Project Azm: Pakistan to Develop 5th Generation Fighter Plane

[cabatli_53]

But Britain already started their 6th gen fighter without a fifth gen program. I don't think Turkey needs one, they have F-35s I think. Didn't the U.S. block the fighter from being allowed to Turkey though?

Britan and France commenced 6th generation concepts like US but It will take min 15-20 years to induct first operational fighter into their Armed Forces. France-Germany 6th generation fighter is planned to be operational by 2040 and Tempest announced 2035 initially at best base scenarios If everything works perfect. No need to mention export restrictions of such vital technologies for costumers. Allah knows when they will allow costumers to purchase. Besides, There is not huge differences between 5 and 6th generation fighters. Electronic upgade, very advanced link enabling cooperability with other units, multi-processors, more advanced self protection and made-up futuristic fuselage to decrease RCS will be called as 6th generation. I mean the states having 5th generation fighter fuselage design capability will step forward to upper ladder to reveal their next generation fighters.

Franch-Germany

UK-Likely Italy

Turkey 5th generation design

 

[FuturePAF]

Always remember a strong and large economy will buy you influence and allow you to fund your military. Find a way out of this current standoff (expected to last a few months, at least), and then carrying out ALL needed economic and political reforms to get the fastest economic growth is a must if Pakistan is to survive first the economic situation and then the long term military threat.

 

[jupiter2007]

We can ask Turkey to help us develop single engine 5th generation fighter.

 

[Riz]

We can ask Turkey to help us develop single engine 5th generation fighter.

We might be on board with our every brother nations...

 

[jupiter2007]

We might be on board with our every brother nations...

 

[Mughal-Prince]

View attachment 544628

Seems nice and practical

 

[Cookie Monster]

AIP Subs are far more deadly than the nuclear subs because they are much quieter, stealthy and almost undetectable.

The AIP system is quieter than the nuclear-powered engines on American and Russian submarines, which must constantly circulate engine coolant. Nuclear submarines are virtually unlimited in terms of range, and are better used for deep-water operations. But Pakistanl has no need for nuclear-powered subs when quiet diesel subs can do the same job, according to Real Clear Defense.

http://www.riazhaq.com/2015/04/israel-and-pakistan-bolster-second.html

Conventional AIP subs are more stealthy but they are not as long ranged and can't carry as much weight as nuclear subs. The benefit of nuclear subs is it allows a country to have true second strike capability. When(and if) Pak develops ICBM level missile with MIRV(like the US trident missile), nuclear subs would be needed to carry those missiles. With those kinds of nuclear subs carrying such nuclear weapons, they can be hiding away around the world and act as a credible deterrent guaranteeing assured destruction of the enemy in response if Pak is destroyed in a preemptive nuclear strike.

Bcuz nuclear subs are expensive to develop and operate...for now Pak should stick with Babur III/conventional AIP subs combo...but in the long run as the economy improves, Pak should aim for true second strike capability as discussed above.

This true deterrence would leave India or any country with only two options...either live peacefully or get destroyed together(MAD)...and if history is any indication, the threat of MAD scenario has ensured peace.

P.S. in the article posted by u, there's a picture of a Mirage firing Raad...and underneath it says JF17.

 

[Hassan Guy]

View attachment 544628

Seems nice and practical

Wouldn't actually work, the AL-31/41 is way to big, the plane will be as bulky as the F-35.
If it was to be as sleek as an F-22, it would need a smaller engine like an F414 or EJ200.

 

[Mughal-Prince]

Wouldn't actually work, the AL-31/41 is way to big, the plane will be as bulky as the F-35.
If it was to be as sleek as an F-22, it would need a smaller engine like an F414 or EJ200.

AL 41 is way too strong as well bro 45 to 48000 pounds of thrust

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

What none of you realize is that its very, very hard to make good fifth generation fighter jets without robust experience that really only the United States has. Turkey, South Korea, Russia, India, and Chinas "stealth" planes will all be planes with an RCS of .1-1 m2 while the F-22 has an RCS of 0.0001m2 considering how unexperienced most of these countries at actually making good combat aircraft.

India
South korea
Turkey
Russia (if we consider the failure of PAK-FA)

Dont have the capabilities to produce a 5th Gen fighter indigenously.

They dont have any experience designing or building a fighter jet (except Korea, which partnered with LM to develop the FA-50 advanced trainer). Or Perhaps Turkey, which produces/assembles F-16 under license.
But their defence industry is expanding very rapidly, their warship programs and JV in Armour and radar and even ATGMs etc is impressive to say the least.

 

[jupiter2007]

Wouldn't actually work, the AL-31/41 is way to big, the plane will be as bulky as the F-35.
If it was to be as sleek as an F-22, it would need a smaller engine like an F414 or EJ200.

It’s single engine medium weight, not light weight.
General Electric F110-GE-129 or 132
or Pratt & Whitney F100-PW-220/220E

 

[Dr. Strangelove]

Project azm is not just about building a 5th gen fighters its about resource building , tech absorption, R&D in universities and involving the private sector in defense production.
The aim is to build a robust infrastructure for designing and production of future aviation projects.
Our 5th gen fighter will either be based upon J-31 or a new tailless single engine 5th generation fighter in works with CAC

 

[cabatli_53]

A few weeks ago, Officials from TAI and SSB told that TF-X MMU project is very strategic and large enough to stress the limits of our country to produce big numbers when TF-X passed into production so We are negotiating with some Asian countries for partnership.

Contrary to other countries, Turkiye is developing not only missiles, avionics, but also AESA radar, sensors, electronic warfare and optics, including engines (with tech help If possible), since we are struggling to develop a fighter which will be totally export free. Such a large inventory is the line A country can easily fall into difficulty If We don’t find a partner in this program so I believe the Asian country SSB officials mentioned is Pakistan for me. With an initial order guarantee and industrial participation of Pakistani institutes from Tf-X design to development and prototype production phases will certainly take ours breath away to reveal first strealth fighter designed/developed by Muslims’ collaborations. Pakistani likely partnership to MMU program will open the gate of many other export markets that Turkey can not reach cause of politic and geographical reasons. A fighter of two state will improve the operational effectiveness and joint training activities. To attract more attention for likely partners, TAI will introduce 1/1 mock-up of TF-X in IDEF19. If Turkey and Pakistan sign a MoU as an intention letter to join into TF-X program, I will not surprise too much.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Project Azm Designs leaked

 

[princefaisal]

A few weeks ago, Officials from TAI and SSB told that TF-X MMU project is very strategic and large enough to stress the limits of our country to produce big numbers when TF-X passed into production so We are negotiating with some Asian countries for partnership.

Contrary to other countries, Turkiye is developing not only missiles, avionics, but also AESA radar, sensors, electronic warfare and optics, including engines (with tech help If possible), since we are struggling to develop a fighter which will be totally export free. Such a large inventory is the line A country can easily fall into difficulty If We don’t find a partner in this program so I believe the Asian country SSB officials mentioned is Pakistan for me. With an initial order guarantee and industrial participation of Pakistani institutes from Tf-X design to development and prototype production phases will certainly take ours breath away to reveal first strealth fighter designed/developed by Muslims’ collaborations. Pakistani likely partnership to MMU program will open the gate of many other export markets that Turkey can not reach cause of politic and geographical reasons. A fighter of two state will improve the operational effectiveness and joint training activities. To attract more attention for likely partners, TAI will introduce 1/1 mock-up of TF-X in IDEF19. If Turkey and Pakistan sign a MoU as an intention letter to join into TF-X program, I will not surprise too much.

Beside from Pakistan, Qatar and Azerbaijan should also join this program.