LCA tejas fighting fit

[Echo_419]

Nothing of the kind. There was a deep rift in philosophy within the Air Force, and the civilians quite rightly did not interfere. The rift has been resolved, internally. The f**king government had nothing to do with it, besides making faces and striking postures on the sidelines.

Political conspiracy? Silly nonsense.

There is a possibility that french were paying our sold out media to write propaganda against Tejas

 

[AnnoyingOrange]

Ya compare the specs of the two. "only" 53 shortfalls in LCA. LCA wins by clear margin. End of debate

Yes a third generation aircraft that is assembled out of CKDs imported form China....Vs a 4th generation fighter jet designed and manufactured within the country... Debate is ridiculous.

 

[Joe Shearer]

There is a possibility that french were paying our sold out media to write propaganda against Tejas

Really?

Part of the butt-hurt response of the right to losing the battle for the respect of journalists? So anyone against the 56"er is a presstitute. Anyone writing scurrilous blogs against opponents of the present government's policy is full of righteousness and piety.

This whole thread is sickening. And the contributors to it, so far. Whores of the right wing Sangh Parivar, dragging the defence services into their own vein of blog-based demagoguery.

Yes a third generation aircraft that is assembled out of CKDs imported form China....Vs a 4th generation fighter jet designed and manufactured within the country... Debate is ridiculous.

You forgot the green paint.

 

[Bang Galore]

Really?

Part of the butt-hurt response of the right to losing the battle for the respect of journalists? So anyone against the 56"er is a presstitute. Anyone writing scurrilous blogs against opponents of the present government's policy is full of righteousness and piety.

This whole thread is sickening. And the contributors to it, so far. Whores of the right wing Sangh Parivar, dragging the defence services into their own vein of blog-based demagoguery.

Disagree. The entire slew of articles against the LCA have used Modi's make in India program to criticise the government for this decision. You made out a view that this was the internal resolution of the differences within the IAF & had nothing to do with the government. In which case the media was guilty of blaming Modi wrongly & which might suggest they are indeed deserving of the term used for them.

Not only this thread, the whole discourse is sickening because everyone brings in their own axes while pretending that the axes are all with the guys in political opposition to their own views.

Nothing of the kind. There was a deep rift in philosophy within the Air Force, and the civilians quite rightly did not interfere. The rift has been resolved, internally. The f**king government had nothing to do with it, besides making faces and striking postures on the sidelines.

Political conspiracy? Silly nonsense.

Narendra Modi’s Make-in-India plan could hurt Indian Air Force | The Financial Express
Narendra Modi pushes ‘obsolete’ made-in-India Tejas jet on IAF - Livemint
Modi pushes 'obsolete' made-in-India plane on reluctant military | Business Standard News
Modi govt pushes 'obsolete' made-in-India plane on reluctant military - Firstpost
Modi pushes "obsolete" made-in-India plane on reluctant military - Yahoo News
Modi′s ′Make in India′ clashes with air force′s demands | News | DW.COM | 07.10.2015
Why Did Narendra Modi Push 'Obsolete' Made-In-India Plane On Reluctant Military?

 

[Rangila]

Ya compare the specs of the two. "only" 53 shortfalls in LCA. LCA wins by clear margin. End of debate

Just because there is no CAG-Pakistan.
Which would otherwise produced 69 shortfalls.
JF-17 wins on the paper.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Disagree. The entire slew of articles against the LCA have used Modi's make in India program to criticise the government for this decision. You made out a view that this was the internal resolution of the differences within the IAF & had nothing to do with the government. In which case the media was guilty of blaming Modi wrongly & which might suggest they are indeed deserving of the term used for them.

Not only this thread, the whole discourse is sickening because everyone brings in their own axes while pretending that the axes are all with the guys in political opposition to their own views.

Let us take it in sequence.

It is not a secret to you or to me or to any of us that there was serious heartburn on both sides of the procurement divide.

The developers felt that the air force kept sticking on one stipulation after another, almost suspiciously as if they really did not trust Indian know-how and technology, and that there was no way of achieving hits against this kind of moving target.

The air force felt that unless the finally developed aircraft were to be battle-worthy in the real world, as it was inducted with complete adherence to procedure, just like any other aircraft entering service, no matter what the pedigree and antecedents of that lucky aircraft.

You will recall that there were continued jerks and stops in the previously smooth programme due to the failure of the LCA to achieve certain deadlines in time.

On top of everything else, it is not a secret that there were opposing points of view on the aircraft types to be inducted. The original view in the air force strongly favoured best of breed approach, with air superiority, interception, long range and strategic strike and combat air support, both close range and long range, represented differently. However, Mirage pilots were a very strong community and they were ultimately the victors, due to the unanswerable economic arguments for maintaining one well-made aircraft type for all missions. It must be remembered that the multi-role role, as it were, forced certain compromises on to the aircraft, and these compromises were recognised, understood and evaluated with care.

I strongly disagree that the Make in India programme had any influence on the decision to procure larger numbers of the Tejas. That was a decision in the pipeline, and it was based on the contingency that the aircraft would go through its advanced trials successfully; also, it was Plan B, in spite of Arjun Raha denying that there was, or is, a Plan B. Plan B does not signify an exclusive step, it signifies an extension of the window to allow more time for the Rafale decision to be frozen and bounded, while taking advantage of an existing option and broadening its scope to cover the missing numbers at the crucial time. All this against the option of the inevitable drainage of power due to retirement of the MiG 21.

So was it the fault of the media that they picked up the phrase Make in India and went to town on it? I think if you argue that, as you have done, you are effectively eating your cake and having it too. Was it the media which created the hype about the programme? Was it not the shrill, over-confident voices of the propagandist element in the current ruling dispensation that shoved it down the throat of everybody, including the media? Having done that, why blame the media for extracting this triumphal announcement from it oesophagus and getting querulous about it? I could go on, but I believe that this states the case for the media and against the Modi fairly and fully.

 

[45'22']

Do you know what 53 shortfalls are please specific to state one

Also state that Jf-17 meet those standard's

53 Shortcomings were there in the previousccag report
There were only 6 milestones left out of which 4 has been done....only 2 r left

Ya compare the specs of the two. "only" 53 shortfalls in LCA. LCA wins by clear margin. End of debate

you should know things b4 posting...dont just copy paste

 

[Bang Galore]

So was it the fault of the media that they picked up the phrase Make in India and went to town on it? I think if you argue that, as you have done, you are effectively eating your cake and having it too. Was it the media which created the hype about the programme? Was it not the shrill, over-confident voices of the propagandist element in the current ruling dispensation that shoved it down the throat of everybody, including the media? Having done that, why blame the media for extracting this triumphal announcement from it oesophagus and getting querulous about it? I could go on, but I believe that this states the case for the media and against the Modi fairly and fully.

I take no real issue with whether the media went to town with the "make in India" bit or not, though what you have argued suggests non-comprehension of the issue at hand as well as incompetence by those in the media who did that. My point is simple, if you think it is fair that the media went with that take, the same leeway should then be given to those offering up the opposite view. Can't be "It's all Modi's fault" for the decision but when credit is sought to be given, to trot out the argument that "government had nothing to do with it".

 

[Sine Nomine]

You forgot the green paint.

And Helmet.....

 

[Bang Galore]

Btw @Joe Shearer, forgetting about the political nitpicking, I would be very interested in knowing what you make of this decision & what you think of the specific model on offer. You know better than most here about the LCA program & your opinion on this would be appreciated

 

[Sine Nomine]

I take no real issue with whether the media went to town with the "make in India" bit or not, though what you have argued suggests non-comprehension of the issue at hand as well as incompetence by those in the media who did that. My point is simple, if you think it is fair that the media went with that take, the same leeway should then be given to those offering up the opposite view. Can't be "It's all Modi's fault" for the decision but when credit is sought to be given, to trot out the argument that "government had nothing to do with it".

Hey man what is Production rate of Tejas.

JF-17 wins on the paper.

Yes 75+ on active duty with production rate of 25+ a year.

 

[cerberus]

53 Shortcomings were there in the previousccag report
There were only 6 milestones left out of which 4 has been done....only 2 r left

I know All i Was Just asking him Guy don't have base to Sustain his arguments.

 

[Joe Shearer]

I take no real issue with whether the media went to town with the "make in India" bit or not, though what you have argued suggests non-comprehension of the issue at hand as well as incompetence by those in the media who did that. My point is simple, if you think it is fair that the media went with that take, the same leeway should then be given to those offering up the opposite view. Can't be "It's all Modi's fault" for the decision but when credit is sought to be given, to trot out the argument that "government had nothing to do with it".

I'm not sure I've understood. Here's the media saying it was a bad example of Make in India gone berserk. Here's the media-watcher promptly announcing that the media have been bought. Why bought? Why not just derisive of the juxtaposition of the decision to procure more Tejas with the announcement of the Make in India initiative?

Disagree. The entire slew of articles against the LCA have used Modi's make in India program to criticise the government for this decision. You made out a view that this was the internal resolution of the differences within the IAF & had nothing to do with the government. In which case the media was guilty of blaming Modi wrongly & which might suggest they are indeed deserving of the term used for them.

Not only this thread, the whole discourse is sickening because everyone brings in their own axes while pretending that the axes are all with the guys in political opposition to their own views.




Narendra Modi’s Make-in-India plan could hurt Indian Air Force | The Financial Express
Narendra Modi pushes ‘obsolete’ made-in-India Tejas jet on IAF - Livemint
Modi pushes 'obsolete' made-in-India plane on reluctant military | Business Standard News
Modi govt pushes 'obsolete' made-in-India plane on reluctant military - Firstpost
Modi pushes "obsolete" made-in-India plane on reluctant military - Yahoo News
Modi′s ′Make in India′ clashes with air force′s demands | News | DW.COM | 07.10.2015
Why Did Narendra Modi Push 'Obsolete' Made-In-India Plane On Reluctant Military?

And the explanation of this slew of hostile articles, from very different sources, is that there was a pay-master? Perhaps, could it have been the BJP itself, trying to claim credit and watching in horror as it backfired with precision and lasting damage?

And Helmet.....

Sorry. Age catching up.

 

[45'22']

Hey man what is Production rate of Tejas.

Yes 75+ on active duty with production rate of 25+ a year.

Pak has 53 thunders as of now
8 were given by China
That means 45 in 7 years which says a production line of 6 jets per year

Tejas hasnt gone into mass production yet
If this 120mk1a contract is signed now....production line will be churning out 16 jets per year

 

[Omega007]

Tejas hasnt gone into mass production yet
If this 120mk1a contract is signed now....production line will be churning out 16 jets per year

The target should be 18 per year,that way,IAF can induct one full squadron every year.