Yeah, I was joking, cause I'm sure you wont see the day which they would remove the sanctions.
we don't need nuclear weapon, and we don't have the tools to deliver it to it's target, remember how many missile shield are between us and them. also if Americans use a nuke against us, most probably it will lead to a nuke war between super powers, so I don't care about their nukes too.
we negotiated for sanctions removal, but in this deal we got suspension, and that's just after approval of IAEA. in each case I'm sure Americans wont let remove the sanctions.
you forgot to mention Libya bowed to U.S pressure and gave up all of its nuclear program. what did they get in return? where is their industry, where is their advancements? if giving up your rights has such an exploding effects then why we can't see even one effect out of zillion ones? what happened to Iraq after they accepted the american spy to search their whole country? what happened to Saddam?
you can't compare us with japan cause we are in an ideology war with U.S, japan wasn't. the amount of advancement is defined by amount of science research and relying to domestic potentials, lifting the sanctions doesn't make a difference. they wont give their technology to us, but rather their product. there was a time that in south korea, children would mock and abandon anyone of their classmates who would use foreign tools, what about our country? the ultimate dream has become to ride a Mercedes Benz. This way nothing will change. producing a zillion things will remain an empty slogan (it's not even our dream). European returned, but where are their investments? zero foreign investment in industry during 2 years of Rohani's term! yet you got the same sh!ts from France, the same sh!ts which people don't want to buy anymore. one week after their foreign minister secured their sell in Iran, asked their investors to not rush for Iran. right now every single Iranian who was fooled by Rohani's economical lies knows that it was just the centrifuges which stopped spinning, the other wheel hasn't moved at all.
about your last sentence, I consider it a joke.
Nice. We are getting somewhere now. It is good you dropped the nuclear fuel argument since that argument is really a joke. In the next 15 years which is the timeline of this deal, Iran's nuclear energy share as part of its total energy mix will not significantly increase to such levels that would justify keeping Iran under sanctions. After 15 years, Iran will be able free to do whatever enrichment it wants. But my guess is, Iran still will not go towards a full blown industrial scale enrichment since it wont make much economic sense. Yes, Iran might set up 5 new enrichment plant and scale up to per perhaps 200 kSWU but not at a global industrial level. Other nations have millions of SWU capacities, but they have been at this game since 1950's.
Now lets take a closer look at what you said and examine it properly:
we don't need nuclear weapon.
If that was the case, the entire nuclear program of Iran is basically a waste of money. The "We don't need nuclear weapons" is a politico-ideological slogan. Just like many other slogans, used in Iran. These are supposed to serve a purpose sometimes internal and sometimes external. Iran's politics is riddled with them. In essence and on their own they are useless and ridiculous as empty holes. Just like a bubble, they are hollow from within. But these holes and bubbles are necessary sometime like the holes in Swiss cheese. There would be no Swiss cheese if there were no bubbly holes in it. Similarly Iranian politics without sloganeering would not be Iranian politics.
and we don't have the tools to deliver it to it's target, remember how many missile shield are between us and them.
Complete falsehood. Almost a lie. The most efficient way to deliver nukes is considered to be via ballistic missiles. Since it is very difficult, expensive and technically inefficient to intercept them compared to other methods of delivery. Much hype has been created by the missile shield technology but these are unproven in battle, technically easy to counter and economically expensive to implement. This is the method all nuclear armed states are using themselves. In fact the long range ballistic missile technology was developed for this purpose alone, not for the delivery of conventional warheads.
Iran is the only country in the world and history that has produced ballistic missiles with range greater than thousand miles without first having nuclear weapons. All other missile powers are already nuclear powers too. By this token, Iran's missile program is completely unnecessary. In fact this point was raised again and again during the negotiations and was the subject of UNSC sanctions. No country aside from Iran believes that long range ballistic missile technology has any use except the delivery of nuclear weapons. The only exception to this rule has been the recent development of Chinese anti-access ship killing long range ballistic missile program.
also if Americans use a nuke against us, most probably it will lead to a nuke war between super powers, so I don't care about their nukes too
No it wont. Not in a million years. You are thinking too highly of yourself here. Even if US nuked Iran into extinction, no body would lift a finger. In fact, many would laugh and make fun of the fact, that Iran used to "brag" so much about its defensive technologies but at the end got nuked. God forbid if such a thing happens, if you, your computer and your internet connection survived the blast, you will see the laughter right on this forum as well. The only reason, they have not done so already is because of these factors:
1) After the horrible effects of the use of nuclear weapons on Japan became known, a kind of international taboo over the use of such weapons came about. This taboo, has a good function namely preventing wars in which nuclear weapons are used. No body wants to break this taboo. But this is just a taboo and not really a ban on their use, and if they are used it does not automatically mean a nuclear war between superpowers (of which there is only one left, the United States of America). After 9/11, US had indicated to its allies that it wants to use nuclear weapons on Afghanistan and no one protested it. But then this use was deemed unnecessary since the whole world including Iran, Cuba and North Korea supported US. Such a unique global support for a single nation had not been seen since the last ice age crashed the human population pushing humanity to near extinction, and probably will not be seen again if ever, until a catastrophe on the level of an Extinction Event.
2) It will set a bad example for non-nuclear states specially those which already have nuclear technology for instance Brazil, Argentine, South Africa, Japan etc to become nuclear armed at least secretly in order to be able to prevent a nuclear armed state from attacking them by being able to threaten back the aggressor. And those without nuclear technology will do whatever in their means to either develop their own technology or buy it from other countries. In effect, nuclear weapons will become like conventional weapons.
3) US does not need to employ nuclear weapons against a target like Iran. Since the conventional force of US military is great enough that, it can bring about destruction comparable to nuclear weapons with regard to a country like Iran. To give an example, it wont really matter for the butterfly if it was killed by a grenade or by a
BLU-82. You don't use a gaz-anbor where you can use a tweezers to do the job.
we negotiated for sanctions removal, but in this deal we got suspension, and that's just after approval of IAEA.
This is the best you could get. You are not the superpower here. You do not have veto in UNSC. You do not have couple of thousands thermonuclear weapons. You do not have an economy on which the rest of the world depends. It is actually a bad deal for US. Since despite all its power, basically it has negotiated a very fair deal with a militarily weak country. This could have been negotiated differently as the Americans opposing this deal are pointing it out.
Without Iran having nuclear weapons to deter, basically US could bomb Iran day and night for 3 months. Destroying every power station, every bridge, every airport, every major hospital, every factory, every railway station, every fuel depot, every refinery, every communication node, etc in essence all the infrastructure Iran has built in the past one century would be razed. Then US would offer to negotiate the unconditional surrender of Iran. And you would not even know about it. You know why? Because you will be in stone age by then, with no electricity, no communication and no transportation you would not even know the news to protest it. The reason, it did not go this way, is because US as a global super power needs Iran in some form or shape to balance out Isis, Israel and Saudi Arabia to name a few forces which need balancing and the American people have become temporarily tired of wars.
So be happy that without having to fight in order to keep your sovereignty and without having to lose almost all of your infrastructure you have signed a deal which is not unconditional surrender but a fair deal.
I'm sure Americans wont let remove the sanctions. you forgot to mention Libya bowed to U.S pressure and gave up all of its nuclear program. what did they get in return? where is their industry, where is their advancements? if giving up your rights has such an exploding effects then why we can't see even one effect out of zillion ones? what happened to Iraq after they accepted the american spy to search their whole country? what happened to Saddam?
In that case, Iran has not lost anything. It is not as if, Iran has executed all the engineers and scientists of the program. Things will go back to square one. Iran will then have two choices. 1) Continue with nuclear program and choose to become nuclear armed in which case the sanctions are going to be so tight that quality of life will deteriorate to something on the level between that of Cuba and North Korea. Or 2) continue with nuclear program but without weaponization in which case the sanctions will return and some day when US is ready and has the time, it will start bombing Iran for 3 months day and night, dismantling Iran's infrastructure. Then you will give up the nuclear program along with IR, accepting a puppet regime with several areas seceding from Iran by force becoming either independent states or given as colonies to Israel and Saudi Arabia. Of course you will get the news a few months later since you will be in stone age era by that time.
you can't compare us with japan cause we are in an ideology war with U.S, japan wasn't.
False. Japan was too. US was progressing on the liberal capitalist democracy front with its aim for dismantling empires and colonies replaced by a world in which US was the sole global leader. Imperial Japan was striving for a colonial world in which certain powerful nations would be ruling over certain weak others and having the same status as other powers. This was not acceptable to US because Americans believed they are exceptional and only they have the right to lead the world, not Japan, UK, Germany or France. This was an ideological battle. On one side was the conventional colonialism and on the other side was American exceptionalism. At the end, American exceptionalism won.
the amount of advancement is defined by amount of science research and relying to domestic potentials,
I agree with you.
lifting the sanctions doesn't make a difference
It makes a difference that you will have some level of access to world's markets. You can ask
@rahi2357 what percentage of the instruments, implants, fillings, equipment etc in dentistry are produced in Iran and what percentage have to be imported. You also can ask
@raptor22 what percentage of electronic components like microprocessors, diodes, micro-capacitors, transistors, TFT's etc are produced in Iran and what percentage are imported. It makes a difference if you are not a kasebe tahrim but a normal guy on the street.
If now you want to say here, we should produce our own stuff, then you are welcome to do so. And you can do it easier with less pain, when having access to world's markets rather than being cut off from them.
they wont give their technology to us, but rather their product.
They should not either. If you were in their place and the shoe was on the other foot, would you have shared your technology with them? If you were the powerful guy and they were the weak liberal Christians shouting marg bar Iran, would you have shared your tech with them? Let me guess, Nope. But at least you can sell your oil and buy their products in order to cure the toothache while you are "developing" your own technology. There is no need to suffer from toothache while you are working on your cutting age technology.
there was a time that in south korea, children would mock and abandon anyone of their classmates who would use foreign tools, what about our country?
I don't know about this. But I know that South Koreans got every single technology they have from US. Without US help, there would be no South Korea. The only magnificent thing about South Korea was the dedication of their leaders to develop South Korea into an advanced country. Many other countries also were and are friends with US and got US help as well, but they could not become South Korea. The dedication of leaders is essential for a country to develop. A close second would be the public attitude of the nation in question. For example when their leader says, we signed this deal and now lets move and build the economy, the public does not say, "screw you and screw your deal. Marg bar merikh. Marg bar ooranoos". They rather obey their leaders objectively.
the ultimate dream has become to ride a Mercedes Benz. This way nothing will change. producing a zillion things will remain an empty slogan (it's not even our dream).
So build Mercedez Benz for them. No. Wait a minute. Build something EVEN better than Mercedez Benz. Recently, I had visited the showroom of Tesla and have seen it in action. It is even a better car than Mercedez Benz. Its only shortcoming is its charging time of quarter to three quarter charge in couple of hours. It has no emissions, no exhaust pipe, no radiator, no oil change no oil filter no etc.
In the showroom with the body removed you could see how simple the car is. It has only a welded sealed electric motor the size of a watermelon. I swear to God, it was smaller than the assz of many girls out there. Beside this small motor, it had a small air pump very similar to an electric bicycle tire pump which powered its adjustable suspension and a small electrically powered hydraulic unit for power steering and an air-conditioning unit. The rest is software. This is the car:
And it is the best car that has ever been built.
Stop nagging over why people desire to have Mercedez Benz. Instead see the positive side of it, that is the potential for a huge market which needs quality cars. Then you can go on and start building quality cars instead of blaming the people for desiring to have better cars. As you know the car makers in Iran are government owned and operated. So the blame should not be laid on the people. But rather on the government over why they have failed to even build something like half a Tesla.
European returned, but where are their investments? zero foreign investment in industry during 2 years of Rohani's term!
You have the right to ask this question. Again and again. This is your political right to ask what the government has been doing. As others have too.
yet you got the same sh!ts from France, the same sh!ts which people don't want to buy anymore.
You do not like French shi!t. Fine. Build your own Tesla. No body is holding a gun to your head to buy French shi!t. You can buy German shi!t, Japanese shi!t, Korean shi!t or build your own. If you can not build your own, then you have no right to call what France, Germany, Japan or Korea produce shi!t. You only earn this right when you can produce something better than them. Right now you have not earned this right. So be careful about the language you use.
one week after their foreign minister secured their sell in Iran, asked their investors to not rush for Iran.
Yes, they are a sovereign country. They can do that. Just like our foreign minister can advise Iranian minister not to rush to invest in Israeli companies. This is the concept of sovereignty.
right now every single Iranian who was fooled by Rohani's economical lies knows that it was just the centrifuges which stopped spinning, the other wheel hasn't moved at all.
Well, two years is a short time to judge the policies of a president specially if the president was elected when the country was going through a full blown stagflation. We have to wait another two years to see if things improve. That is why there is elections, so that people can decide for themselves. And it is not like the previous administration or the one before that or even the one before the before had made Iran into an economic giant. Iran's economy has been functioning at fraction of its potential since couple of centuries now. To single out Rouhani, is unjust and unfair. Specially when Iran could not sell freely its only relevant export product, the oil and when the oil prices have fallen sharply and are still falling.
about your last sentence, I consider it a joke.
I dont mind that at all. I hope you laughed a good belly. Since you really need to laugh from time to time or at least smile. Too much stiffness is not good for your health.
lol @Daneshmand ) effects that affect Iran in a pleasant way
