Vietnam acknowledged Chinese sovereignty over South China Sea in 1958

[Peter]

if all of you would like to comment about invasion in 1979, make more thread, know that this is not thread for it.

Dear Chinese members, pls read my question and we will clear it, if there are not any comments or questions, for Pham Van Dong letter which signed in 1958, then we will close this thread....

So, Pham Van Dong - was he a liar or a traitor?

 

[Đảo Bạch Long Vỹ]

So, Pham Van Dong - was he a liar or a traitor?

A cheater China was cheated

 

[akittya]

A cheater China was cheated

Who is proud to be a cheater , who should be hit.


Ungrateful（Alias​​: Vietnamese）definition：
who promise something X belong to someone
but X is controlled by someone's enemy at then
who get something X from someone's enemy
who changed idea, say :" X should belong to me".

 

[Vietnam.Duong]

So, Pham Van Dong - was he a liar or a traitor?

Vietnam is small country, but we have a clever head. That why we still stand in front of you. If i was you , i would change China flag. We are never ashamed of our country....I am wondering who was stupid....

 

[Đảo Bạch Long Vỹ]

Who is proud to be a cheater , who should be hit.


Ungrateful（Alias​​: Vietnamese）definition：
who promise something X belong to someone
but X is controlled by someone's enemy at then
who get something X from someone's enemy
who changed idea, say :" X should belong to me".

I have answered you many many times. Not only South Vietnam have the sovereignty over Paracel, Viet Cong (Provisional Revolutionary Government of the Republic of South Vietnam) also have.
The Socialist Republic of Vietnam have sovereignty from Viet Cong, not from the victory of North Vietnam So North Vietnam never have any right over Paracel. Mr. Dong only can agree with Chinese 12 sea miles territory from land, not from the islands.

 

[akittya]

I have answered you many many times. Not only South Vietnam have the sovereignty over Paracel, Viet Cong (Provisional Revolutionary Government of the Republic of South Vietnam) also have.
The Socialist Republic of Vietnam have sovereignty from Viet Cong, not from the victory of North Vietnam So North Vietnam never have any right over Paracel. Mr. Dong only can agree with Chinese 12 sea miles territory from land, not from the islands.

I have answered you many many times
1 、So North Vietnam never have any right over Paracel---》》not need you get(because no one recognize you own these two islands.) but you can recognize our claim
2、Not only South Vietnam have the sovereignty over Paracel, Viet Cong (Provisional Revolutionary Government of the Republic of South Vietnam) also have-----》1977 Vietnamese coalition government still recognize this is a coalition government statement.

 

[Đảo Bạch Long Vỹ]

I have answered you many many times
So North Vietnam never have any right over Paracel---》》not need you get(because no one recognize you own these two islands.) but you can recognize our claim

As I said, in the PVD's diplomacy note, all he can recognize is Chinese 12 sea miles territory from land, not from the islands, because they don't have the right to talk about it. You only can say that "Vietnam recognized Chinese sovereignty" if only South Vietnam or Viet Cong (Provisional Revolutionary Government of the Republic of South Vietnam) recognized it. Too bad for you that both of them opposed it
Anyway, there is no more North Vietnam

 

[akittya]

As I said, in the PVD's diplomacy note, all he can recognize is Chinese 12 sea miles territory from land, not from the islands, because they don't have the right to talk about it. You only can say that "Vietnam recognized Chinese sovereignty" if only South Vietnam or Viet Cong (Provisional Revolutionary Government of the Republic of South Vietnam) recognized it. Too bad for you that both of them opposed it
Anyway, there is no more North Vietnam

china claim include two island
no one recognize South Vietnam or Viet Cong or north Vietnam own these two islands
1977 Vietnamese coalition government still recognize this is a coalition government statement.

 

[Đảo Bạch Long Vỹ]

china claim include two island
no one recognize South Vietnam or Viet Cong or north Vietnam own these two islands
1977 Vietnamese coalition government still recognize this is a coalition government statement.

"no one recognize South Vietnam or Viet Cong or north Vietnam own these two islands" -> Treaty of San Francisco 1951. No one opposed Vietnamese claim over Paracel and Spartly.
"1977 Vietnamese coalition government still recognize this is a coalition government statement" -> evidence????

 

[peaceful]

Anyway, there is no more North Vietnam

Our J-11B/J-1A fighters and Type-99A2 tanks can force vietnam to re-consider when necessary.

 

[Đảo Bạch Long Vỹ]

Our J-11B/J-1A fighters and Type-99A2 tanks can force vietnam to re-consider when necessary.

Too scary ... Ah... I will die ...

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Our J-11B/J-1A fighters and Type-99A2 tanks can force vietnam to re-consider when necessary.

The US shock and awe failed.

Now, what are these aircraft capable of that will better than US horror?

 

[happycanuck]

I have been reading the view point of individuals with Chinies flags and I can safely conclude that they have Chinies heritage. So let me ask you guys other than the so called agreement signed by than NORTH VIETNAM who did not have sovereignity over the Island in dispute therefore how can you claim that it is part of China.

It is like if your brother is the legal owner of a piece of land and you give a letter to your friend stating that you agree that land's legal ownership belongs to third party. This type of agreement has no validity in the International courts. If your country leadership is dreaming of walking all over the their neighbours to control the SCS than you are looking for dark days ahead of you.

Germany tried the same tactics and ended up completely demolished.
So do think before taking any aggressive step. Disputes can be resolved through talks to the benefit of all the nations in the region.

 

[Rechoice]

I have been reading the view point of individuals with Chinies flags and I can safely conclude that they have Chinies heritage. So let me ask you guys other than the so called agreement signed by than NORTH VIETNAM who did not have sovereignity over the Island in dispute therefore how can you claim that it is part of China.

It is like if your brother is the legal owner of a piece of land and you give a letter to your friend stating that you agree that land's legal ownership belongs to third party. This type of agreement has no validity in the International courts. If your country leadership is dreaming of walking all over the their neighbours to control the SCS than you are looking for dark days ahead of you.

Germany tried the same tactics and ended up completely demolished.
So do think before taking any aggressive step. Disputes can be resolved through talks to the benefit of all the nations in the region.

Thks for understanding.
Diplomat letter by Pham Van Dong informed that North Vietnam (from 17th Altitude up to Northward, not including two Island) respect to 12 miles of Coastline of China only.
Why China lies about the nature of letter ? Be course China don't have evidents to claim islands, which belong to Vietnam.

 

[akittya]

"no one recognize South Vietnam or Viet Cong or north Vietnam own these two islands" -> Treaty of San Francisco 1951. No one opposed Vietnamese claim over Paracel and Spartly.
"1977 Vietnamese coalition government still recognize this is a coalition government statement" -> evidence????

Treaty of San Francisco 1951. No one opposed Vietnamese claim over Paracel and Spartly.

Another way of saying that is no one admit you own these two islands, can you tell me ,who admit your claim??

- 1951 - September - Opening of the San Francisco Conference. China
was not represented.35

Mr Gromyko at the plenary meeting of 5 September proposed 13 amend-
ments. The first of these envisaged the recognition by Japan of the sover-
eignty of the Chinese People's Republic over the Paracels and other islands
further south. This amendment was rejected by 48 votes to 3.
On 7 September, the Prime Minister and Minister for Foreign Affairs of
the Vietnamese Government of Bao Dai solemnly declared that the two
archipelagos fell within Vietnamese territory. This declaration elicited no
comment from any delegate.
There was thus no precise attribution of the islands by agreement at the
end of this Conference. :

your can't use a no one recognize claim as a Excuse。

1977 Vietnamese coalition government still recognize this is a coalition government statement" -> evidence????

MEMORANDUM
Outlining Vice-Premier Li Xiannian's Talk
with Premier Pham Van Dong on June 10, 197 7

(3) On May 9, 1965 the Government of the Democratic Republic
of Viet Nam issued a statement with reference to the
designation by U.S. President Lyndon B, Johnson of the
"conbat zone" of the U.S. armed forces in Viet Nam,
recognizing the Xisha Islands as belonging to China. The
Vietnamese statement said:
"U.S. President Lyndon Johnson designated the whole of
Vietnam, and the adjacent waters which extend roughly
100 miles from the coast of Vietnam and part of the
territorial waters of the People's Republic of China
in its Xisha Islands as 'combat zone' of the United States
armed forces in direct threat to the security of
the Democratic JRopablic of Viet Nam and its neighbours...."

(4) When Vice-Premier Li Xiannian referred to this question,
Premier Pham Van Dong produced the untenable argument that:
"in the war of resistance we of course had to place resistance
to U.S. imperialism above everything else." "How should
one understand our statements including the one in my note
to Premier Zhou Enlai? One should understand it in the
context of the historical circumstances of the time."
Vice-Premier Li Xiannian promptly pointed out that this
explanation was not convincing. He said, the territorial
question between our two states should be dealt with
seriously, war could not justify a different interpretation,
and a serious attitude was called for. Moreover, there
was no war going on in Viet Nam when on September 14, 1958
Pham Van Dong, as the Premier of the Government of the
Democratic Republic of Viet Nam, acknowledged in his note
to Premier Zhou Enlai that the Xisha and Nansha Islands
are Chinese territory.

you can see when talk to these statement he said "we of course had to" 、”understand our statements “。
he not said “North Vietnam of course had to”、“understand North Vietnam statements”，mean these statement not only North Vietnam statements ,also coalition government's statements .

June 10, 1977，Vietnam already is a coalition government, Pham Van Dong is a Prime Minister of coalition government ,so his views behalf of the Vietnamese Government's views, "we"and "our" behalf of the Vietnamese Government.