Pakistan recieved its second Saab Erieye AWAC

[Peregrine]

Hi
One question can AWACS be date linked to Helicopters like cobra or the any other advanced attack helicopters.

 

[Mani2020]

i think its a good start for pakistan. they got the best deal out of the money in their pocket.

infect its one of the biggest deal by pakistan of over a billion $ once they get 6 of these they will be formidable team.

Sir, we are not getting 6 rather 8 of them 4 Swedish and 4 Chinese one
making them to a total of 8 for air force plus the navy is getting its separate AWACS form US based on P-3C orion aircraft

Firstly we ordered 7 AWACS from Sweden later the order was reduced to 5 (including 4 AWACS and 1 for training purpose ) because the navy opted to go for E-2C hawk-eye on P-3C orion as they were already operating that aircraft from years and have expertise

 

[TaimiKhan]

Can any one tell me if the Chinese are giving the KJ-200 or the KJ 2000? And will Erieye be datalinked to the Chinese AWACS/AEW&C

Its going to be a Y-8 platform, with a dome shaped version of their AESA radar, like the one being used on KJ-2000 platform, its not gonna be balance beam version. But it will not be as sophisticated as the Chinese one, meaning due to Y-8 being a small platform, the specifications would be less compared to the ratadome version seen on the KJ-2000.

datalink may not be possible - basically the airforce will operate 2 systems ASAIK. KJ-2000 for the JF-17s and the Erieye for the western a/c. the data/information from both systems will be down-linked to a ground control center.

this query has been covered elsewhere on the forum in detail by the experts.

Sir, JF-17 has western communication system, its data link is western and can communicate with western platforms also. Hope nabil has more to add. But so far the communication antennas are of western origin, same antennas can be seen on Turkish upgraded F-5s, which are said to be having data link facility too.

Plus, integrating a western communication system, data link equipment with Chinese platform would not be much of a problem, as Chinese can make equipment on western MIL standard architecture which can accommodate western equipment if source codes are available.

Hope a more knowledgeable member can elaborate further.


Do check the antennas on both these aircraft, below the nose and above the spine.

Turkish upgraded F-5s

Our own JF-17

 

[TaimiKhan]

Hi
One question can AWACS be date linked to Helicopters like cobra or the any other advanced attack helicopters.

In cobras, Simple voice communication can be done, but data transfer can't be, for that upgrades would be needed, a lot of them.

But newer platform i believe do have data linking facility and can have data transfer facility.

 

[MZUBAIR]

It would be an edge, if AWAC can be offensive from distance like BVR capabilities

 

[mrwarrior006]

congrats pakistan

 

[AVIAN]

Excellent stuff, now PAF will really going to improve its air survellience capabilities to a great extent.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

What are the counter measures SAAB Erieye has against AWAC killler missiles? Anyone with info on it will be appreciated.

The Saab 2000's outer wing has also been strengthened to accommodate EW and signals intelligence sensors, and for the possible carriage of a towed radar decoy.

This should give some idea of how towed radar decoy works.

TOWED DECOYS PROMISE NEW EW CAPABILITIES
by Karl Schwarz

It is increasingly difficult to protect military fighter and transport aircraft against radar-guided air-to-air and surface-to-air missiles. Deception transmitters on board the aircraft are at their limits, especially when deceiving modern monopulse radars. But the missiles wouldn't have to be misguided by much. A distance of maybe 100 meters would already be sufficient to render the missile's proximity fuse harmless and to even survive an explosion of the warhead.

This effect is supposed to be achieved with small decoys that are towed on a cable behind the aircraft if needed. Their transmissions present a much more attractive target to approaching missiles. The idea, which looks simple at first glance, has been pursued since the eighties. However, only most recently does a broad application of such systems look probable.

As usual, the work is most advanced in the USA. Raytheon E-Systems has begun with the production of the ALE-50 system. Its development began in 1987 as the so called "Advanced Airborne Expandable Decoy" under a contract with the US Naval Air Systems Command. Meanwhile, the US Air Force has become the main customer for the system: 437 Lockheed Martin F-16 and 95 Boeing (Rockwell) B-1B are scheduled to be equipped with ALE-50, requiring at least 17306 of the decoys, costing $493 million.

When used on the F-16, the aircraft carries two dispensers with two decoys each on under-wing pylons. The B-1B carries two magazines with four decoys each on the side of the aft fuselage. This large aircraft would tow two decoys at the same time in order to generate enough deception power.

As a first-generation equipment, the ALE-50 only has one operating mode: to reflect and strengthen the hostile radar's signals, such hiding the real aircraft's radar return. As a result, the missile is guided at the decoy which is towed at a safe distance.

Newer generation decoys are already much more intelligent. They use threat libraries which allow for the identification of the radar signals received by the aircraft's radar warning receivers. A so called "Technique Generator" then generates specific deception signals, giving the hostile radar wrong information about the aircraft's real distance or bearing. The signals are transmitted from the aircraft to the towed decoy via glass-fibre cable.

ALE-55The ALE-55, which is currently under development at Sanders, is such a system. It's part of the US Navy's Integrated Defensive Electronic Countermeasures System (IDECM) and is earmarked for use with the Boeing F-18E/F Super Hornet. First flight tests are scheduled for the end of 1998.

Since the ALE-55 decoy fits in the same dispenser as the ALE-50, the system can later be retrofitted. This is considered for the B-1B. Further applications that are being evaluated are the F-15E and also the U-2, for which decoys with larger fins for hight-altitude operations are under development. The protection of drones with towed decoys is under consideration as well.

While Sanders was successful in the USA with the ALE-55, Raytheon E-Systems has also developed a second-generation decoy, which was selected by British Aerospace in June of 1997 for the Nimrod 2000 maritime patrol aircraft. According to the manufacturer, the system has a much higher output due to its Northrop Grumman micro-wave modules.

In large aircraft, such as the Nimrod, a winch can be installed, allowing the retraction of the decoy before landing. Otherwise, the cable is cut, losing at least $10000 for each decoy deployment.

The selection of the Raytheon decoy for the Nimrod 2000 is surprising since with GEC-Marconi there is a company in Great Britain that belongs to the pioneers in towed decoy development. Already during the Gulf War was equipment from the Ariel family used with the Nimrod. Meanwhile, the Royal Air Force has begun to fit its Panavia Tornado F.3s with the decoys.

The Tornado's Ariel system has a technique generator that works in the H to J-Band. The decoy itself is carried in a Sky Shadow ECM pod. The system can be deployed between 270 km/h and Mach 1.2. After dropping the decoy, it can be retrieved via parachute.

GEC-Marconi is also working on towed decoys for the Eurofighter. Two units are integrated into the EF2000 right wingtip mounted pod. First flight tests in the subsonic speed region were already carried out with prototype DA2. For applications with French aircraft, GEC-Marconi has already signed a contract with Dassault Electronique.

Along with GEC-Marconi, Dasa is another European company that is working in this field. Following years of theoretical studies and simulations, a test model of the Towed Active Decoy was first flight tested on a Learjet in 1995. A smaller and aerodynamically optimized version was tested with a Phantom over the Mojave desert in the USA in 1997. According to the manufacturer, the tests showed "...that the deployment from the aircraft and the characteristics during the tow maneuver fulfilled the expectations even in critical flight attitudes."

The Dasa system has meanwhile accomplished flight tests on a Tornado. At the beginning of October, the system was operationally used for the first time during an ECM exercise over the Nellis test range in Nevada. According to Dasa, the decoy "proved its efficiency as self-defence system in a realistic threat scenario during several flights."

As a result of the development work, Dasa has now presented suggestions to integrate the towed decoy in various aircraft, such as Tornado, Eurofighter, and Transall.

However, the German air force has currently no concrete procurement plans. Possibly, a towed component might supplement the Tornado's TSPJ jamming transmitter during the coming decade. A towed decoy is also projected for use with the Eurofighter. Nevertheless, Dasa will have to continue the work on its own and look for exports until the German defence ministry makes funds available for the procurement of the systems.

Last but not least, CelsiusTech has begun with the development of a towed decoy under contract from the Swedish air force. Reportedly, this will also be an intelligent system which would be integrated into the BOP and BOZ pods used with the Saab Viggen and the JAS 39 Gripen.

All these activities show that towed decoys will supplement the ECM capability of many existing and new fighters. Raytheon sees a worldwide market potential of two to four billion US dollars over the next ten years.

 

[Dr.Evil]

Its a pretty quick delivery of second Saab Eriye system.

good for pak.

 

[Mani2020]

Its a pretty quick delivery of second Saab Eriye system.

good for pak.

Yes, and more goody is that the induction of all the 4 aircrafts will be completed this year

 

[Tomahawk]

Yes, and more goody is that the induction of all the 4 aircrafts will be completed this year

Moreover, first Chinese AWACS will arrive in 2011 and remaining three will be delivered in 2012.
So by 2012, PAF will have a fleet of 8 AWACS/AEW&C; which is just great and it is a very good fleet size; a big leap for PAF in the area Airborne Early Warning and Control.

 

[air marshal]

Second PAF SAAB-2000 AEW&C aircraft arrives from Sweden

ISLAMABAD, Apr 24 (APP): The second Saab-2000 AEW&C (Airborne Early Warning and Control System) aircraft arrived from Sweden at an operational base of the Pakistan Air Force (PAF) Saturday evening. The aircraft would shortly be inducted into the Pakistan Air Force.

 

[satishkumarcsc]

datalink may not be possible - basically the airforce will operate 2 systems ASAIK. KJ-2000 for the JF-17s and the Erieye for the western a/c. the data/information from both systems will be down-linked to a ground control center.

this query has been covered elsewhere on the forum in detail by the experts.

Sir,
What will happen if PAF is flying a mixed strike package with F 16 for strike along with JF 17 with air cover wont it cause any problems inbetween fighter communication and AWE&C or every fighter is going to be linked only to the ground control?

 

[gowthamraj]

 

[Imran Khan]

best news of week congs PAF go ahead