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Possible Russian S-400 sale to India and Pakistan's Response.

So for all our Indian members on this thread, brothers, I have a question for you. If you have such a state of the art air defence system already, which will be further complemented by S-400, how come a Pakistani drone was able to make this video with impunity and guide our artillery in real time?

https://defence.pk/threads/indian-army-post-on-fire.453458/#post-8770199

This most likely is a handheld drone, which never even crossed the border.

Much like Chinese toy drone that Pakistani rangers shot down a few months back, claiming it to be Indian spy aircraft , only to find out, it was a toy drone, that was being flown from Pakistan itself.
 
This most likely is a handheld drone, which never even crossed the border.

Much like Chinese toy drone that Pakistani rangers shot down a few months back, claiming it to be Indian spy aircraft , only to find out, it was a toy drone, that was being flown from Pakistan itself.

Point is still made that if a drone can travel freely undetected over such a heavily militarized area then it can attack as well.
 
The target is already acquired, i.e. radar source. As for controlling them, they could be ground controlled, preprogrammed, multiple options there


How you are going to control 100s of drones.. you should have manned option.. interesting so you have command control center that can monitor hundreds of drones at a time .. and 100 of launchers .

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That's to be seen now isn't it. Much like how the Patriot missiles were deadly against a few scuds but when tested against america's own SSMs in large numbers, it was a failure.



You are comparing pak tech with Americans..
 
How you are going to control 100s of drones.. you should have manned option.. interesting so you have command control center that can monitor hundreds of drones at a time .. and 100 of launchers .
Yes that technology too exists and is old, from the early 90s. What hole have you been living in?
 
Point is still made that if a drone can travel freely undetected then it can attack as well.
He is in denial. He is saying all of this was filmed from the Pakistani side of the border. Do we have any idea how deep into enemy territory the drone went? Or did it really stay within Pakistani borders?
 
Yes that technology too exists and is old, from the early 90s. What hole have you been living in?


What kinda technology, can you please provide details .. enlighten us.. this discussion getting very interesting..

Yes that technology too exists and is old, from the early 90s. What hole have you been living in?


What kinda technology, can you please provide details .. enlighten us.. this discussion getting very interesting..
 
doh.gif



That's to be seen now isn't it. Much like how the Patriot missiles were deadly against a few scuds but when tested against america's own SSMs in large numbers, it was a failure.
It was tested against very large numbers, that why it's the most combat proven air defense system in the world
 
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So for all our Indian members on this thread, brothers, I have a question for you. If you have such a state of the art air defence system already, which will be further complemented by S-400, how come a Pakistani drone was able to make this video with impunity and guide our artillery in real time?

https://defence.pk/threads/indian-army-post-on-fire.453458/#post-8770199

This most likely is a handheld drone, which never even crossed the border.

Much like Chinese toy drone that Pakistani rangers shot down a few months back, claiming it to be Indian spy aircraft , only to find out, it was a toy drone, that was being flown from Pakistan itself.
 
It was tested against very large numbers, that why it's the most combat proven air defense system in the world
You claimed just above that "in theory" it could. You even admitted that hamas (or hizbullah for that matter, well maybe not them) isn't capable of launching at most a dozen or so rockets. The test video is nice, but its a test and not a saturation test at that. And here's a worst case scenario, what do you do when there are still incoming rockets (provided hamas was capable of doing that) once your battery has run out of rockets? End of the day, it becomes a game of attrition now doesn't it?

What kinda technology, can you please provide details .. enlighten us.. this discussion getting very interesting..




What kinda technology, can you please provide details .. enlighten us.. this discussion getting very interesting..
https://www.newscientist.com/articl...ontrolled-at-once-in-a-record-breaking-swarm/

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You claimed just above that "in theory" it could. You even admitted that hamas (or hizbullah for that matter, well maybe not them) isn't capable of launching at most a dozen or so rockets. The test video is nice, but its a test and not a saturation test at that. And here's a worst case scenario, what do you do when there are still incoming rockets (provided hamas was capable of doing that) once your battery has run out of rockets? End of the day, it becomes a game of attrition now doesn't it?
End of the game, yes, it becomes game of priorities.
That's why the airforce is attacking launchers, and people go inside the shelters, cause there's no such as 100% protection.
Important installation will be protected first, before populated areas, and citizens are expected to be in the shelters that are in residential homes and in public areas.
Israel is also developing the Iron Beam, which is expected to shoot down mortars and rockets at the cost of 100-1000 USD per interception.
Iron Beam is expected to form the lowest layer of defense
As for the video I provided, It's not test video, those are live interceptions
 
End of the game, yes, it becomes game of priorities.
That's why the airforce is attacking launchers, and people go inside the shelters, cause there's no such as 100% protection.
Important installation will be protected first, before populated areas, and citizens are expected to be in the shelters that are in residential homes and in public areas.
Israel is also developing the Iron Beam, which is expected to shoot down mortars and rockets at the cost of 100-1000 USD per interception.
Iron Beam is expected to form the lowest layer of defense
yes, I agree there that nothing provides 100% protection. The iron beam maybe adequet against mortar shells but against warheads with proper shielding, that too may not be enough. So basically your saying the same thing that I am...it eventually becomes a slugfest, a numbering game of attrition. And the advantage that the attacking side is that incoming shells, rockets, missiles, drones, etc. what have you are relatively inexpensive as compared to the intercepting missiles which are bound to be far more expensive and thus harder to make or purchase.

But agreed that it gives the population enough time to run for cover.
 
yes, I agree there that nothing provides 100% protection. The iron beam maybe adequet against mortar shells but against warheads with proper shielding, that too may not be enough. So basically your saying the same thing that I am...it eventually becomes a slugfest, a numbering game of attrition. And the advantage that the attacking side is that incoming shells, rockets, missiles, drones, etc. what have you are relatively inexpensive as compared to the intercepting missiles which are bound to be far more expensive and thus harder to make or purchase.

But agreed that it gives the population enough time to run for cover.
Swarm of drones ain't that easy to deploy, and beside that, methods of interception of such targets have been developed already.
Proper missile shield give u the advantage to defend your critical assets while attacking enemy targets.
NEWS
IAI UNVEILS "DRONE GUARD": DRONE DETECTION AND DISRUPTION COUNTER UAV SYSTEMS
Oct 19, 2015


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The systems will be presented during the Seoul ADEX exhibition

Israel Aerospace Industries (IAI) will unveil the Drone Guard- new systems for drone detection, identification and flight disruption - during the Seoul International Aerospace and Defence Exhibition (ADEX) which opens this week (IAI at Booth #C-53).

The use of small drones has increased dramatically over the years, making them a potential threat to critical infrastructures, other aircraft and homeland security (HLS), due to their small size, low speed and low flight altitude. These drones may be used for a number of reasons, including hostile purposes such as intelligence gathering, smuggling, or as weaponized platforms. In addition, they are difficult to detect or disrupt due to their low visibility and low Radar Cross Section (RCS).
To meet this emerging challenge, IAI's Subsidiary and Group, ELTA Systems Ltd., offers specially adapted 3-Dimensional (3D) radars and Electro-Optical (EO) sensors for detection and identification, as well as dedicated Electronic Attack (EA) jamming systems for disrupting drone flight.

To detect low signature, low-level and low-speed airborne targets, ELTA has adapted to this specific mission its 3D radars, which include the ELM-2026D, ELM-2026B and ELM-2026BF for short (10km), medium (15km) and long (20 km) ranges, respectively, with special drone detection and tracking algorithms, as well as adapting them with EO sensors for visual identification of the target.

In order to disrupt the hostile UAV, ELTA has developed advanced adaptive jamming systems which can be used in concert with its detection and identification sensors, or as a continuously operated stand-alone system. The jamming disrupts the drone's flight and can either cause it to return to its point-of-origin (‘Return Home' function) or to shut down and make a crash landing.
"Drone Guard" systems have been extensively and successfully tested against a variety of different drones and scenarios, including simultaneous multiple drone penetrations or attacks.

Nissim Hadas, IAI Executive VP and ELTA President said: "We have begun demonstrating these novel capabilities to potential customers, in response to this new threat. We believe that in the near future every critical asset and public site will require these safety measures for protection against hostile drones".
 
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