C for CPEC, Callousness and Controversy

[Spectre]

Hurt???!!!! Bring facts, not gossip. Ever worked with a team to take a company public? I have!!!!! Ever worked at the Wall Street? I have!!!! In fact as I type, on various monitors in front of me, are showing me market actions and other details from Asia, to Europe to the US!! So these investments and larger business strategy is my domain. In the next couple of years, I'll be TEACHING business strategy to the future generations of business pioneers at some top business school!! Find someone to reason with me factually and then I can respond to lower quality emotional posts of yours!!

The post I wrote had perfect content in there. I listed Pakistani EFT's which you can check yourself on google, against top Western companies. I listed their last trade value vs. Google and Apples of the world as of yesterday. And you didn't see these ultimate FACTS, you just wanted to cry instead!!!!

And I can tell how "experienced" you are. If all you think about the stocks as a "broker" trying to make a buck or two!! This is capital money coming to a business based on their performance, profit to share holders (called Share Holder's Equity). And when you do an IPO, your shares are sold, the company gets investments and the reason others want to put their hard earned money under a business in terms of stock, is they expect the business to use the stock money and grow and be MORE profitable. In turn, increasing stock values and distributions per stock in the future!! Google as an example was way below $ 100 not too many years ago. Its not over $ 700 per stock!!

Below is my complete post which you haven't quoted. Please read it again and you would understand where you went wrong.

From the content of your posts I doubt you have any real world financial experience let alone qualifications for teaching financial investments in ivy league colleges.

I have clearly stated that IPO is an exception but it happens only once in company's lifetime. 99.99% of all activity in stock market brings no money to the company.

The other point is that you cannot compare two stocks just based on prices they are trading, you simply cannot. It is like comparing apples to oranges.

I stock having a market price of 100 USD can be more valuable than stock having market price of 1000 USD depending on number of shares outstanding. There are various factors which come into play like share splits etc If you cannot understand this basic financial fact than I simply urge you to enrol yourself in community college to understand this and stop making a mockery out of yourself.

@@Icarus it is indeed sad to see that you have rated the quoted positively considering this post doesn't even have even an iota of financial logic.

FYI investment in stock markets or HCL in this example are secondary investment. The company in these cases doesn't get a single pence out of this "investment" the gain/losses are shared by the traders who are often themselves foreign institutions . The money which comes in is easy money with no lock in period like in FDI.

All traders are looking to make a quick buck and capitalize on the low base. As soon as they deem that the stocks are over-valued they will bail out. Real investors in stock market who bring in certain stability are domestic retail investors.

We have all seen that BSE/NSE or for that matter Shanghai Stock Markets suffer from flight to quality in turbulent times. In such cases the losses are often born by small local investors. Companies as I have earlier stated remain divorced too an extent from both the secondary investments which constitute majority of stock market activity and pull outs.

The thing which could have been beneficial is not quick and easy money in stock exchanges but funding of start-ups, Foreign Direct Investment and greenfield investment. Thus Chinese investment is Gold in this regard and I would consider the 46 Billion out of 180 Billion as Kosher.

The only real investment happens in STOCK MARKET are in primary securities like IPO's or follow on offers which are once in a blue moon event for any company.

Anyway if you remember from our earlier conversations I have nothing against Pakistan - infact I whole heartedly support it's economic development and prosperity as that would give Pakistan a substantial stake in peace process b/w our countries. I just cant stand the blatant ignorance and smug arrogance on display. It is better to be realistic and plan for the future based on ground realities than indulging in wool-gathering.

@@Syed.Ali.Haider@@rainman@@Nihonjin1051 your views on the veracity of my post as you guys have experience in financial markets as I assume.

Source: C for CPEC, Callousness and Controversy | Page 5

 

[ghilzai]

You must be really dumb to say something like that.. And I mean really retarded... Do I need to list military chiefs and presidents like Ayub,Yahya,Nur Khan,Hamid Gul,Asad Durrani,Waheed Kakar,Abbas Khattak,Asghar Khan,Hakeemullah Khan Durani,Jamal A Khan,Farooq Feroze Khan.. etc etc..(to name a few mil chiefs) Who lead the military as "unequal" inferior military chiefs & 3 star generals!


Guess who was called Reds Shirts .. And which party is a heir to KK? .. You are either very foolish or just another sad little troll.

@farhan_9909 @Khan_patriot. @Pukhtoon. @TaimiKhan. @ghilzai. @T-Faz. @Orakzai. When are you guys succeeding from evil Pakistan!



@Irfan Baloch. Is this guy just dumb or a troll ?

Pakistan is our country, our heart, soul and our religion, we are proud and patriotic Pakistanis, even if everyone else gives up on the idea of Pakistan we will always will be Pakistan and Pakistanis.

We might have difference of an opinion with the state but we loyal sons of the soil, never have I been discriminated by anyone based on my ethnicity.

And me am a tribal and feel like that and imagine how an ordinary pukhtoon feels.

 

[Lavrentiy]

One has to be youthiya to believe that the Chinese would invest in these God forsaken areas of KPK and Baluchistan.

In addition, if CPEC gets going, Nawaz will win the 2018 elections with 200% surety. Imran Khan knows this and he has to counter it.

 

[Viper0011.]

Below is my complete post which you haven't quoted. Please read it again and you would understand where you went wrong.

From the content of your posts I doubt you have any real world financial experience let alone qualifications for teaching financial investments in ivy league colleges.

Like I said, I gave you my credentials. Establish yours. I am not here to entertain gossip on serious matters that require serious expertise and a ton of other related expertise to become an expert in this industry. There are plenty of fan boys like you on here with a different educational background. Just by investing a thousand or a million in the stock market, you don't become a broker or a strategist!! Similarly, just by knowing you can buy Aspirin from the Pharmacy, you don't become a doctor. Enough said.

My suggestion to you and others (respectfully), this entire economy and CPEC thing, is WAY over you guys head. And its not a bad thing, just that you guys specialize in other things. So in which case, instead of "gossip" or spreading rumors. How about you sit, watch and enjoy the show and see Pakistan growing?? I like that idea. I can focus on business that way, instead of countering crap-shoot posts on here.

In addition, if CPEC gets going, Nawaz will win the 2018 elections with 200% surety. Imran Khan knows this and he has to counter it.

He is countering it, but on what price? The price of an entire nation's GROWTH and OPPORTUNITY? That, to me should be treason straight up. Pakistan FINALLY is becoming peaceful, and growing and isn't considered a failed state.

In fact, everyone wants a piece of the growing pie (including INDIA!!!!). So anyone who stands between Pakistan and her nation's economic growth and prosperity should be charged with treason. Clean up the mess once for all. Bring positive leaders who actually WORK and bring investments and growth. Not bullshiit to an already weak and confused nation!!

 

[Spectre]

Like I said, I gave you my credentials. Establish yours. I am not here to entertain gossip on serious matters that require serious expertise and a ton of other related expertise to become an expert in this industry. There are plenty of fan boys like you on here with a different educational background. Just by investing a thousand or a million in the stock market, you don't become a broker or a strategist!! Similarly, just by knowing you can buy Aspirin from the Pharmacy, you don't become a doctor. Enough said.
My suggestion to you and others (respectfully), this entire economy and CPEC thing, is WAY over you guys head. And its not a bad thing, just that you guys specialize in other things. So in which case, instead of "gossip" or spreading rumors. How about you sit, watch and enjoy the show and see Pakistan growing?? I like that idea. I can focus on business that way, instead of countering crap-shoot posts on here.

So running away from the argument are we? you dont have any more BS to post to contradict my arguments?

You have not provided any proof of your credential - as i said the level of ignorance you have displayed makes it ample clear that your nothing but a LIAR. I have not offered my credentials as I feel my arguments speak for themselves without any need for padding in form of fictitious credentials.

Henceforth try not to speak out of your depth.

Good Day sir.

 

[mr.robot]

What's a "capital influx" when you buy stocks....what is it called? Investing into Securities!!!! "INVESTING" is the key word. So Capital Inflows are really "investments" have always been. Your jealousy doesn't change the fact

Also, when HCL or other got billions of investments (or "capital influx" as you called it) what do they do with that moeny? Invest into OTHER projects to grow their businesses and then grow the stocks so the people providing "capital influx" can gain profit on the stock. So the $ 120 billion through the stock marekt will ALSO go into MORE projects which will grow Pakistani businesses.

Lack of common sense mixed with jealousy much???? Yea, it'll burn for a LONG time!! Sorry.

Allow me to show you how Pakistan's stock market related funds are doing, and I am listing what was available BEFORE the actual start market started this week. From this point on, things will ONLY go higher and better (above Google, Amazon and others due to top returns over the past three years, since the current government took the office). The lowest stock price is $ 1124.21 per stock and highest is like $ 2901.00.

Symbol Name Last Trade Type Industry/Category Exchange
^DJSAFPKT Dow Jones SAFE Pakistan Total R $ 2,895.17 Last Trade Index DJI

^DJSAFPK Dow Jones SAFE Pakistan Index $ 1,716.28 Last Trade Index DJI

^DWPKDT Dow Jones Pakistan Total Stock $ 1,839.98 Last Trade Index DJI

^DJSFPKTR Dow Jones SAFE Pakistan Titans $ 2,901.11 Last Trade Index DJI

^DWPKD Dow Jones Pakistan Total Stock $ 1,124.21 Last Trade Index DJI

^DJSFPKT Dow Jones SAFE Pakistan Titans $ 1,602.65 Last Trade Index DJI

WIPAK.L FTSE Pakistan Index $ 2,133.98 Last Trade Index LSE

^DWPK Dow Jones Pakistan Total Stock $ 1,964.41 Last Trade Index DJI

^DWPKT Dow Jones Pakistan Total Stock $ 3,215.11 Last Trade Index DJI

@Icarus @Syed.Ali.Haider @TaimiKhan @saiyan0321 @Ammara Chaudhry @mr42O @Leader @Jaanbaz @Jango : Guys - check out the above Pakistani securities and their last trade value as of yesterday. If this isn't performance, I don't know what is. Google is trading at $705, Amazon is at $ 584, GE is at $ 28.02, Lockheed Martin is at 214.99, Apple is at 97.39 and ALL the above from Pakistan are WAY over all these top US stocks!!!!! I hope this explains to you how the entire globe is looking at Pakistani market that they are willing to pay 3 times the cost of Google and Apple to hold Pakistani EFT's due to extreme profits Pakistani market has been providing!!And these were the same people who declared Pakistan bankrupt in 2012!!

I think this ends the debate IMO as to the future of Pakistan from an investments and CPEC's related growth. The journey is about to take Pakistan right below Australia in the next 10+ years. Just watch

Dear stock analysis, business expert and future professor, first learn it is ETF not EFT. If you still have the courage to comapre Pakistan's ETFs with likes of Google and Apple , kindly do share trading volume of these ETFs as you must be sitting in front of multiple monitors observing stocks from US to Asia

 

[Viper0011.]

So running away from the argument are we? you dont have any more BS to post to contradict my arguments?

You have not provided any proof of your credential - as i said the level of ignorance you have displayed makes it ample clear that your nothing but a LIAR. I have not offered my credentials as I feel my arguments speak for themselves without any need for padding in form of fictitious credentials.

Henceforth try not to speak out of your depth.

Good Day sir.

No one's running away. I asked you two things and you ignored them because the answer is a no:

1) Ever worked with a team to take a company public? I told you I have!!
2) Ever worked at Wall Street and in Corporate Strategy and Economic Development? I do this for a living!!

3) If you like my references, and say there was a $ 50,000 bet on here. I would LOVE to make you call Mr. De'souza. (Francisco De'spuza, CEO of Cognizant and a friend). He would LOVE to tell you who developed their corporate strategy for the US based operations . More needed? How does Accenture and Dell sound to you

So now back to the topic, I am not running away. I just don't want to waste time with people that look at economy and stocks to make a few bucks on the side and have no real credentials. Everyone can read books and write formulas (we've had many of these discussions), but the ones in the field are the ones making it happen!!

 

[Spectre]

@Icarus Kindly see @viper0011 posting pattern in the last 3 or 4 posts. He is selectively quoting me - he is conveniently omitting all the areas where I have proved him to be wrong and just quoting excerpts and then tangentially posting irrelevant stuff

It is extremely frustrating to indulge in constructive debate with this Chap as all he seems to be an expert is in claiming outlandish qualifications.

 

[Viper0011.]

Dear stock analysis, business expert and future professor, first learn it is ETF not EFT. If you still have the courage to comapre Pakistan's ETFs with likes of Google and Apple , kindly do share trading volume of these ETFs as you must be sitting in front of multiple monitors observing stocks from US to Asia

Hey man, what a catch. Ever wrote on an IPAD touch screen, watching 4 monitors and being in a conference call with having thick fingers? Yea, typos do happen. Sorry, we are all humans. But, on the other side, you never responded to anything factually, I can cry and write personal stuff too. But what good is it for? Just shows one's tiny little mental capacity like your post represents yours!!

@Icarus Kindly see @viper0011 posting pattern in the last 3 or 4 posts. He is selectively quoting me - he is conveniently omitting all the areas where I have proved him to be wrong and just quoting excerpts and then tangentially posting irrelevant stuff

It is extremely frustrating to indulge in constructive debate with this Chap as all he seems to be an expert in claiming outlandish qualifications.

Oh poor cup cake!!!!! You are so hurt!!!!! Well, don't cry. Eat a pie. If you don't like the content or the person.....don't indulge in a conversation with me.

By the way, in the last message, you were going to show me credentials. Here, you are calling Mods for help to save your hurt emotions....where are the manly, man, proud credentials I was waiting on??

 

[Spectre]

No one's running away. I asked you two things and you ignored them because the answer is a no:

1) Ever worked with a team to take a company public? I told you I have!!
2) Ever worked at Wall Street and in Corporate Strategy and Economic Development? I do this for a living!!

3) If you like my references, and say there was a $ 50,000 bet on here. I would LOVE to make you call Mr. De'souza. (Francisco De'spuza, CEO of Cognizant and a friend). He would LOVE to tell you who developed their corporate strategy for the US based operations . More needed? How does Accenture and Dell sound to you

So now back to the topic, I am not running away. I just don't want to waste time with people that look at economy and stocks to make a few bucks on the side and have no real credentials. Everyone can read books and write formulas (we've had many of these discussions), but the ones in the field are the ones making it happen!!

I have clearly stated that I don't like to make give out information where it is not relevant but be assured I am not speaking out of ignorance or half understood market phenomenons. Prove my below arguments to be wrong where I have contradicted you and dont obfuscate the issue

1. You cannot compare stocks and securities based just on trading price.
2. Most of the activities in stock market don't bring money to the company exception being IPO which happens once in company's lifetime
3. Most capital inflow in stock market is looking to make a quick buck not for long term investment.
4. Infant stock markets like Pakistan Stock Exchange are extremely unstable and are not correlated to economy of Pakistan.

 

[mr.robot]

Hey man, what a catch. Every wrote on an IPAD watching 4 monitors and being in a conference call? Yea, typos do happen. Sorry, we are all humans. But, on the other side, you never responded to anything factually, I can cry and write personal stuff too. But what good is it for? Just shows one's tiny little mental capacity like your post represents yours!!

I will respond factually but I am giving you the opprotunity to share trade volume of these ETFs as you must have exact information regarding trade volume as you are working in Wall Street.

 

[Spectre]

Oh poor cup cake!!!!! You are so hurt!!!!! Well, don't cry. Eat a pie. If you don't like the content or the person.....don't indulge in a conversation with me.

By the way, in the last message, you were going to show me credentials. Here, you are calling Mods for help to save your hurt emotions....where are the manly, man, proud credentials I was waiting on??

I have never told you that I will show you my credentials - Put simply I have stated nothing proprietory which would require such exposition. All my arguments can be understood and verified by a basic Fin -101 student. When I need to put across some dense theory then I will state my qualification to back my theory up. As of now I am just stating facts.

You dont need to prove that You were a Portfolio Manager for Merrill Lynch, Blackstone and Mizuho for stating 2+2=4

 

[Viper0011.]

I have clearly stated that I don't like to make give out information where it is not relevant but be assured I am not speaking out of ignorance or half understood market phenomenons. Prove my below arguments to be wrong where I have contradicted you and dont obfuscate the issue

1. You cannot compare stocks and securities based just on trading price.
2. Most of the activities in stock market don't bring money to the company exception being IPO which happens once in company's lifetime
3. Most capital inflow in stock market is looking to make a quick buck not for long term investment.
4. Infant stock markets like Pakistan Stock Exchange are extremely unstable and are not correlated to economy of Pakistan.

So you are telling me the Western investors paying thousands for each Security I listed for Pakistan are pure stupid and have freaking clue?? . And YOU, somehow, having NO experience in this arena, are smarter than people who've been running economies and securities across the globe for like 80 years !!

So per the bullet points above in your post, these people, who invested hundreds of millions of dollars into Pakistani securities, decided to pay three to five times the money to LOSE money....and while they can otherwise pay to buy Google, Apple, GE and other securities much cheaper, and all inside US and more secure apparently????

Your logic is as small as a Child age 4 who gets a first Space Ship toy and thinks the Moon is as high as his hand can go in the air!! If you couldn't understand numbers I provided from the Dow and other places, the actual physical fact, there is nothing I can provide to you which would help you. Go on writing silly posts. I think I am done. You can make sense out of logic, but you can't make sense out of rants and opinions without facts!!

 

[WaLeEdK2]

Pashtuns or any Pak ethnic group doesn't need to prove or have a certified to show their patriotism ..! Fuk that.. That disgusts me.

As for this guy .. I have a feeling that this guy is either Indian or a pseudo intellectual type.. Like that turd "tareek fateeh" clown.

I just tagged you guys to embarrass him.

If you go on YouTube, there's a channel about him . Indians are desperate lol. But I would like YouTube to be allowed in Pakistan. I can't stand Indian comments everywhere on Pakistani videos.

 

[Viper0011.]

I have never told you that I will show you my credentials - Put simply I have stated nothing proprietory which would require such exposition. All my arguments can be understood and verified by a basic Fin -101 student. When I need to put across some dense theory then I will state my qualification to back my theory up. As of now I am just stating facts.

You dont need to prove that You were a Portfolio Manager for Merrill Lynch, Blackstone and Mizuho for stating 2+2=4

You just told me how high your brain power can work in this area!!!! Portfolio Manager!!!!! I have a few who work for me