Pakistan PM rejects ‘independent Kashmir’

[ito]

Its tiny, really tiny

We are part and parcel of Kashmiri diaspora, I have been all over Azad Kashmir and there is kashmiri community from indian area too

This is what im telling you

Indians are hated because they are hindus and don't represent Kashmir faith, culture, language or ethnicity, dont disregard an age old dislike of hindus when it comes to opposing india

Independence will garner no more then 10%-15% and even they would back Pakistan if it was a choice against india

In any free and fair vote across all of Kashmir, Pakistan would be a clear majority victor and it wouldn't even be close

Are you poor in reading? Go to the BBC link and read the survey results. And there won't be any vote in Kashmir. The only way for Pakistan to get Kashmir is by war. And war results could go either way. If India wins the war India will get Azad Kashmir and GB, if Pakistan wins it will get the whole of Kashmir.

 

[Chhatrapati]

They are muslims wanting to be part of a muslim country not dogs waiting to be hit in a hindu majority state

Guess they are stuck forever with India. May be they can go to Pakistan if they love Pakistan so much.

Please tell me, is there any Kashmiri people who escape the oppression and live in the heaven for Muslims called Pakistan? Or they keep making noises in India to satisfy their own petty demands in India.

Kashmiri are just milking the dispute to their advantage and unfortunately there is not much gains.

 

[cloud4000]

I agree to one point by the PM of Pakistan, Kashmir cannot be independent. There has been a lot of noise emanating from Pakistan that let Kashmir be independent state. It is good that India and Pakistan are on the same page as regarding Independence of Kashmir.

Also let the Kashmiris be clear on what Pakistan wants with regard to Kashmir. There are many separatists in Kashmir live with a illusion that claim that Pakistan is OK with independent Kashmir.

How will an independent Kashmir operate when it has Pakistan on one side and India on another? It will become another Afghanistan, having to rely on one party or the other for its lifeline. There are only two scenarios: 1) status quo, the realistic version or 2) Kashmir either going to India or Pakistan via negotiations, plebiscite, or an armed struggle. The latter is unrealistic.

Except Geelani, major separatist groups are pro independent.

Geelani is pro-Pakistani. Anytime Pakistan talks about a negotiated solution between India, Pakistan, and Kashmiris, APHC is considered the only legitimate representative of the Kashmiri people. I say let them stand for elections and see how representative APHC actually are, but they won't

Indians are hated because they are hindus and don't represent Kashmir faith, culture, language or ethnicity, dont disregard an age old dislike of hindus when it comes to opposing india

What about Kashmir Pandits, who are Hindus?

 

[Talwar e Pakistan]

Guess they are stuck forever with India. May be they can go to Pakistan if they love Pakistan so much.

Please tell me, is there any Kashmiri people who escape the oppression and live in the heaven for Muslims called Pakistan? Or they keep making noises in India to satisfy their own petty demands in India.

Kashmiri are just milking the dispute to their advantage and unfortunately there is not much gains.

Kashmir has been their land for thousands and thousands of years, Indians are foreigners with whom they share nothing it. Kashmiris have the right to self-determination and also have the right to resist and fight foreign occupation.

Kashmiris have been fleeing the region for centuries, in what can be referred to as ethnic cleansing. Countless migrated during the Sikh and Hindu takeover of Kashmir, in which the Muslim majority was severely persecuted. Sikh and Hindu immigrants were settled in the region in a state-sponsored process of changing the demographics by the Dogra regime.

In 1947 alone, hundreds of thousands of Kashmiris had to flee into Pakistan under state-sponsored genocide and ethnic cleansing. Over 100,000-250,000 were killed in Jammu alone. Within several days, the Muslim majority in Jammu became a minority and were purposely replaced by more Hindus and Sikhs by the Dogra regime.

In 1980-1990's as well, tens of thousands fled into Pakistan and settled throughout Azad Kashmir and Gilgit Baltistan. Unfortunately, hardly anyone knows about this specific community; there has been very little attention on them.

Go to 18:38

I come from a community that had to flee Kashmir due to persecution by the foreign occupying dynasty.

 

[ziaulislam]

If a independent Kashmir is not feasible and one really wants to resolve this issue, then the only possibility is a unified pre-1947 India.

which was rejected by congress but accepted by PML in 1946 cabinet mission
unfortunately it cant happen now, blame nehru and congress who thought it can destroy pakistan before it can be made, was partially sucessful iwould say, the plan was to make sure pakistan does nt go beyond punjab and bengal
1. so redcliff was given task to divide the provinces which was not the part of orginal plan, original plan was to keep provinces intact
2. ANP/bacha khan was given task of making KPK part of either india or afgahnistan but islamia college movement and jinnah personal interest foiled that
3. sindh was to be part of bombi but that was foiled
4. baluchistan rulers were to be paid but that was foiled by key memebers and volunteers
5. kashmir was sobtaged by using first redcliff(hence given a path) and than forcing to mah raja
6. smaller states like junagrah were captured by force 2 years later even though in UN Submitted maps they were accepted as part of pakistan by both india-pakistan

i would say i will give congress a win here but for their personal greed and extremism they sabotaged the future of india, Jinnah on the other hand was labelled as liberal and open minded person by both hindus and muslims. This extremism exist in hindhus tillnow and now has grown on pakistan side as a repsonse to aggression of 1971 and issues in 1980s

result an ever conflicting sub continent

read this
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1946_Cabinet_Mission_to_India

 

[Chhatrapati]

In 1980-1990's as well, tens of thousands fled into Pakistan and settled throughout Azad Kashmir and Gilgit Baltistan. Unfortunately, hardly anyone knows about this specific community; there has been very little attention on them.

Yeah dito no data available. How hard it is to classiffy number of people who fled opression? If there is a grave situation like in Myanmar how come no Kashmiri wants to go to Pakistan?

I repeat, please provide a data of Kashmiri refugees. If available rather than giving a rhetorical answer.

Kashmir has been their land for thousands and thousands of years, Indians are foreigners with whom they share nothing it. Kashmiris have the right to self-determination and also have the right to resist and fight foreign occupation.

We share our resources with Kashmiri and they share their resources with us. That really matters. Not some outdated referendum that everybody knows is never going to happen. Simply we don't want to loss the Kashmir land it's extremely important for the rivers and glaciers.

 

[MultaniGuy]

I agree to one point by the PM of Pakistan, Kashmir cannot be independent. There has been a lot of noise emanating from Pakistan that let Kashmir be independent state. It is good that India and Pakistan are on the same page as regarding Independence of Kashmir.

Also let the Kashmiris be clear on what Pakistan wants with regard to Kashmir. There are many separatists in Kashmir live with a illusion that claim that Pakistan is OK with independent Kashmir.

Since when did Pakistanis say Kashmir should be an independent state?
According to UN resolutions its either Pakistan or India that the Kashmiris can vote for.

 

[Talwar e Pakistan]

Yeah dito no data available. How hard it is to classiffy number of people who fled opression? If there is a grave situation like in Myanmar how come no Kashmiri wants to go to Pakistan?

Over 35,000 people fled into Pakistan during 1990's, but only 60% of them have achieved citizenship yet. Pakistan heavily discourages Kashmiris from fleeing IoK as we believe demographic change will severely hurt the Kashmiri cause and their ability to resist occupation.

https://www.csmonitor.com/World/Asi...lled-Kashmir.-Are-they-better-off-in-Pakistan

Migration still goes on, my distant cousin came to Pakistan legally through the Wagah border, but has now been staying in Pakistan illegally; years after his visa expired.

My relatives in IoK live in poverty, their grandparent's and parent's homes (from pre-1947) are now occupied by foreign Hindus who migrated from Punjab in 1947.

We have fared much better here in Pakistan and occasionally send money to our relatives in IoK.

We share our resources with Kashmiri and they share their resources with us. That really matters. Not some outdated referendum that everybody knows is never going to happen. Simply we don't want to loss the Kashmir land it's extremely important for the rivers and glaciers.

That is the same type of 'relationship' that the British enjoyed with it's colonies; do you think their oppression and occupation was justified?

 

[Chhatrapati]

Over 35,000 people fled into Pakistan during 1990's, but only 60% of them have achieved citizenship yet. Pakistan heavily discourages Kashmiris from fleeing IoK as we believe demographic change will severely hurt the Kashmiri cause and their ability to resist occupation.

https://www.csmonitor.com/World/Asi...lled-Kashmir.-Are-they-better-off-in-Pakistan

Migration still goes on, my distant cousin came to Pakistan legally through the Wagah border, but has now been staying in Pakistan illegally; years after his visa expired.

My relatives in IoK live in poverty, their grandparent's and parent's homes (from pre-1947) are now occupied by foreign Hindus who migrated from Punjab in 1947.

We have fared much better here in Pakistan and occasionally send money to our relatives in IoK.


That is the same type of 'relationship' that the British enjoyed with it's colonies; do you think their oppression and occupation was justified?

Again data provided by non- credible source.

There are people who leaves one side and seek refugee on either sides due to numerous reasons. There is no mass movement of Kashmiris from J&K to Pakistan.

Partition is not the topic here. There had been losses on both sides. My grand father who had a wealthy business in Pakistan had to leave at the time of partition being a Muslim, he still chose to stay in India.

The British was not physically connected with India and most of it's colonies. And Kashmir is not a colony of india, it has a state status and special status under constitution. And the citizens of Kashmir can even be presidents of India if they wish, while can you claim the same for AJK or GB? Can they become the ruling elites? Simply comparing the constitutional status of AJK and GB people to people of J&K gives a glimpse of who belongs to whom.

What claim Pakistan have over Kashmir which is nothing but a Muslim majority region out of many muslims majority regions in India. And a princely state at the time of Partition, it has historical connection with India and the subcontinent since thousands of years.

 

[MultaniGuy]

Again data provided by non- credible source.

There are people who leaves one side and seek refugee on either sides due to numerous reasons. There is no mass movement of Kashmiris from J&K to Pakistan.

Partition is not the topic here. There had been losses on both sides. My grand father who had a wealthy business in Pakistan had to leave at the time of partition being a Muslim, he still chose to stay in India.

The British was not physically connected with India and most of it's colonies. And Kashmir is not a colony of india, it has a state status and special status under constitution. And the citizens of Kashmir can even be presidents of India if they wish, while can you claim the same for AJK or GB? Can they become the ruling elites? Simply comparing the constitutional status of AJK and GB people to people of J&K gives a glimpse of who belongs to whom.

What claim Pakistan have over Kashmir which is nothing but a Muslim majority region out of many muslims majority regions in India. And a princely state at the time of Partition, it has historical connection with India and the subcontinent since thousands of years.

Idiotic post. Kashmir's relationship with Pakistan can be demonstrated not with India

 

[Chhatrapati]

Idiotic post. Kashmir's relationship with Pakistan can be demonstrated not with India

How do you demonstrate it?

 

[The Eagle]

Selective approach with incomplete statement to mislead the masses, is a propaganda that need a bit of attention to prove as it worth. Read complete statement based upon two sentences, explaining about the deliberate floating idea. Every other source with selective lines depends upon Geo News hence, there is the complete version.

Weighing in on the narrative surrounding ‘independent Kashmir’, Abbasi remarked that “the idea is often floated around but has no reality.”

There is no support for the independent Kashmir demand, he claimed. “The people of Kashmir should be given the right to self-determination.”

 

[MultaniGuy]

How do you demonstrate it?

Kashmir has cultural relationship with the Muslim Punjab and the Khyber Putkhnkwa province of Pakistan.

That is why the Maharaja of Kashmir signed a standstill agreement with Pakistan.

Selective approach with incomplete statement to mislead the masses, is a propaganda that need a bit of attention to prove as it worth. Read complete statement based upon two sentences, explaining about the deliberate floating idea. Every other source with selective lines depends upon Geo News hence, there is the complete version.

Weighing in on the narrative surrounding ‘independent Kashmir’, Abbasi remarked that “the idea is often floated around but has no reality.”

There is no support for the independent Kashmir demand, he claimed. “The people of Kashmir should be given the right to self-determination.”

Exactly, there is no support for an Independent Kashmir.

Its either Pakistan or India that the Kashmiris must decide for and vote for.

 

[Laozi]

India should support and finance the movement for the Independence of parts of Kashmir held by Pakistan

Would really love to see the reactions of Pakistanis on hearing the same slogans that are raised in the valley

 

[Chhatrapati]

Kashmir has cultural relationship with the Muslim Punjab and the Khyber Putkhnkwa province of Pakistan.

That is why the Maharaja of Kashmir signed a standstill agreement with Pakistan.

So? Kashmiri pundits have relationship with Hindu India and Buddhist in J&K have relations with India. What kind of logic is that?

It has historically been part of Indian subcontinent. And legally part of India.

And your violation of the standstill agreement forced the King to accede his territory.