Abdus Salam - Noble prize winner / Greatest Pakistani scientist and his great contributions to the motherland

[epebble]

Well, him bringing faith into his speech does not mean that it influenced the Nobel Prize committee in anyway.

In my view, Nobel Prize committee have to by all means look for merit otherwise such a prestigious award will become a joke. Well, see around it has not become a joke and world really acknowledges and appreciates the ones who have received it. Its kind of an established benchmark. There has to be substantial work involved on part of high achievers.

I strongly believe, him getting Noble prize has nothing to do with him being Ahmadi. He would have received it, had he be a jew or a christian or shia or a sunni.

Decades ago, the oldtimers who worked with him always spoke highly of him. Even if you insist to make his Nobel prize controversial, his countless other contributions in promoting scientific research, civil nuclear technology in Pakistan, space organization are more then enough to credit him.

Literature and Peace Nobels do dabble in politics and ideology du jour. But the hard sciences have been mostly free of that, to the extent human frailties allow.

 

[VCheng]

Man, you killed the internet today.

The truth - ahem - hurts!

 

[SaadH]

Newton was the greatest genus in physics. he never won the prize. Its all political.

Newton stood on the shoulders of the giants before him. He wasn't the first one who postulated on the laws of motions nor the first to come up with Calculus all on his own. Ibn-e-Haytham is one the giants and I would certainly rate him equal to if not a greater genius than Newton.

The little-known Muslim influence on Sir Isaac Newton's scientific breakthrough

Sir Isaac Newton. One of the greatest physicists ever who said: “If I have seen further, it is because I stand on the shoulders of giants”. We know about I ...

themuslimvibe.com

 

[Ssan]

Well, him bringing faith into his speech does not mean that it influenced the Nobel Prize committee in anyway.

In my view, Nobel Prize committee have to by all means look for merit otherwise such a prestigious award will become a joke. Well, see around it has not become a joke and world really acknowledges and appreciates the ones who have received it. Its kind of an established benchmark. There has to be substantial work involved on part of high achievers.

I strongly believe, him getting Noble prize has nothing to do with him being Ahmadi. He would have received it, had he be a jew or a christian or shia or a sunni.

Decades ago, the oldtimers who worked with him always spoke highly of him. Even if you insist to make his Nobel prize controversial, his countless other contributions in promoting scientific research, civil nuclear technology in Pakistan, space organization are more then enough to credit him.

Okay I can respect your opinion.

But only after you read this publication from his colleague- Norman Dombey.

[1109.1972] Abdus Salam: A Reappraisal. PART I. How to Win the Nobel Prize

arxiv.org

The fact of the matter is that very few Nobel prize physics recipients have had the sort of publications posted about them afterwards.

Yes there may be cases where people question if they were deserving. But very few that have had papers written About how the theory they have their names attached to was not their original work.

 

[SaadH]

Okay I can respect your opinion.

But only after you read this publication from his colleague- Norman Dombey.

[1109.1972] Abdus Salam: A Reappraisal. PART I. How to Win the Nobel Prize

arxiv.org

The fact of the matter is that very few Nobel prize physics recipients have had the sort of publications posted about them afterwards.

Yes there may be cases where people question if they were deserving. But very few that have had papers written About how the theory they have their names attached to was not their original work.

Interesting tid bits from the above article....

"As a good patriot Salam then returned to Pakistan as Professor of Mathematics at both Punjab University and Government College."

And someone here was arguing that the cult member wasn't even offered an asst. professorship.

"While Salam was at the Institute in Princeton in 1951, Zafrullah Khan, the Foreign Minister of Pakistan and a fellow Ahmadi whom Salam had previously met en route to Cambridge in 1946 visited him on his way to the UN General Assembly. They toured New England together and then Khan showed Salam round the UN in New York. So in 1955 at the first UN Conference on Peaceful Uses of Atomic Energy in Geneva, Salam found himself appointed as a scientific secretary to the conference. With backers like Zafrullah Khan, Blackett, Bethe and Oppenheimer, Salam had qualified for the premier league in international scientific politics as well as theoretical physics."

Of course politics and science don't cross over...wink wink...

 

[VCheng]

Of course politics and science don't cross over...wink wink...

All of those demonstrations of acceptability came after he became famous abroad. I think the scientific term that applies here is "asskissing".

 

[SaadH]

More sordid tale of the egregious persecution meted out this poor cult member, no appointment as a Asst. Professorship, yet:

"In 1958 General Ayub Khan seized power in a coup.. He asked Salam to help establish the Pakistan Atomic Energy Commission and in 1961 appointed him Chief Scientific Advisor. Salam was also appointed as Pakistan’s representative to the General Conference of the IAEA" 14 A Salam, Ideals and Realities (Ed. Z Hassan and C H Lai) World Scientific Singapore 1984 p.52 7 IAEA.

 

[VCheng]

More sordid tale of the egregious persecution meted out this poor cult member, no appointment as a Asst. Professorship, yet:

ROFL. He did his MA in 1946. Events years later have no bearing on his failure to get a job at the Government College, but merely demonstrate your desire to deny and revise history.








(Please keep in mind that Prof Salam worked in PAEC for a while, as did his nephew, quoted above.)

 

[CivilianSupremacy]

Okay I can respect your opinion.

But only after you read this publication from his colleague- Norman Dombey.

[1109.1972] Abdus Salam: A Reappraisal. PART I. How to Win the Nobel Prize

arxiv.org

The fact of the matter is that very few Nobel prize physics recipients have had the sort of publications posted about them afterwards.

Yes there may be cases where people question if they were deserving. But very few that have had papers written About how the theory they have their names attached to was not their original work.

Well, I read it through.

One thing which I didn't knew that Salam was very close getting a prize well before 1979.

"Salam then discovered that if a particle called a neutrino which had no electric charge and was emitted together with an electron in beta-decay had precisely zero mass (and thus according to Einstein’s theory of relativity must travel at the velocity of light) then the equation which describes it has a natural symmetry which violates parity so that a world in which left-handed was preferred to right-handed could be the consequence of zero mass neutrinos.
Paul Matthews wrote to him from the United States ‘you’ve really hit the jackpot this time’. His friend and collaborator john Ward wrote ‘So many congratulations and fond hopes for at least one-third of a Nobel prize’. One-third because the prize would presumably be shared with Lee and Yang.
Unfortunately for Salam the Nobel Committee didn’t agree. After experimental
confirmation in 1957 that parity was violated and that neutrinos emitted in beta-decays
rotated preferentially anti-clockwise (that is were left-handed) the 1957 Nobel prize was
awarded to Lee and Yang not Salam. Salam continued to hope that future Nobel Committees
would take a more positive view of his work."

Also, what I didn't knew is his role in IAEA.

While Salam was at the Institute in Princeton in 1951, Zafrullah Khan, the Foreign Minister of Pakistan and a fellow Ahmadi whom Salam had previously met en route to Cambridge in 1946 visited him on his way to the UN General Assembly

Shows an epic bias from the writer's point of view. Discussing faith of foreign minister and country's top scientist. Do you feel odd, when anyone say a hindu foriegn minister of india met top scientist of india (himself a hindu) -- and they both working together entirely for the best interest of india ?. Won't it feel odd ? Pakistan playing its role in IAEA was yet another achievement for the country. Officials working for the country (whatever faith they have) should be praised. Not seen with suspicion.
When there's a bias in the mind then everything will look suspicious. At that time, no law was introduced against their sect too. These individuals were working in best interest of the country. Atleast that's what I read it.

Anywhere in the world progress happens with connections and relationships. Otherwise, there maybe geniuses like Einstiens but we never heard of. This is how world works. Getting to know each other, traveling to different universities, working on different projects, gaining experiences, gaining knowledge this is how scientific community worked... especially for third world countries where there were none prestigious institutions.

Or another scientist, Dr.A.Q Khan got knowledge from institutes in EU, Later he sent his colleagues under shadow company names who got trainings and even some equipment from various EU institutes. That's a brilliant plan that worked. Israeli scientists did the same and they honored them forever. But we humiliated our hero on TV taking all the blame of his network. It was his plan for his country. Now, there is usual bias & hatred against Pakistan. See how West writes about Dr.A.Q.Khan. They make him villain. Do you think, they can easily digest Pakistani getting a Nobel. Many may not. But atleast Pakistanis should know the immense contributions handful few made for the country in its earlier decades.

 

[SaadH]

ROFL. He did his MA in 1946. Events years later have no bearing on his failure to get a job at the Government College, but merely demonstrate your desire to deny and revise history.

What's your point?

 

[VCheng]

What's your point?

The point is for you to please stop trying to revise and deny the poor treatment meted out to Prof Salam by Pakistan.

But we humiliated our hero on TV taking all the blame of his network.

His deserved humiliation came from unauthorized sale of national nuclear assets for money for personal gain. Pakistan is still dealing with the damage to its reputation as a responsible nuclear state.

 

[Ssan]

Well, I read it through.

One thing which I didn't knew that Salam was very close getting a prize well before 1979.

"Salam then discovered that if a particle called a neutrino which had no electric charge and was emitted together with an electron in beta-decay had precisely zero mass (and thus according to Einstein’s theory of relativity must travel at the velocity of light) then the equation which describes it has a natural symmetry which violates parity so that a world in which left-handed was preferred to right-handed could be the consequence of zero mass neutrinos.
Paul Matthews wrote to him from the United States ‘you’ve really hit the jackpot this time’. His friend and collaborator john Ward wrote ‘So many congratulations and fond hopes for at least one-third of a Nobel prize’. One-third because the prize would presumably be shared with Lee and Yang.
Unfortunately for Salam the Nobel Committee didn’t agree. After experimental
confirmation in 1957 that parity was violated and that neutrinos emitted in beta-decays
rotated preferentially anti-clockwise (that is were left-handed) the 1957 Nobel prize was
awarded to Lee and Yang not Salam. Salam continued to hope that future Nobel Committees
would take a more positive view of his work."

Also, what I didn't knew is his role in IAEA.




Shows an epic bias from the writer's point of view. Discussing faith of foreign minister and country's top scientist. Do you feel odd, when anyone say a hindu foriegn minister of india met top scientist of india (himself a hindu) -- and they both working together entirely for the best interest of india ?. Won't it feel odd ? Pakistan playing its role in IAEA was yet another achievement for the country. Officials working for the country (whatever faith they have) should be praised. Not seen with suspicion.
When there's a bias in the mind then everything will look suspicious. At that time, no law was introduced against their sect too. These individuals were working in best interest of the country. Atleast that's what I read it.

Anywhere in the world progress happens with connections and relationships. Otherwise, there maybe geniuses like Einstiens but we never heard of. This is how world works. Getting to know each other, traveling to different universities, working on different projects, gaining experiences, gaining knowledge this is how scientific community worked... especially for third world countries where there were none prestigious institutions.

Or another scientist, Dr.A.Q Khan got knowledge from institutes in EU, Later he sent his colleagues under shadow company names who got trainings and even some equipment from various EU institutes. That's a brilliant plan that worked. Israeli scientists did the same and they honored them forever. But we humiliated our hero on TV taking all the blame of his network. It was his plan for his country. Now, there is usual bias & hatred against Pakistan. See how West writes about Dr.A.Q.Khan. They make him villain. Do you think, they can easily digest Pakistani getting a Nobel. Many may not. But atleast Pakistanis should know the immense contributions handful few made for the country in its earlier decades.

It is easy for you to say that I am biased.

That is fine and understandable. I get it in fact. I would question why you wouldn’t in fact.

It is hard for you to say the same or his colleagues. Or that his colleagues make it a point to bring his Ahmadi faith in question and a reason for why he won the Nobel. Norman Dombey above is not Pakistani biased random uncle.

Btw, the other colleagues I am talking about include two Nobel prizes winners in his very subject area.

So hard for you to pin this on me. I am not speaking from a place of bias.

 

[epebble]

Newton was the greatest genus in physics. he never won the prize. Its all political.

Isaac Newton died in 1726. Alfred Nobel was born in 1833. More than 100 years separated them.

 

[VCheng]

Isaac Newton died in 1726. Alfred Nobel was born in 1833. More than 100 years separated them.

It is all political, of course.

(Never mind the actual facts.)

May be he meant the "noble prize" just like the OP in the title? That may be a different one than the famous Nobel Prize, but what do I know?

 

[SaadH]

The point is for you to please stop trying to revise and deny the poor treatment meted out to Prof Salam by Pakistan.



His deserved humiliation came from unauthorized sale of national nuclear assets for money for personal gain. Pakistan is still dealing with the damage to its reputation as a responsible nuclear state.

On the contrary you should have given up while you were ahead instead of continuing to perpetuate a false narrative and copying and pasting revisionist history talking points from rabawahtimes.org

Salam was never denied asst. professorship as your fellow rabwahtimes.org consumer above had stated, in fact he was offered full professorship by two prestigious institutions in Pakistan. And this patronage continued even as the regimes changed hands through to late sixties and early 70's, with official representation in international bodies and involvement with the PAEC activities both peaceful and otherwise.