Why does our Navy fail so horribly?

[RayKalm]

Admit it or not, our Navy isn't that great. The Turks and Iranians are way ahead of us, and we're left far behind.

We have what, about 11-12 ships? The Turks and Iranians have 260+. The Iranians have 19 submarines, the Turks have about 16, while we only have 5.

At least we're ahead of the Turks and many other countries in terms of destroyers. We have 1, Iran has 4, Turkey has 0.

But, what I'm getting at is, our Navy is extremely bad. Our Navy should work on improving itself. We're good in the air, but in an all out war, we would lose horrifically fast in the sea. If we're able to get more ships and submarines, we already have nuclear subs, we will advance our sea power horrifically fast, rivaling only that of other nuclear countries.


Total Navy Ship Strength by Country

Total Submarine Strength by Country

Total Navy Destroyer Strength by Country

 

[jamal18]

They have more money than Pakistan.

 

[blackops]

the indian arsenal is going to grown in the coming decade

 

[DelhiDareDevil]

They have more money than Pakistan.

And better economy too.

 

[Alpery]

you can add all turkish navy to your own box, dude...
but you sould take care to spend your money carefully...which one has a priority

 

[Pakistanisage]

Admit it or not, our Navy isn't that great. The Turks and Iranians are way ahead of us, and we're left far behind.

We have what, about 11-12 ships? The Turks and Iranians have 260+. The Iranians have 19 submarines, the Turks have about 16, while we only have 5.

At least we're ahead of the Turks and many other countries in terms of destroyers. We have 1, Iran has 4, Turkey has 0.

But, what I'm getting at is, our Navy is extremely bad. Our Navy should work on improving itself. We're good in the air, but in an all out war, we would lose horrifically fast in the sea. If we're able to get more ships and submarines, we already have nuclear subs, we will advance our sea power horrifically fast, rivaling only that of other nuclear countries.


Total Navy Ship Strength by Country

Total Submarine Strength by Country

Total Navy Destroyer Strength by Country

My friend , you are comparing apples and oranges.

The 200 vessels of Iranian Navy are nothing but small boats.

Pakistan Navy vessels are Frigates and Destroyers.

Similarly, the Iranian submarines are MIDGET Submarines produced in Iran that has a crew of 5 to 10 crew members.

Pakistani submarines are large Submarines with a crew of 55 sailors and officers.

Ofcourse Global power only counts total vessels and does not compare the lethality or firepower of the vessels.

Similarly iranian Air Force flies third generation obsolete aircrafts from the 1970's.

I think Iranian defensive capability is vastly overstated.

Turkey is however a much stronger Military force by comparison, but then again their Defence Budget is 30 Billion USD as opposed to 5 Billion of Pakistan Armed forces.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Admit it or not, our Navy isn't that great. The Turks and Iranians are way ahead of us, and we're left far behind.

We have what, about 11-12 ships? The Turks and Iranians have 260+. The Iranians have 19 submarines, the Turks have about 16, while we only have 5.

At least we're ahead of the Turks and many other countries in terms of destroyers. We have 1, Iran has 4, Turkey has 0.

But, what I'm getting at is, our Navy is extremely bad. Our Navy should work on improving itself. We're good in the air, but in an all out war, we would lose horrifically fast in the sea. If we're able to get more ships and submarines, we already have nuclear subs, we will advance our sea power horrifically fast, rivaling only that of other nuclear countries.


Total Navy Ship Strength by Country

Total Submarine Strength by Country

Total Navy Destroyer Strength by Country

compare Turkish and Iranian size of their coast versus ours

our Navy is a purely defensive force......if you look at inductions and procurements in the past decade, i'd say that we are at least on the right track. We have submarines, we have a navy aviation wing, we have the equivalent of the Seals; most crucially we are working on expanding our surface fleet.

of course the PN doesnt receive the same attention as its sister services --- but everything is done based on prioritization and cost-benefit. Doesnt mean that PN has been an ignored service, and most certainly doesnt mean that it ''fails'' on any accounts


with an adversary that is rapidly expanding its own navy, surely more attention will be given to it in the interest of maintaining a power balance in the immediate region....PN has no hegemonic or trans-regional designs at this time.

 

[kas786]

And better economy too.

And substantially less corruption.

 

[DelhiDareDevil]

And substantially less corruption.

And have better access to technology.

 

[A1Kaid]

Iran doesn't have access to better technology compared to Pakistan, but Turkiye does. Turkiye being in NATO and bilateral ties with Israel does help. Pakistan has access to Chinese technology and to some extent US technology.

 

[Nishan_101]

Yeah I agree 100!
I think PN should have a fleet like this:
11 SSKs: 3 Agosta-90Bs+ 9 Qing Class
3 SSBNs: Chinese ones being jointly developed
16 Frigates: Type-54 Models(A,B&C)
11 Corvettes: Chinese ones
7 Auxiliary Tankers and Logistics
11 FACs

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Iran doesn't have access to better technology compared to Pakistan, but Turkiye does. Turkiye being in NATO and bilateral ties with Israel does help. Pakistan has access to Chinese technology and to some extent US technology.

we have a very close relationship with the Turkish Navy.....there's an Officers Exchange Program existing between Pak & Turk Navy. We have procured fast-attack boats from the ally and brotherly country; we have MoUs signed. Turkiye does indeed have access to good tech, being a NATO country. It's been good for their domestic industry.

In fact I would fully back further cooperation with the Turks. They've been very cooperative, and they've always been a reliable ally and genuine friendly country to Pakistan.

 

[Aamir Hussain]

My friend , you are comparing apples and oranges.

The 200 vessels of Iranian Navy are nothing but small boats.

Pakistan Navy vessels are Frigates and Destroyers.

Similarly, the Iranian submarines are MIDGET Submarines produced in Iran that has a crew of 5 to 10 crew members.

Pakistani submarines are large Submarines with a crew of 55 sailors and officers.

Ofcourse Global power only counts total vessels and does not compare the lethality or firepower of the vessels.

Similarly iranian Air Force flies third generation obsolete aircrafts from the 1970's.

I think Iranian defensive capability is vastly overstated.

Turkey is however a much stronger Military force by comparison, but then again their Defence Budget is 30 Billion USD as opposed to 5 Billion of Pakistan Armed forces.

Fully agree with you observations. Sadly most of the members on the forum are into chest thumping and obsessed with numbers.

The fact is that Turkish navy is tasked, alongwith safeguaring its own borders, with patrolling and keeping open inportant waterways from the NATO perspective as well. Therfore, the need for a larger navy because of a larger mission to perform. Furthermore, they realised long time a go that looking towards the west gives them a distinct advantage, the advantage of playing with cutting edge technology. Untill very recently, Turkish Navy was equipped with surface and subsurface platforms from the fifties and sixties. Those were mostly hand me downs from US and other NATO allies. However, the basic platforms have been constantly upgraded and the ship maintenance, refurb, upgrade was all done in Turkey. That formed the nucleus for a later ToT, particpation in many NATO projects, training of personnel and design teams that are now producing the cutting platforms an systems that we see today. They have distinct advantage of being aligned with NATO.

As far as th Iranian Navy is considered. I am afraid it is no where near where we are -- not by design but by the very nature of their deployment and mission parameters. Since they have to operate in rather shallow and enclosed waters where air interdiction is the biggest threat. In such a scenario, operating with small surface vessels, equipped with smaller, shorter range missile systems can form a relative defence coupled with shore based missile systems. Small shallow diving submersibles can pose some threat, but I do not see them as a big headache in the face of a determnied MPA fleet.

When talking about PN and Iranian Navy, it is comparing apple and oranges ineed!

 

[fatman17]

if we have PKR 100 for defence....
PKR 48 is taken by army
PKR 32 is taken by airforce
whats left for the navy PKR 20.... and then you expect this navy to stand up against an adversary which is 5 times larger in every aspect. under the circumstances the navy does a commendable job with the resources it has.

 

[ziaulislam]

i think we should see the modell of Israel regarding our defense expenditure..and invest more in airforce and under water navy fleets i.e SUBs to counter a much larger force