5th Gen FGFA Deal with Russia about to Crash land : Report

[AugenBlick]

IF media says there are problems then I think the deal is going pretty smoothly.

 

[gambit]

...which has to protect itself from rain...

This tells me you know nothing of the technical issues which earns you nothing but derision from those of us -- like me -- who do know.

Am going to be nice and give you a clue: If rain is detrimental to 'stealth', it is 10 times worse for 'non-stealth'.

See if you can figure that out.

According to your definition of a lemon, all American aircraft are lemons, because they all experienced issues in their development phases.

Soviet/Russian projects are trouble free, you did not know that ?

Wait...What was the point of this thread ?

 

[AugenBlick]

This tells me you know nothing of the technical issues which earns you nothing but derision from those of us -- like me -- who do know.

Am going to be nice and give you a clue: If rain is detrimental to 'stealth', it is 10 times worse for 'non-stealth'.

See if you can figure that out.


Soviet/Russian projects are trouble free, you did not know that ?

Wait...What was the point of this thread ?

Fanbois aside F35 is still a pretty good aircraft. The fact that other countries (maybe russia excluded,but T50/FGFA still in prototype) can not say for sure to make a F35 killer aircraft (even with all the kinks in it) and F22 still is the king is testament to american/western technology.

 

[Skillrex]

I dont have much knowledge like you guys.. but one thing i know for certain.. F35 may be plagued with dozens of problems... But US will pull it through like it or not with money and RnD power.. F35 will be world class jet in coming years by hook or crook

 

[AugenBlick]

I dont have much knowledge like you guys.. but one thing i know for certain.. F35 may be plagued with dozens of problems... But US will pull it through like it or not with money and RnD power.. F35 will be world class jet in coming years by hook or crook

Agreed. And that is because F35 will be inducted and used and iterated again and again. While moron Indians will grovel and push Tejas aside and cheer for F16. and 3 decades later the saga will repeat for F35

 

[Skillrex]

Agreed. And that is because F35 will be inducted and used and iterated again and again. While moron Indians will grovel and push Tejas aside and cheer for F16. and 3 decades later the saga will repeat for F35

I am not certain India is even interested with F35.. sole reason are strings which wil comes with it. About tejas.. its our aircraft.. you like it or not.. After all those years of delays we finally have something.. which will give us base for next Jet ie AmCa.. And about f16.. i say its crap.. total waste of money and resource.. Our green neighbour are already having f16 for last 2 decade if i am not wrong, and they know 90% of the jets screw n bolts.. no matter which version of f16 is offered... its still F16.

 

[gambit]

Really? Ok, here goes. The F-35 is a case of massive over ambition to develop one base airframe that can be adapted to replace half-dozen specialized jets. The result is an expensive jack-of-all-trades, but a master of none.

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/5th-gen-...crash-land-report.427991/page-2#ixzz46m9d7c2w

Clue for you: EVERYONE want a jack-of-all-trades-master-of-none platform

Open your eyes and look around, kid.

Other than US, who is making specialized platforms like a pure bomber or a pure any platform ? Am not talking about maintaining Cold War era legacy platforms but talking about ACTIVE exploration of mission specific platforms ?

Nobody. Not even the Russians.

Why ? Because not everyone has our wealth. But even with our wealth, every fighter platform that we fielded have at least an exploration into turning into a jack-of-all-trades platform. Even the fleet defense fighter F-14 was momentarily turned into a bomb dropper and it was as mission specific as the SR-71 was mission specific.

The issue is not whether a platform is jack-of-all-trades but how are the bars of those trades. A fighter-bomber cannot carry bombs like the missions specific 'bomber' platform, but it can compensate by having more accuracy and precision for the few bombs it can carry. For countries, including your India, that must import their defense, jack-of-all-trades platforms are all they can afford, either to buy or in indigenous development.

Where is India's '5th gen' bomber ? You barely get along with China and Pakistan, so where is a strategic weapon like a bomber ? You need a master of that one trade, no ? The F-16 is a jack-of-all-trades-master-of-none and it raised the bars on all those trades. Where are the criticisms on that ? Everyone uses the F-16 as THE standard to match or beat in their own indigenous fighter-bomber programs.

The criticism that the F-35 is a jack-of-all-trades-master-of-none is an immature one in light of decades of air combat and associated weapons development.

 

[AugenBlick]

I am not certain India is even interested with F35.. sole reason are strings which wil comes with it. About tejas.. its our aircraft.. you like it or not.. After all those years of delays we finally have something.. which will give us base for next Jet ie AmCa.. And about f16.. i say its crap.. total waste of money and resource.. Our green neighbour are already having f16 for last 2 decade if i am not wrong, and they know 90% of the jets screw n bolts.. no matter which version of f16 is offered... its still F16.

"knowing" a jet does not give you a significant advantage. The Chinese "know" Su30 and Su35 pretty well. this "knowing" is just that. You also need resource (money/RnD/Capability) to counter it. That's the hard part.

My problem is that US will induct and better the F35 in about a decade while Indians are willing to dump our own tejas without giving it a chance and already rooting for F16 which is at the end of it's life. 3 decades down the line these same morons will want F35 whne US inducts 6th Gen. That is all I am saying.

 

[C130]

India is going to end paying $200 million per FGFA which is basically a Su-30MKI with internal weapons bay albeit with more powerful engine and upgraded avionics.

it's going to cost a ton to fly and maintain just like the Su-30MKI is, and if it doesn't have availability rate of over 80% but more like 50% to 60% is going to suck as well.

 

[somebozo]

In fact, IAF went further to slam Russians for not giving access to the developed prototypes of the aircraft to its pilots. Moreover, it also expressed apprehension that the Russians would not share critical design information with India because they have deliberately reduced the Indian work share despite India’s huge expenditure on the preliminary design. India’s work share in FGFA research and development and other aspects of the multi-billion dollar project at the moment is nearly 10 per cent, even though Delhi is bearing 50 per cent of the project cost.

What experience does India have in building fighters at all???
The russians are simply getting a taste of Indian engineering..

 

[Skillrex]

What experience does India have in building fighters at all???
The russians are simply getting a taste of Indian engineering..

What xp does pakistan with JF ??? assembling like lego kits doesnt give you experience. thats why tejas had to go through all those delays. if we have been assembling tejas kits than it should have been flying with number sqads by now which is not

"knowing" a jet does not give you a significant advantage. The Chinese "know" Su30 and Su35 pretty well. this "knowing" is just that. You also need resource (money/RnD/Capability) to counter it. That's the hard part.
My problem is that US will induct and better the F35 in about a decade while Indians are willing to dump our own tejas without giving it a chance and already rooting for F16 which is at the end of it's life. 3 decades down the line these same morons will want F35 whne US inducts 6th Gen. That is all I am saying.

Well.. i dont think indian govt will induct f16..ever..first it will be logistical nightmare.. f16. amca..tejas.. fgfa.. su.. rafael...mig.. what i think it was a ploy from DF to bring frenchies to the table. which kinda worked if i go by recent news regarding rafael.
and you are right.. when we will go into 5th gen .. US will shift to 6th gen.. may not be immediate.. but they will for sure.

 

[Jai Bharat]

Sounds like another Admiral Gorshokov.

Russians want to rope India into a subpar product, and then jack up the price after commitments have been made to subsidize their struggle defense industry.

If India sinks $4 Billion into the development program for FGFA, expect Russia to start asking for more money and time along with increased unit prices for the fighter than what was agreed. Even PakFA supporters can't deny that this is a major and expected possibility.

No major deals for new equipment with Russia since the Kamov KA-226T have been made. I expect that it stays that way bar the S-400 and Yasen class submarine lease.

 

[cirr]

Jumping into bed with any guy you may lay your hands on?

 

[LittleFish]

Be careful doing business with Russians as we are.

 

[posedion]

BS article writing is an art and this guy gets 5 stars for it