A NEW AIRCRAFT FOR PAF

[Blue Marlin]

@Tipu7 @Basel @Blue Marlin @ACE OF THE AIR @waz
Will Brexit have any impact if we select euro typhoon? And How will the process proceed now?

no

 

[Farhan Hashmi]

I hope these new jets will be 5th gen and few SU 35 will be included too

 

[nomi007]

I think j-31 and jf-17bk-03 are our future fighters

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

@Tipu7 @Basel @Blue Marlin @ACE OF THE AIR @waz
Will Brexit have any impact if we select euro typhoon? And How will the process proceed now?

It depends on what we choose. If we get old EFT then there is no problem. Some parts that are made in UK would require Pakistan to direct contract.

If we buy new then things might be different in case EU decides to put an embargo of freedom of goods, to UK. However all the parties would find a workable solution in regards to deliver aircraft to customers. Worst case scenario would be Germany, Italy and Spain upgrading their own assembly plants to manufacture the complete aircraft hence leaving UK to sell individually.

There should not be any impact on sales of products, remember its about generating revenue. Also Tornado were built and sold when there was no EU (if I m not mistaken).

The agreement of being an EU member State is 41 years old, hence Tornado was technically a European aircraft.

Sir, I am not pro yet arguments of latest jets operating at 30,000 ft for bombing ground targets looks not correct to me it will be utterly suicide in new era. During Kargil war the Mirage 2000was operating at very high altitudes out of range of SAMS. The Mig 27 or Mig 21 can't destroyed by PA with Anza's can't be considered modern. (Though Mig27 claimed to be destryed by tech error). I hope I have made my point though rather foolishly.

To understand when and how high level bombing missions are planed you have to understand what kind of threat the enemy holds. If the place that is to be bombed is being protected by low to medium level SAM systems then High level Bombers can be sent. With precision guided bombs. if there is a threat of enemy fighters then fighter aircraft would be sent in advance to neutralize that threat.

If you read the attack on Libya you would understand how the French neutralized the SAM. Then you can also read about Gulf War II where Iraqi radars were destroyed and Iraqi Air Force aircraft were shot down by F-15's.
Afghanistan however did not posses any threat other than stingers hence USAF could use all types of aircraft. B52's loaded Daisy Cutter Bombs bombed the Tora Bora mountains at will.

 

[Ultima Thule]

Yes they do carry PAY LOAD at MAXIMUM CERTIFIED ALTITUDE. However MAXIMUM DESIGN ALTITUDE is higher to calculate stress tests.

An aircraft can be operated on Maximum Design Altitude with Maximum Payload but it is not recommended.

@CHI RULES Hope this is enough to end this argument.

Sir, I am not pro yet arguments of latest jets operating at 30,000 ft for bombing ground targets looks not correct to me it will be utterly suicide in new era. During Kargil war the Mirage 2000was operating at very high altitudes out of range of SAMS. The Mig 27 or Mig 21 can't destroyed by PA with Anza's can't be considered modern. (Though Mig27 claimed to be destryed by tech error). I hope I have made my point though rather foolishly.

why you can't accept the fact all modern fighter has service ceiling 20,000 to 30,000 because you live in your wet dream and fantasy world

 

[Basel]

It depends on what we choose. If we get old EFT then there is no problem. Some parts that are made in UK would require Pakistan to direct contract.

If we buy new then things might be different in case EU decides to put an embargo of freedom of goods, to UK. However all the parties would find a workable solution in regards to deliver aircraft to customers. Worst case scenario would be Germany, Italy and Spain upgrading their own assembly plants to manufacture
the complete aircraft hence leaving UK to sell individually.


The agreement of being an EU member State is 41 years old, hence Tornado was technically a European aircraft.


To understand when and how high level bombing missions are planed you have to understand what kind of threat the enemy holds. If the place that is to be bombed is being protected by low to medium level SAM systems then High level Bombers can be sent. With precision guided bombs. if there is a threat of enemy fighters then fighter aircraft would be sent in advance to neutralize that threat.

If you read the attack on Libya you would understand how the French neutralized the SAM. Then you can also read about Gulf War II where Iraqi radars were destroyed and Iraqi Air Force aircraft were shot down by F-15's.
Afghanistan however did not posses any threat other than stingers hence USAF could use all types of aircraft. B52's loaded Daisy Cutter Bombs bombed the Tora Bora mountains at will.

The current brexit is due to the changes made during 1980-90 ( no borders) so UK can work with EU on older agreement / status. @Blue Marlin what is your say, will EU and UK chalk down similar agreement or procedures to avoid issues and conflict.

http://europa.eu/about-eu/eu-history/index_en.htm

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

why you can't accept the fact all modern fighter has service ceiling 20,000 to 30,000 because you live in your wet dream and fantasy world

Service ceiling of 20000 - 30000 then how come the Greek F-16 intercept Helios B-737-300 that was flying at 35000 with cabin pressure failure over Athens and crashed.

Today Civil aircraft fly at 35000 - 41000 ft. This is due to oxygen requirement. Cabin altitude that is maintained is 6000 - 7000 ft. Next time when you fly ask the cabin crew to show you the cabin altimeter when you are at cruse.

Air force aircraft carry oxygen generators hence they can go even higher.

 

[Blue Marlin]

The current brexit is due to the changes made during 1980-90 ( no borders) so UK can work with EU on older agreement / status. @Blue Marlin what is your say, will EU and UK chalk down similar agreement or procedures to avoid issues and conflict.

http://europa.eu/about-eu/eu-history/index_en.htm

no problems in the first place, work continues as usual

 

[volatile]

no problems in the first place, work continues as usual

Highly doubted as the companies which were solely operated under EU were having EU compliance standards with advent of BREX IT there is a strong chance all previous agreements in which UK was a partner will have to renegotiate with UK again .I have already shared one article in this regard

http://money.cnn.com/2016/06/24/inv...-uk-companies1203PMVODtopLink&linkId=25874027

British business leaders warned for months that if U.K. voters chose to exile themselves from the European Union, there would be swift, negative consequences.
On Friday, their fears were realized. The pound was hammered, bank stocks plunged, and investors preyed on companies that do a lot of business in the U.K.

British Airways owner IAG (ICAGY) almost immediately issued a profit warning. The company said it anticipates minimal long-term impact, but it issued a profit warning because of a difficult trading environment and current market volatility.

Low cost airline EasyJet (ESYJY) was slammed. The stock fell over 14% Friday. CEO Carolyn McCall said the company doing everything it can to ensure "the U.K. remains part of the single EU aviation market" so planes can still fly freely around Europe.


Banks take big hits

Aftershocks from the vote were felt widely: Big banks, many of which run their European operations from London's Canary Wharf, were among the hardest hit. Barclays shares were down 20%, Lloyds Bank (LLDTF) 21% and RBS 18%. It's possible that thousands of jobs will be cut in the sector, as many banks have threatened to move their operations out of London.

U.S. banks also got hit, feeling the downsides of the American-British "special relationship."Morgan Stanley (MS) fell over 10%, Citigroup (C) slid over 9% and Goldman Sachs (GS) was down 7%. Invesco (IVZ), an investment firm headquartered in the U.S. but with a substantial presence in the U.K. was the worst performer in the entire S&P 500, falling nearly 14%. The company did not respond to CNNMoney's request for comment.

There's now a real debate if London will remain a global financial capital. In a message sent to staffers, JPMorgan (JPM) CEO Jamie Dimon said the bank's 16,000 employees in the U.K. would continue to serve clients as usual. He warned, however, that the bank may "need to make changes to our European legal entity structure and the location of some roles."

Related: London and European stocks get crushed

Beyond the banks: Automakers, home builders

It wasn't just big banks, though. The FTSE 250, which is made up of mostly mid-sized British companies, plummeted 7.2%.

SAVINGS RATES BY
Moody's warned that automakers, manufacturers and food producers in Britain could suffer from higher trade barriers and reduced volumes. The credit ratings agency said increased regulatory risk would hit telecom firms, airlines and drug makers.

Ford (F), which has nearly 14,000 workers in the U.K., fell over 6.5%. The company told CNNMoney it would "take whatever action is needed to ensure that our European business remains competitive," although it has no plans at present to make any changes.

Related: Brexit: Is this like the 2008 financial crisis?

Other U.S. stocks with a big presence in Britain also fell sharply. Companies that make car parts like BorgWarner (BWA) and Delphi Automotive (DLPH) tanked about 10% each. Travel sitePriceline (PCLN, Tech30), which has a lot of revenue coming from Europe, fell over 11% andAmerican Airlines (AAL) (a partner with British Airways) lost over 10%.

House builders were tipped as big losers too. Analysts are worried that a sharp decline in consumer confidence will hurt home sales. Foreign buyers might also find London a much less attractive option for property investment.

There are tremendous levels of uncertainty facing British businesses. London must now establish new trading relationships with its major foreign partners, and determine the immigration status of EU migrants currently working in the U.K.

THere is already a safe matem in Britain as people are comparing it with Trump being elected as US president ,by the way they also have a politician look like and talk like Trump .

 

[Wolf]

There is going to be a development by Indians in which they will be approving 10.5 billion dollars of purchases including S 400. So, it may impact on our chances of getting Su 35. However, this needs to be seen that when Indians are going to make payments. I hope world won't fall for Indians this time unless they get cash in hand.

 

[A2Z]

I hope the news is a real and not a rumor. However what I think is this time as well PAF would go for used F-16. They may be getting the jordanian ones and some block 40 or 50s (which they are terming as "high end") from turkey or some european state.

However if I am completely wrong they might go for Su-35 not EFT as EFT is a bit out of PAF's range, though its a potent western platform that is second only to F-22 when we talk about air superiority. Secondly Pakistan's diplomacy is a bit weak to handle UK, Germany, Italy and Spain all together keeping in mind the moment we choose EFT our neighbors will start winning just like the recent F-16 saga.

Moreover in Su-35 vs EFT my personal opinion would also be in Sukhoi's favor as no matter what any western platform is prone to sanctions. We were able to maintain our F-16 in 90s through Turkey and some backdoor channels but Typhoon would hit a dead end in case of sanctions as GCC states are only other countries that operate them and they might break under western pressure. Hence in this scenario Su-35 which china would be operating and also have vast experience in maintaining and manufacturing Flankers will be very helpful.

Lastly we also cannot rule out the possibility of getting Chinese flankers as they too are quite potent and Russians can allow their sale to PAF with Russian engines.

 

[ali rajab khattak]

I did hear about some sort of negotiations with Russia over buying the Sukhoi Su-30 or 35
Aircraft but I don't know whether we're going to get them or not. does any one have information related to this deal?

 

[zebra7]

no way MIG-25 can cruise 80,000+ ft with 4 missiles give me a reliable source Please and don't post crapy wikipedia links

Max altitude attained by MIG 25 was 37,650 metres (123,520 ft) in 1977 31st August by Fedotov.

 

[Jana Assassin]

My Guess is EF 2000

Buyin the EF 2000 is a vry bad idea as it is a joint venture, so a scuffle with any of the partner nations can result in parts shortage...

 

[Hamza913]

Buyin the EF 2000 is a vry bad idea as it is a joint venture, so a scuffle with any of the partner nations can result in parts shortage...

And impossible. If they wouldn't sell it to you lot, doubt they would sell it to us.