondly what's your point , mate ? Fairness creams are not sold in Pakistan ? or in the Gulf states ?
The ground realities that you are describing of India are the ground realities of the entire south asian region including Pakistan , Race issues exist everywhere from the entire western world to Africa and all other places . How do you justify just fingering India of all places ?

here is a 2008 article from Dawn highlighting this issue.......


KARACHI: Beauty salons using ‘toxic’ fairness creams



By Faiza Ilyas


KARACHI, Dec 11: Various preparations used at beauty salons to make facial skin look fairer contain high concentrations of mercury (a dangerous toxin), corticosteroids (a class of steroid hormones) and hydroquinone, a skin-lightening chemical banned in some countries on the basis of studies that suggest it may act as a cancer-causing agent, Dawn has learnt.

Experts believe that the widespread use of such preparations is made easier by the fact that there is no law specifically covering the manufacturing of cosmetic products, nor is there one to regulate the functioning of beauty salons. No section of the Drugs Act 1976 deals with the use of chemicals in cosmetic products.

The lack of government regulation and public awareness are major reasons why so many people, particularly girls, end up damaging their skin, at times for life.

KU findings

According to Dr Nasiruddin Khan, head of the centralised science laboratory at the University of Karachi (KU), the preparation is usually made by mixing four different types of cosmetic creams and ointments already available in the market. One of them is a popular fairness cream that contains hydroquinone as a major ingredient.

Hydroquinone, Dr Khan said, was a strong inhibitor of melanin production. That means it prevents skin from making the substance responsible for colouration. “Hydroquinone actually disrupts the synthesis and production of melanin hyper-pigmentation and the skin starts looking fairer. The chemical is already banned in some countries after some studies suggested that it may act as a carcinogen. The chemical has also been linked to the medical condition, ochronosis, in which the skin becomes dark and thick.

“Dermatologists differ on the use of products containing this chemical. Some regard it as safe when used as directed while others maintain that the prolonged use of such products can be dangerous as it causes the skin to break up and chemicals to penetrate into the bloodstream and reach different organs where serious damage can occur,” he told Dawn.

Another important point, he adds, was the limit set for the chemical’s use. “Currently, products that contain up to two per cent hydroquinone may be sold in the US without a prescription, and prescription skin-lightening products may contain up to four per cent hydroquinone. Besides, all products are tested for efficacy before their launch in the market.

“In our case, however, there is no body to regulate the use of chemicals in cosmetics. Also, beauty salons have been given a free hand to make money at the cost of public health. Poor quality fairness creams and beautifying agents are widely used and are available at prices as low as Rs20.”

In this situation, the question of evaluating the impact of chemicals when used in higher proportions didn’t arise, he said.

The analysis of the preparations, collected from various beauty salons, at the KU lab showed the concentration of mercury as high as 252ppm (parts per million). The permissible level of mercury in cosmetic products is 1.0ppm. The preparations also contained large quantities of hydroquinone.

About the use of mercury in fairness creams, Dr Khan explained that mercury, a dangerous toxin that can cause severe damage to the skin as well as the brain and kidneys in case of penetration, inhibited the synthesis of melanin.

The analysis of the preparations also showed the presence of corticosteroids. “Corticosteroids are a class of steroid hormones often used for reducing skin inflammation. The ointments with corticosteroids are used to reduce the side-effects of other creams mixed in the preparation.

“Prolonged use of steroids triggers the release of an undesirable amount of substances in the blood that cause the blood vessels to widen, causing the affected area to turn red, swollen, itchy and painful. It makes the skin thinner and rough and leads to growth of facial hair.”

‘Women need to change attitude’

The Institute of Skin Diseases, Sindh, receives up to 25 patients weekly complaining of skin problems after getting treatment at beauty salons. Of these patients, 60 to 70 per cent are girls between the age group of 15 and 25. The head of the institute, Dr Sikandar A. Mahar, told Dawn that usually women, mostly from low-income groups, come with allergic symptoms such as redness, acne and itchiness. “The treatment is symptomatic and patients are advised to stop going to beauty parlours for skin treatment,” he said.

At the Jinnah Postgraduate Medical Centre (JPMC), Professor Azam J. Samdani, head of the dermatology department, says that the use of steroids on the face can lead to irreversible damage if such products are used for a longer period. “Once the skin gets thinner, it becomes difficult to bring it back to its normal condition. Though we get few patients, the trend to use substandard fairness creams, especially at beauty parlours, is increasing.”

Criticising the role of the media, particularly television channels in this respect, Professor Dr Zarnaz Wahid of the Civil Hospital Karachi (CHK), said that a code of ethics needs to be made and implemented to telecast programmes on public health. “There is no problem in explaining the causes of different ailments, but their treatment should not be discussed as it required a thorough individual examination.”

The various preparations, she said, used at beauty salons did make the skin look fairer, but for a very short while. “Soon, the ‘nice’ effect goes away and the client is once again at the salon. The uneducated class is usually the main victim in such cases.”

Dr Wahid is of the opinion that normal skin can easily be taken care of at home and women should consult a dermatologist rather than a beautician for skin treatment. “The markets are flooded with products with European brand names, but actually they are made in China and Taiwan, many of which are not allergy tested. Second, their shelf-life expires quickly as they are usually kept in low temperatures. So, one has to be careful while choosing cosmetics.”

Need for regulation

When approached by Dawn, the executive district officer of the city government’s health department, Dr A.D. Sajnani, conceded that a legal vacuum existed. “Yes, there is a need for laws on the use of chemicals in cosmetic products since chemicals can be allergens or carcinogenic,” he admitted. “Beauty salons used to be inspected in terms of the working conditions when some bylaws were formulated by the defunct KMC. There is no such arrangement right now.”

On behalf of the Pakistan Medical Association, Dr Samrina Hashmi said that there was a dire need of public awareness on this issue since government checks existed only on paper.

According to a Pakistan Standards and Quality Control Authority official, various standards on cosmetics exist, but they have not yet been adopted by the government. At the moment, only 67 standards are on the government list of enforcement.​
 
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