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US Proposal to transfer MRAPs to Pakistan Exposes Kabul Rift

Gryphon

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FILE - U.S. Secretary of Defense Chuck Hagel stands next to MRAP vehicles after speaking to U.S. troops at Camp Bastion, Afghanistan, Dec. 8, 2013.

Ayaz Gul
March 21, 2014


ISLAMABAD — The United States is considering donating some of its 1200 mine-resistant ambush-protected vehicles known as MRAPs in Afghanistan to neighboring Pakistan after considering the high cost of transporting the vehicles out of the country when the NATO-led combat mission in Afghanistan formally comes to an end in December. However, the proposal has drawn strong opposition from authorities in Kabul, who say all of the equipment should remain in their country.

The excess equipment, worth billion of dollars, includes the heavily armored MRAPs that American military commanders believe will have limited strategic value after serving in the Afghan mission for over a decade.

The American commander of international forces in Afghanistan, General Josef Dunford, disclosed details of the proposed plans last week while testifying before U.S. Senate Armed Services Committee.

“It costs us little less than $10,000 to destroy an MRAP, it costs us somewhere between $50,000 and $100,000 to actually move that MRAP," he said. "If we wanted to give it to another country that country would have to accept the MRAPs as is where is. In other words they would have to pay for anything to get that vehicle serviceable again and also to move that vehicle to their country. We are looking at alternatives to provide these vehicles to partners to include Afghanistan, Pakistan and other partners that have participated in operations with us right now.”

Pakistani defense officials declined to discuss details of their talks with U.S. officials on the subject but say they would like to receive the MRAPs to better protect troops fighting domestic Taliban insurgents.

Outrage in Afghanistan

However, the U.S. proposed plans have outraged leaders and lawmakers in Afghanistan. They have accused Washington of violating its strategic partnership agreement with Kabul by offering the military equipment to Islamabad without consulting with the Afghan government.

Presidential spokesman Aimal Faizi says his country will strongly oppose any move to deliver the military hardware to Pakistan. He says Kabul was expecting coalition forces to leave it for the Afghan security forces.

Afghan media and some lawmakers have gone on to demand the U.S. immediately suspend any such talks with Pakistan, accusing Islamabad of sponsoring terrorism in their country.

Pakistani Foreign Ministry spokeswoman, Tasnim Aslam, says Afghan criticism is uncalled for, because of the steep sacrifices that Pakistan has made in fighting terrorism.

“Over 40,000 of our nationals including members of the security forces have rendered ultimate sacrifice in the fight against terrorism," she noted. "Any attempt to depict Pakistan as other than a victim of terrorism is a travesty and we completely reject it. It is disconcerting that such injurious statements are being made at a time when sincere efforts are under way to turn a new page in the bilateral relations with Afghanistan.”

The chairman of the Afghan Senate Foreign Affairs Committee, Arifullah Pashtun, says that the proposed U.S. plans have upset people in Afghanistan and he has conveyed these concerns to commanders of international forces. He tells VOA that American military officials assured him that while discussions are under way no final decision has been made to give the military equipment to Pakistan.

The Afghan senator says his country wants the equipment. He acknowledges that the International Security Assistance Force can transfer the military gear to any other country, including Pakistan, but says Afghanistan's needs should be addressed first.

US Proposal to Donate MRAPs to Pakistan Exposes Kabul Rift
 
Aahhhh our Afghan Brothers
do we need Afghan brothers who has a history of brother killing brother.
Next Time hear a Pakistani official saying "our Afghan brothers", I will ask whether his afghan father paid visit to Pakistan or his Pakistani mother visited Afghanistan once.
 
do those Afghan people really know how to operate these vehicles? in the end mullah omer will have few of these and he will be using them as safe bunker. lolz
 
On one hand, I don't give a damn what the Afghans want. Pakistan is in this situation because the Afghans don't know when to stop making ridiculous claims and demands. These vehicles would probably end up in the hands of the insurgents anyway, so there is little point in giving it to the ANA or ANP. Would they even be able to maintain the vehicles? They don't even have a military industry to look upon, whereas Pakistan would be able to provide maintenance to the systems it receives, because it would be able to get it's local military industry to take a look at the systems in question and look at ways to keep them operational (Pakistan's mirage fleet is a prime example of this sort of effort). Also, the Afghans can always go to their brotherly nation of India to provide them with similar types of vehicles.

On the other hand, I don't think it's a good idea to ignore the Afghan needs either (yes, I know what I said before). The fact is that the ANA does need such equipment to fight off their side of the insurgency, so I do think the US should at least provide a few dozen of these vehicles for at least their AN SpecFor. They won't be able to use them against Pakistan, because they're next to useless against a conventional force, so it wouldn't be a threat to Pakistan's military at all.

Now, I personally believe that Pakistan should at least get the US to set up a maintenance facility, or get legal permission to take the systems apart to see how it works and how they can maintain it themselves. The "as is" basis is something I don't agree with.
 
IMHO, Islamabad should accept the MRAPs; dismantle them, take all the metal to foundry and forge a long fence, then, Install it between Pakistan and Afghanistan. That will the best use of these vehicles as defence apparatus.
 
I feel sorry for these Afghan leaders, the only reason they might personally want an MRAP for themselves is when they decide to flee the country again, might need it to protect themselves from ambush while fleeing Kabul.

IMHO, Islamabad should accept the MRAPs; dismantle them, take all the metal to foundry and forge a long fence, then, Install it between Pakistan and Afghanistan. That will the best use of these vehicles as defence apparatus.

A moat would do, then a wall, and fill the moat with sharks.
 
Afghanistan is a puppet regime, it is shared by Iran and India and both hate Pak army from bottom their hearts.
They would never wish, any sort of MRV in use with Pakistani army.
While for US it does not make sense to ship back junk.

On the other hand, it is a matter of great dismay that Pakistan wasted its soldiers, just in hope that US would leave junk for us (Pakistan).

With all due respect, previous govt. should have ordered such vehicles in thousands by now, or preferably an assembly line would have been in production.
Don't even think it was impossible, because if Pervaiz Musharraf can setup JF-17 assembly line than why not MRV assembly line?

Clearly, it was not only the Kabul regime which was playing puppet, Mr. Zardari was very much part of the evil axis.

Again, today we stand at juncture, where MRV time has been long gone... now we need many squadrons of attack hellis not defensive MRV.

No MRV for Pakistani soldiers, after 10 years of WoT. tells the story of gross ineptness or total control of enemy over decision making process of Pakistan defense purchases or misplaced priorities.

Look at US, it moved its soldiers in theater... only when all ground facilities and tools were available, before.... it was plain and simple carpet bombing and northern alliance on ground, butchering Pashtoons, indiscriminately.
 
Afghanistan is a puppet regime, it is shared by Iran and India and both hate Pak army from bottom their hearts.
They would never wish, any sort of MRV in use with Pakistani army.
While for US it does not make sense to ship back junk.

On the other hand, it is a matter of great dismay that Pakistan wasted its soldiers, just in hope that US would leave junk for us (Pakistan).

With all due respect, previous govt. should have ordered such vehicles in thousands by now, or preferably an assembly line would have been in production.
Don't even think it was impossible, because if Pervaiz Musharraf can setup JF-17 assembly line than why not MRV assembly line?

Clearly, it was not only the Kabul regime which was playing puppet, Mr. Zardari was very much part of the evil axis.

Again, today we stand at juncture, where MRV time has been long gone... now we need many squadrons of attack hellis not defensive MRV.

No MRV for Pakistani soldiers, after 10 years of WoT. tells the story of gross ineptness or total control of enemy over decision making process of Pakistan defense purchases or misplaced priorities.

I agree, these couldn't have come soon enough.

But the problem all goes back to economy. The military is responsible for what it provides for our boys on the ground.
The government is responsible for managing the economy, to raise the revenue for defence expenditure in line with the given threat. We are responsible for installing those governments, putting pressure on them to make them work. The blame goes back to us, everytime, the Pakistani people.

We are an extremely lucky nation to have such brave souls fight and die for their country, while their country is thankless, desensitized, confused and in disarray. Very few nations would have soldiers with this sort of fighting spirit given the odds. The rest of the world wonders why the army in Pakistan is so lovingly adored, it should be clear why it is so.
 
But the problem all goes back to economy
Sorry, we can spent money on dance parties, foreign trips, renovation of Iftikhar ch.'s retirement house, his son's casino trips, life time pension for all retired PPP govt. but no money for MRP?
I hope you know a mujra for PPP minister cost $1 million and in 5 year liberal rule, I believe there's no count for million$ mujra parties.
We could levy transit tax.. we could stop Indian and Iranian smuggling.
You are not in Pakistan, but every single store is full Indian stuff.... cosmetics, shampoos, even ciggerets are faked in India and later smuggled to Pakistan.
Sorry, this is not the topic but the evidence of institutional rape of economy... which went from $=40pkr to $=104pkr.
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IMHO, Islamabad should accept the MRAPs; dismantle them, take all the metal to foundry and forge a long fence, then, Install it between Pakistan and Afghanistan. That will the best use of these vehicles as defence apparatus.
:tup:
This is the best use of those MRAPs. and definitely goes against the doctrine of cutting Pakistan in two halves, which is in its final stages of execution.
 
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The rest of the world wonders why the army in Pakistan is so lovingly adored, it should be clear why it is so.
They are not wondering, they know exactly why...... and it was stupid of Pakistan to think that they would sit quite on it, once they know it.
Media, judiciary, asma jehangir, ayesha sadiqa, marvi memon, etc.. all are the various antidotes for nation's love fever with army.
 
GET THEM ASAP..

For the retarded haters... i found this pic:

View attachment 21993
Yea right.... go get them... wait a minute first let me wish you happy birthday and than ask, to whom are you passing orders?
The picture, you posted is from Karachi... where CoAS should have never agreed to send forces without authority.
In Karachi we need to tame down the judiciary, media and marvi memon before TTP.
As i said, today... IMO, is too late fir MRV... we need attack helis and troops on foot at the required place at the required time with aerial protection... isn't this the basic rule of marching forward, into army territory?
We need to surround the terrorists in wide voids no need to waste time and money on MRV or F-16.

This is what we need:
cgi+kit+tool+armed+Chinese+Z-10+Attack+Helicopter+gunship+PLA+Peoples+Liberation+Army+Air+Force+export+pakitan+missile+hj10+atgm+rocket+(1).jpg


not this:
aptopix-afghanistan-us-junk.jpeg-1280x960.jpg
 
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Yea right.... go get them... wait a minute first let me wish you happy birthday and than ask, to whom are you passing orders?
The picture, you posted is from Karachi... where CoAS should have never agreed to send forces without authority.
In Karachi we need to tame down the judiciary, media and marvi memon before TTP.
As i said, today... IMO, is too late fir MRV... we need attack helis and troops on foot at the required place at the required time with aerial protection... isn't this the basic rule of marching forward, into army territory?
We need to surround the terrorists in wide voids no need to waste time and money on MRV or F-16.

This is what we need:
cgi+kit+tool+armed+Chinese+Z-10+Attack+Helicopter+gunship+PLA+Peoples+Liberation+Army+Air+Force+export+pakitan+missile+hj10+atgm+rocket+(1).jpg


not this:
aptopix-afghanistan-us-junk.jpeg-1280x960.jpg

Every MRAP cost $1 million each if im not wrong, and Pakistan will get 1200 of them. Its game changer for PA, terrorists now will have to face Pak army if they want to kill them instead of IED bomb blasts.
 
Yea right.... go get them... wait a minute first let me wish you happy birthday and than ask, to whom are you passing orders?
The picture, you posted is from Karachi... where CoAS should have never agreed to send forces without authority.
In Karachi we need to tame down the judiciary, media and marvi memon before TTP.
As i said, today... IMO, is too late fir MRV... we need attack helis and troops on foot at the required place at the required time with aerial protection... isn't this the basic rule of marching forward, into army territory?
We need to surround the terrorists in wide voids no need to waste time and money on MRV or F-16.

Not true. Taking over any area will involve two major steps 1) Acquisition 2) consolidation. Once we have taken over the area our boys will need to consolidate it with regular patrols, troop movements and hunting out the splintered pockets of fleeing fighters, and this consolidation period will be a lot longer and cumbersome than the actual assault. While we will require the helis for the assault we will need these MRAPs for the assault and then also for the consolidation period. Look at the areas that we have already cleared, we still need MRAPs there. We have lost more men to IEDs and ambushes than actual fighting and we are still loosing more. Even after expelling all these bastards out of our country we will still need patrols to make sure they keep themselves on the other side of the Durand line. So for a very long time to come it will still be the time for the MRAP.

Its insanely unfair that we still ask our men to go into these areas in those tin pickup trucks.
 
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