India's strategic cooperation with Southeast Asia

[Brotherhood]

I am afraid its a little too early for India to focus on strategic cooperation with South east Asia while still struggling with maintaining a good cooperation with your South Asia neighbors. Is it more reasonable to a "one step at a time" approach?
When you are losing ground to your biggest competitor China in your neighborhood, what made Indians think they can success in South east Asia?

The strategic vision and sense of purpose being shown by China in the sub-continent is in stark contrast to the manner in which India is drifting along, in spite of being seen as the region’s custodian. While India has been burning diplomatic bridges with its neighbours with its ‘big brother’ attitude, China has been building them.

In 2002, India and China did about the same amount of trade (exports and imports) with their four big South Asian neighbours, namely Pakistan, Bangladesh, Nepal and Sri Lanka. In 2007, China was doing 36% more than India (See table: China Versus India).

business.outlookindia.com | Fight For The Neighbourhood

 

[somya]

I think you are trying to cultivate something that is not there. Buddhism came as a religion and we made it our own to fit our own culture(besides you guys aren't Buddhists anymore).

Ask any southeast asian whether Buddhism or Confucianism had a bigger influence and you'll get your answer. (there's a reason why the imperial palace in Hui Vietnam was modeled after the Forbidden City in Beijing)

we respect Bhudism and respect its values... proof is T-3 teminal at Indira gandhi terminal there are Bhudist symbols in it. You can find pictures of Mahatma Budha in indian homes and offices and indian school books.
You dnt have to be Bhudist to follow Bhuddism. Any body who follow Bhudha's philosophy is Bhuddist.

 

[Coltsfan]

heck guys....... everyone listens when $ talks.......

India should try to expand its economy in every direction, southeast, northwest whatever, screw the sentimental baggage.

If it makes sense, do business with Pakistan, even B'desh, we should make the most of opportunity.

Wars can't be fought, and armies can't be build by bankrupt nations.

 

[pmukherjee]

I think you are trying to cultivate something that is not there. Buddhism came as a religion and we made it our own to fit our own culture(besides you guys aren't Buddhists anymore).

Ask any southeast asian whether Buddhism or Confucianism had a bigger influence and you'll get your answer. (there's a reason why the imperial palace in Hui Vietnam was modeled after the Forbidden City in Beijing)

Sorry but I do not agree with you. there exist historic ties between India and south east Asia. these were basically trade and cultural ties. the ties with Indonesia are as old as the first century AD. numerous Hindu temples have been found in Java, Sumatra, Bali etc. Buddhism spread to Tibet, China and south east Asia from India. India traders practicing Buddhism had a big role in its spread. both Hinayana and Mahayana Buddhism spread from India. Mahayana Buddhism became the dominant form of Buddhism being practiced in Tibet and China. In the third century BC, king Ashoka's personal endorsement was a major factor in the spread of Buddhism to Shrilanka and SE Asia.

 

[devd]

Instead of makin it sticky why dont u indians go to you own brat rakshit forum or crappy indian forums?

And as far as i know vietnam always was under chinese influence rather then some indian traders lOl

Search about Yellow sea and yellow chinese as the vietnamese were and are called.

I respect pak troll technology.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

I respect pak troll technology.

Thts reserved to arse whoop indian trolls like ehm ehm.

 

[CardSharp]

heck guys....... everyone listens when $ talks.......

India should try to expand its economy in every direction, southeast, northwest whatever, screw the sentimental baggage.

If it makes sense, do business with Pakistan, even B'desh, we should make the most of opportunity.

Wars can't be fought, and armies can't be build by bankrupt nations.

Precisely, why try to awkwardly force connections that may not there instead of just doing business where business can be had. If there's natural advantage, then a relationship will naturally flourish. (Do China and Africa have a cultural connection?)

Sorry but I do not agree with you. there exist historic ties between India and south east Asia. these were basically trade and cultural ties. the ties with Indonesia are as old as the first century AD. numerous Hindu temples have been found in Java, Sumatra, Bali etc. Buddhism spread to Tibet, China and south east Asia from India. India traders practicing Buddhism had a big role in its spread. both Hinayana and Mahayana Buddhism spread from India. Mahayana Buddhism became the dominant form of Buddhism being practiced in Tibet and China. In the third century BC, king Ashoka's personal endorsement was a major factor in the spread of Buddhism to Shrilanka and SE Asia.

Indonesia is mostly Muslim but anyways. I think tie is really tenuous. While Buddhists will of course acknowledge the origins of Buddhism in India, this doesn't necessarily translate into any kind of special cultural affinity. (Do southern baptists feel any cultural affinity with the those living in the holy land now? how about Russian orthodox?)

Besides even cultural affinity doesn't guarantee strategic alliance, just look at Japan and China...

Unless one or more Southeast asian nations come courting India, I'd say this theory is bunk.

 

[Bang Galore]

And as far as i know vietnam always was under chinese influence rather then some indian traders lOl

Search about Yellow sea and yellow chinese as the vietnamese were and are called.

Ask the Vietnamese what they think of that.

Precisely, why try to awkwardly force connections that may not there instead of just doing business where business can be had. If there's natural advantage, then a relationship will naturally flourish. (Do China and Africa have a cultural connection?)




Indonesia is mostly Muslim but anyways. I think tie is really tenuous. While Buddhists will of course acknowledge the origins of Buddhism in India, this doesn't necessarily translate into any kind of special cultural affinity. (Do southern baptists feel any cultural affinity with the those living in the holy land now? how about Russian orthodox?)

Besides even cultural affinity doesn't guarantee strategic alliance, just look at Japan and China...

Unless one or more Southeast asian nations come courting India, I'd say this theory is bunk.

I think the thread starter is interested in discussing strategic cooperation, not just business ties. India does have some contacts on that score.

As for affinity. some south east Asians show substantial interest & affinity towards India precisely because of the Buddhist connection & other historical contacts. Whether that translates to anything more than curiosity is something that can be debated on.

BTW, I like how you brought up the China- Africa connection. Very unsentimental & to the point. I wish more Indians could learn from that instead of gushing about historical connections & the like.

 

[somebozo]

well most of the south east asia currently falls under chinese influence but I can think in future increasingly emerging Indian economy trying to expand into new markets. However a large sphere of millitary influence will remain in the hands of Chinese.

 

[notsuperstitious]

Fact - As India's (growing) size makes its smaller neighbors seek a counter balance, China's (growing) size makes its smaller neighbors seek a counter balance.

I've lived in Singapore for many years and I know what policy the govt follows, there is tremendous scope for india to push for more ties in South East as well as far east. There is no harm in discussing it and those with allergic reactions can buzz off.

 

[KS]

Instead of makin it sticky why dont u indians go to you own brat rakshit forum or crappy indian forums?

And as far as i know vietnam always was under chinese influence rather then some indian traders lOl

Search about Yellow sea and yellow chinese as the vietnamese were and are called.

Why do u always have to appear with some crappy analysis (if at all it is called "analysis") in matters that u have knowledge in the fractions.

please man..spare this thread.

 

[pmukherjee]

Precisely, why try to awkwardly force connections that may not there instead of just doing business where business can be had. If there's natural advantage, then a relationship will naturally flourish. (Do China and Africa have a cultural connection?)




Indonesia is mostly Muslim but anyways. I think tie is really tenuous. While Buddhists will of course acknowledge the origins of Buddhism in India, this doesn't necessarily translate into any kind of special cultural affinity. (Do southern baptists feel any cultural affinity with the those living in the holy land now? how about Russian orthodox?)

Besides even cultural affinity doesn't guarantee strategic alliance, just look at Japan and China...

Unless one or more Southeast asian nations come courting India, I'd say this theory is bunk.

What it implies buddy is that there exists enough links to start talking, to share ideas, to increase trade and cultural exchanges. we already have a huge trade going with China. increase in trade with other SE Asian nations will not harm anyone. strategic relations are not built overnight, that happens when there is mutual trust and a convergence of interests. the beginning has been made some time ago, certain positive results have already started emerging. much work yet remains to be done but that is the way to go.

 

[ChinaChina]

what make u think u r that influencial in south east asia? no body talk or care about india, they think india is a backward , poor and always having a wet dream to become the superpower in the region that s all.

 

[KS]

what make u think u r that influencial in south east asia? no body talk or care about india, they think india is a backward , poor and always having a wet dream to become the superpower in the region that s all.

Is that wat they thought wen they arse whooped ur country in the Sino-Vietnam war..?

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

I think we Indian members need to let go of the terms religion & culture when considering South-east Asia.

In fact,concept of religion and culture in international ties are obsolete unless it is an Islamic nation that is aim of better relations.

For starters lets consider the fact that India's connection and cultural ties with South-east Asia has only been in traditional history not in modern history.

The turbulent events of modern history (from WW2 time )that have sculptured the mentality of South-east Asians are.

Colonial period impact

Japanese war atrocities

Vietnam war

Khmer rouge

And maybe to a some extent events that happened in Indonesia.

In all those mentioned above India has not played an overt role,enough to be noticed and remembered.

So we Indians are kinda invisible to them.

From the above list one can deduce the fact that the prime things that matter to SE Asians are nationalism(judging the trauma they have been through) & capitalism(in other words development after seeing China & Japan progress). not culture and religion.

Another fact that can be deduced is that their traditional history has been overshadowed by modern history.

Today,Any Laotian,Vietnamese or Pinoy may have hatred for China and Japan,But at the same time have silent admiration for the way China & Japan have progressed,in fact they wish to see that their cities look like Shanghai or Tokyo someday.

So when we Indians approach SE Asia for better ties we must emphasize on defence,technology,education etc rather than culture,if we wish have a good diplomatic audience and healthy diplomatic attention.

My above opinion is based on Forums of Thai,Vietnamese,Pinoy etc.

On the side note


I"d really like India and Vietnam to go for joint ventures in the field of Robotics .The Vietnamese have made good progress in that field.

Below are images of Vietnamese Androids

TOPIO 3.0 at Tokyo International Robot Exhibition (IREX) 2009


TOPIO 2.0 was playing table tennis at Nuremberg International Toy Fair 2009

After all this is the Asian-Century