Why state specially Army fails to take action against TLP ? (My Opinion)

[war&peace]

Pakistan had the wildest Halloween party the world has ever seen. Hats off to party animal Khadim Rizvi

https://twitter.com/x/status/1058043251872153601

and Maulna pen di siri is a miscreant i.e con artist who is manipulating the youth of our country and using ashiq e rasool slogan to bring destruction and havoc in country

 

[Indus Pakistan]

State seems to have surrendered and that’s not a comforting feeling.

I think I have said this many times. The clue lies in what the OP said.

In my department where I work majority agree with TLP demands not methods. This is the case with most other places Sorry killing them or arresting them would result in many taking militancy path

Zarvan no offence is the problem. He is Mr Average. They wear their religion on their sleeve. They regard the self appointed custodians of Islam as viceregents of Allah on earth. This means in cause of their blind faith they will be ready to die and destroy Pakistan. Between the Pakistani state and the self appointed custodians of Islam they will support the custodians like Rizvi.

Where am I ging with this. iIf the state ever used iron fist against the self appointed custodians of Islam their supporters[implicit or complicit] would join in as they would regard it as attack against Islam and they would think of themselves as warriors of Allah against the corrupt America/Jew stooge of a Pakistani state. When pushed hard the army migt dissolve or fall apart on the stress imposed on the soldiers of choosing between Allah and their officers.

Many might suggest the example of the war against TTP to disprove my theory. However despite few cases of desertion the army remained cohesive and after the APS attack it rallied around for fight to death against TTP. But people must keep in mind the TTP was predominantly restricted to the tribals areas of FATA and the army is not recruited from that region. In other words the fighting took place on the margins of Pakistan against a fringe group [tribal Pashtuns].

However the prssent problem with TLP involves the core areas of Pakistan and instead of being restricted to margins it diffused across Pakistan. Peshawar, Islamabad, Gujranwala, Lahore, Karachi the core areas of the country were effected. Taking on the TLP here could lead to widespread insurection striking at the very core of the country and cause the army to dissolve when people like Zarvan would tout the soldiers to defect - knowing that the average soldier would be also from the very same group and could be Zarvan's brother. The Mr Average.

This could lead to slippery slope to civil war. And that is why the state backed off because people at acutely aware of this.

 

[Path-Finder]

 

[Hassan90]

all this Army bashing sounds very familiar...where oh where have I heard this all before, hmm, let's see...
ABAY YAR...kahan thaa...yad kar GumNaam yar yad kar.

OH YES...just 2 years ago, when the ttp was beaten to a bloody pulp into nonexistance...

case in point and lesson learned? The Army will make sure that public gets a THOROUGH ARSE-WHOOPING at the hands of these terroristic dallah-mullas and then it will lay the smack down on them. This tlp is NOTHING compared to the ttp, not even worth their toe-nails. They'll be wiped out and thrown away like yesterday's eaten chicken bones but ONLY after the very public who jumped up and down on the emotional speeches of dallah-mullas gets a royal beating and humiliation at the hands of these dallah-mullahs.

You do know these tlp guys are right now working in close range of most high level ppl in Pakistan? They are the plumbers , bodyguards, major,captain Maybe even generals Unlike ttp which was just bombing everything left right centre these tlp guys will use targeted assessinations. That's why you heard kill that bajwa or that and that judge, ,, it will happen if things get out of the controle. This is pakistaN And We May DISLIKE MOLVIS but when it comes to honour of prophet almost 90 % of the public will follow them simply because molvis do have a right point.

 

[Zarvan]

I think I have said this many times. The clue lies in what the OP said.

Zarvan no offence is the problem. He is Mr Average. They wear their religion on their sleeve. They regard the self appointed custodians of Islam as viceregents of Allah on earth. This means in cause of their blind faith they will be ready to die and destroy Pakistan. Between the Pakistani state and the self appointed custodians of Islam they will support the custodians like Rizvi.

Where am I ging with this. iIf the state ever used iron fist against the self appointed custodians of Islam their supporters[implicit or complicit] would join in as they would regard it as attack against Islam and they would think of themselves as warriors of Allah against the corrupt America/Jew stooge of a Pakistani state. When pushed hard the army migt dissolve or fall apart on the stress imposed on the soldiers of choosing between Allah and their officers.

Many might suggest the example of the war against TTP to disprove my theory. However despite few cases of desertion the army remained cohesive and after the APS attack it rallied around for fight to death against TTP. But people must keep in mind the TTP was predominantly restricted to the tribals areas of FATA and the army is not recruited from that region. In other words the fighting took place on the margins of Pakistan against a fringe group [tribal Pashtuns].

However the prssent problem with TLP involves the core areas of Pakistan and instead of being restricted to margins it diffused across Pakistan. Peshawar, Islamabad, Gujranwala, Lahore, Karachi the core areas of the country were effected. Taking on the TLP here could lead to widespread insurection striking at the very core of the country and cause the army to dissolve when people like Zarvan would tout the soldiers to defect - knowing that the average soldier would be also from the very same group and could be Zarvan's brother. The Mr Average.

This could lead to slippery slope to civil war. And that is why the state backed off because people at acutely aware of this.

Yes he is not a big thing now because he is alive and talks bullcrap you kill him he becomes hero and you would see his followers taking Militancy path and trust me if not hundreds of thousands at least several thousand would join them

 

[Yaseen1]

I think agencies will silently assasinate tlp leadership like Samiulhaq as before his death he openly condemn judges decision on asia bibi case in public gathering

 

[Kabira]

Please, let us not simplify things too much here.

The TTP was pre-planned in certain capitals around the world, just like the ISIS was and still is being supported.

The Pakistan military has been under immense pressure since day one and they have tried their almost best to sail the seas among storms of all kinds, the worst being domestically rooted in corruption due to the utmost incompetence of the politic and bureaucratic class. The police and judiciary didn't make things easier for the rest of the state either.

The Red Mosque operation was an excuse used to the launch the TTP. Things could have been handled differently, for example by surrounding them and essentially starving them. They would have surrendered eventually as soon as the food would have run out. No mullah ever cared more than for his own interests and comforts. The Red Mosque operation was a big mistake and most likely was planned somewhere else. If you look at the geo-political environment at that time, the Pakistani State was being put under immense pressure. The mistake was made and the Pakistani establishment took the bait.

The TLP is nothing but the PMLN. You have remember that the PMLN has been headquartered outside Pakistan for more than a decade now. They have a strong support from certain sectors of this world because the PMLN is essentially an anti-state entity. The fact that the TLP was absolutely silent and didn't utter a word against the PMLN and never directly postured against the PMLN or Nawaz Sharif even after they essentially changed the Sacred Law.

No State ever allows corruption to be involved in dealings with its strongest and longest lasting allies and friends, especially when its survival is at stake. The PMLN did just that. They committed as much corruption they could get away with when it comes to the CPEC. The PMLN is essentially an actively wing pawn for certain powers that be who would like to see Pakistani state in a weakened positon.

Let us not play checkers when the anti-state elements are thinking 10 moves ahead in their game of chess.

I remember back then majority of average Pakistanis used to support TTP or give excuses for their killings. That slowly changed in following years. Political parties used lal masjid operation against Musharraf/army and gave militants free reign.

 

[GumNaam]

You do know these tlp guys are right now working in close range of most high level ppl in Pakistan? They are the plumbers , bodyguards, major,captain Maybe even generals Unlike ttp which was just bombing everything left right centre these tlp guys will use targeted assessinations. That's why you heard kill that bajwa or that and that judge, ,, it will happen if things get out of the controle. This is pakistaN And We May DISLIKE MOLVIS but when it comes to honour of prophet almost 90 % of the public will follow them simply because molvis do have a right point.

the same ttp claimed to fight for the honor of The Holy Prophet as well, from sawat to malakand to bajaur. They too had sympathizers across Pakistan working as plumbers and bodygaurds and what not. Rest assured, the Intel agencies have tabs on all of them. Just to show you an example of what the Intel agencies are capable of, all of the documents zardari had destroyed in switzerland, are actually already in the possession of these Intel agencies, all of the documents supposedly destroyed in all these "building fires" are still in the possession of these Intel agencies. Don't worry, they are awake and aware. There is a reason why the ISPR said that don't force us to do what the constitution allows us to do. Every single word from the ISPR is carefully thought and vented out before making any statements.

In the words of Fawad Chaudhry, in ko pata nahi chaley ga key in kay saath kia ho raha hay.

On a side note, I was reading a number of comments on youtube on the tlp press conference post "agreement"...everyone is actually calling these molvis cowards who ran away or sold out or succumbed to government pressures.


dono sides hi apnay leaderaan ko gaaliyan dey rahey hein!

the pro Imran Khan/CJP side is calling the government coward and sellouts...
the pro tlp side is calling the mullahs cowards and sellouts...

lakh di lanat yaar!

 

[Kabira]

Yes he is not a big thing now because he is alive and talks bullcrap you kill him he becomes hero and you would see his followers taking Militancy path and trust me if not hundreds of thousands at least several thousand would join them

You don't have to kill him. Just use force against violent protesters who are destroying vehicles on roads and arrest them.

TTP came in to being giving excuses for army operations in Lal Masjid and support to America. But now FATA have heavy army presence unlike before and border control is only getting better with time. TLP cannot turn in to TTP even if they wanted. Their supporters are mostly from main cities between Peshwar to Karachi, not easy place run militant camps. And with FATA secured TLP will not have any place to hide.

What they could do is try to target bigwigs politicians or even generals.

 

[Zarvan]

You don't have to kill him. Just use force against violent protesters who are destroying vehicles on roads and arrest them.

TTP came in to being giving excuses for army operations in Lal Masjid and support to America. But now FATA have heavy army presence unlike before and border control is only getting better with time. TLP cannot turn in to TTP even if they wanted. Their supporters are mostly from main cities between Peshwar to Karachi, not easy place run militant camps. And with FATA secured TLP will not have any place to hide.

What they could do is try to target bigwigs politicians or even generals.

When you have people who say their method is wrong but demands are right and that is pretty much half of the people in every department sorry using force could get really bad. I am amazed to see How some people fail to realize what kind of issue is this. Khatm e Nabuwat and this issue is the one which mostly brings people and sects together. Tomorrow GOD forbid if let say Mufti Rafi Usmani the main leader of Deobandis in Pakistan gets pissed and calls for blockage of all cities trust me the kind of manpower he would bring on roads in every city your Army just wishes to have that kind of power.

 

[Signalian]

People often say that establishment is responsible for TLP birth and they are secretly in bed with them. In my opinion this is not the case Hafiz Saeed and Masood Azhar are known to be establishment guys they could be and they could be not but never ever they have used such crap language against Army. Thing is the operation Army did in Lal Masjid and the power boost it gave to TTP and the war we faced for next 10 years and still facing is still in Army mind these operations and deaths of these people specially their leaders gives them boost. They are not like robbers or other criminals who after two slaps will beg for mercy. In my department where I work majority agree with TLP demands not methods. This is the case with most other places Sorry killing them or arresting them would result in many taking militancy path

What makes u think that Army or Establishment is doing nothing about TLP?
Would you like Army to invite you in GHQ and show you the plans for TLP?
Would you like ISI to include you in their plans about TLP?

Issue of Blasphemy has caused death of Salman taseer and made Qadri a martyr. Similarly, TLP wants "martyrdom status" for itself and the establishment insulted. Sensitive matters like this one cannot be dealt with one might blow. and 2007 lal masjid crisis is not comparable to this situation.

 

[LeGenD]

State seems to have surrendered and that’s not a comforting feeling.

Perhaps the state see something which distant observers do not?

Violent protests invoke emotions among all but somebody needs to understand the bigger picture. We are dealing with religio-political forces and these are very strong.

War On Terror is far from over, IMHO.

 

[CHACHA"G"]

So every thing wrong in Pakistan is , was done by Army ,,,,,, All failures are done by or caused by Army ….

Come on people grow up ,,,,,, don't be such a stupid , idiot …..

We have some thing call Police...……. Then we also have some thing Call "IB" ,, then all provinces have their own "IB" type agency …….. And guess what Police also have "CID" or "Special Intelligence Branch" ..
Why not use above force ……… Total 400,000 ………… ……. Why the fu*ck bring ISI and Army in every thing.
My questions are !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

1. 
   
   
   • Where is(was) Police Department ?
   • Where is(was) "IB"?
   • Where are(were) Punjab's local Intelligence Departments ?
   • Where is(were) Police's Intelligence wing and Special Branch ???
   • Where are(were) "other"20+ (non-military) Civil Intelligence Agencies and Departments ??? How many of them you know by Name????????
   • Where Is NAP(National Action Plan)??????????????????? And Implementation on NAP ???

Every one , , All (especially libits) and Army haters Please answer my Above 6 Questions !!!!! Very simple...…
@The Eagle , @Slav Defence , @Moonlight , @django , @Horus , @Zarvan , @DESERT FIGHTER , @Verve , @war&peace
Implications of Using Army every where (especially in this sensitive matter ) is hell different and dangerous then Using Police and Civil forces.

 

[war&peace]

So every thing wrong in Pakistan is , was done by Army ,,,,,, All failures are done by or caused by Army ….

Come on people grow up ,,,,,, don't be such a stupid , idiot …..

We have some thing call Police...……. Then we also have some thing Call "IB" ,, then all provinces have their own "IB" type agency …….. And guess what Police also have "CID" or "Special Intelligence Branch" ..
Why not use above force ……… Total 400,000 ………… ……. Why the fu*ck bring ISI and Army in every thing.
My questions are !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

1. 
   
   
   • Where is(was) Police Department ?
   • Where is(was) "IB"?
   • Where are(were) Punjab's local Intelligence Departments ?
   • Where is(were) Police's Intelligence wing and Special Branch ???
   • Where are(were) "other"20+ (non-military) Civil Intelligence Agencies and Departments ??? How many of them you know by Name????????
   • Where Is NAP(National Action Plan)??????????????????? And Implementation on NAP ???

Every one , , All (especially libits) and Army haters Please answer my Above 6 Questions !!!!! Very simple...…
@The Eagle , @Slav Defence , @Moonlight , @django , @Horus , @Zarvan , @DESERT FIGHTER , @Verve , @war&peace

Ideally, all the internal security issues should be dealt by using the police and other non-military security forces and agencies. That's a standard practice all over the world but our corrupt political elite has destroyed the police like all other civilian institution. They tried to do the same with the army as well but it was beyond their scope. Using army against the common masses is a recipe for a disaster. The nation stands behind the army so both should never come face to face.

 

[Peaceful Civilian]

Pakistan had the wildest Halloween party the world has ever seen. Hats off to party animal Khadim Rizvi

https://twitter.com/x/status/1058043251872153601

and Maulna pen di siri is a miscreant i.e con artist who is manipulating the youth of our country and using ashiq e rasool slogan to bring destruction and havoc in country

We should not abuse him. He just quote Ahadees , quran and what Islam says he just tells to public . While i agree he should use soft language.