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Considering electric cars are going to be taking over our roads soon I'm not sure what the purpose of taking over the world oil industry is going to accomplish.

View attachment 499223
From where are you going to make electricity ? Electricity will be produced by power plants ... Solar energy is not available in all part of the world and output is very low ...

Furthermore, its not just car but all the machineries and other transport vehicles ...
 
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the only way left for u.s to compete china is to develop industrial undertaking in new Islands and bring cheap labor from africa and asia and train them.this will reduce labor costs otherwise if they form industry in u.s due to high minimum wage the products are expensive and cannot compete china
From where are you going to make electricity ? Electricity will be produced by power plants ... Solar energy is not available in all part of the world and output is very low ...

Furthermore, its not just car but all the machineries and other transport vehicles ...
 
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From where are you going to make electricity ? Electricity will be produced by power plants

For the US the amount from oil for electrical power generation is negligible:

https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=31232
"Roughly 70% of petroleum-fired electric generating capacity that still exists today was constructed prior to 1980. Utility-scale generators that reported petroleum as their primary fuel comprised only 3% of total electric generating capacity at the end of 2016 and produced less than 1% of total electricity generation during 2016."

Plus the world has a downward trend for using oil for electricity:
https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/EG.ELC.PETR.ZS?end=2015&start=1973&view=chart

[World] Electricity production from oil sources (% of total)

Screen Shot 2018-09-16 at 5.14.14 AM.jpg



https://www.businessinsider.com/these-are-the-countries-that-get-the-most-power-from-oil-2015-3
Here are the countries that generate most of their power from oil

"The Middle East, Caribbean, and Central America get the most power in their countries from oil.
...
In other places in the world, there's less of a direct relationship because power generation comes from various other sources: coal, natural gas, biofuels, etc."

Screen Shot 2018-09-16 at 5.24.39 AM.jpg


Solar energy is not available in all part of the world and output is very low .

True, but luckily the vast majority of the countries in the above list (other than Japan) are in "high sun" areas.

Furthermore, its not just car but all the machineries and other transport vehicles ...

Only planes, ships, and established freight trains will be hard to convert. Everything else like trucks and buses is moving to electric quickly.
 
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For the US the amount from oil for e itlectrical power generation is negligible:

https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=31232
"Roughly 70% of petroleum-fired electric generating capacity that still exists today was constructed prior to 1980. Utility-scale generators that reported petroleum as their primary fuel comprised only 3% of total electric generating capacity at the end of 2016 and produced less than 1% of total electricity generation during 2016."

Plus the world has a downward trend for using oil for electricity:
https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/EG.ELC.PETR.ZS?end=2015&start=1973&view=chart

[World] Electricity production from oil sources (% of total)

View attachment 499238


https://www.businessinsider.com/these-are-the-countries-that-get-the-most-power-from-oil-2015-3
Here are the countries that generate most of their power from oil

"The Middle East, Caribbean, and Central America get the most power in their countries from oil.
...
In other places in the world, there's less of a direct relationship because power generation comes from various other sources: coal, natural gas, biofuels, etc."

View attachment 499239



True, but luckily the vast majority of the countries in the above list (other than Japan) are in "high sun" areas.



Only planes, ships, and established freight trains will be hard to convert. Everything else like trucks and buses is moving to electric quickly.
Man you have no idea how the world economy and finances are working...

What will happen to Pakistan if US impose an embargo on Pakistan for oil purchase ... No OPEC country can sell oil other than dollar and dollar payments will not be allowed by US then how long will Pakistan's economy survive?

Take another example, you are purchasing oil from Iran but due to sanctions on iran you cannot pay them not in dollars and not in kind ...

If you being US will you let go this leverage over the countries whose economy is dependant on oil ?

I was talking about world dominance through controling oil industry and you are talking about oil consumption ...

Man you have no idea of world economy and finance so stop commenting on something which you dont understand ...
 
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No OPEC country can sell oil other than dollar and dollar payments will not be allowed by US then how long will Pakistan's economy survive?

Nope. Venezuela is a member of OPEC and doesn't accept dollars. Iran supposedly too. The rest of OPEC could do the same tomorrow. There's nothing stopping them all from switching to the Euro.

The dollar is currently used not because oil companies HAVE to. It's used to stabilize accounting procedures. Using a SINGLE liquid hard currency allows them to not have to worry about currency fluctuations for payments. If they signed a contract with Pakistan for $1B Pakistani Rupees and the value of it slid compared to their other contracts they'd have lost money. If they stick with one currency everything stays constant. They know what their budget is, what their profits will be, etc. A hard currency that is liquid is preferred as they can immediately use that money to buy needed equipment, etc.

The Euro could easily be substituted for the dollar. At least two OPEC countries have done it.

Of course using multiple currencies can be done too if they don't care about currency fluctuations.

Take another example, you are purchasing oil from Iran but due to sanctions on iran you cannot pay them not in dollars and not in kind ...

They already said they don't want dollars so I don't see the issue. Pay them in what they want.

hvnt1.jpg


If you being US will you let go this leverage over the countries whose economy is dependant on oil ?

I was talking about world dominance through controling oil industry and you are talking about oil consumption ....

If we actually controlled the oil industry there wouldn't be super rich middle eastern oil countries who own large stakes in many of the top companies of the world.

Man you have no idea of world economy and finance so stop commenting on something which you dont understand ...

Ditto.
 
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Nope. Venezuela is a member of OPEC and doesn't accept dollars. Iran supposedly too. The rest of OPEC could do the same tomorrow. There's nothing stopping them all from switching to the Euro.

The dollar is currently used not because oil companies HAVE to. It's used to stabilize accounting procedures. Using a SINGLE liquid hard currency allows them to not have to worry about currency fluctuations for payments. If they signed a contract with Pakistan for $1B Pakistani Rupees and the value of it slid compared to their other contracts they'd have lost money. If they stick with one currency everything stays constant. They know what their budget is, what their profits will be, etc. A hard currency that is liquid is preferred as they can immediately use that money to buy needed equipment, etc.

The Euro could easily be substituted for the dollar. At least two OPEC countries have done it.

Of course using multiple currencies can be done too if they don't care about currency fluctuations.



They already said they don't want dollars so I don't see the issue. Pay them in what they want.

hvnt1.jpg




If we actually controlled the oil industry there wouldn't be super rich middle eastern oil countries who own large stakes in many of the top companies of the world.



Ditto.
Yes go and read what happen to dollar in 1971.

Go and read which agreement took place between US and KSA in 1974.

Go and read what was the value of dollar and economy of us between 1971 and 1974.

Answere me what happened to Saddam and Qaddafi that offerred to sale oil other than in dollars ...

If iran can sell oil in other item than dollar then why dont you pay them in barter transaction on a regular basis ?

What you are stating are your opinion in reality there is an agreement between US and Saudia being followed by all GCC countries to sell oil in dollars and anybody going against this faces the heat ... be it iraq, iran or libya ....Venezvella start selling oil in yuan only last year and its economy already collapsing ...

Go and search the term petro dollars and you will find hundreds of research papers that will be consistent with my statements and not yours ...

The same US economy that was collapsing due to raised oil prices in 1973 starts gaining traction in 1974 despite of even more increase in prices ...

How difficult is to understand for a person wirh common sense that in order to buy oil you need dollars and for that you need to sell something to US ... So if i have to buy oil, first i have to sell wheat to us in exchange of a paper only and from that paper you buy oil ... As the currency is in continous circulation outside US but what will happen if there is no more requirement of US dollars then all this dollar will be going back to US ... So will US be able to peovide that many value of goods or services ?

US dollar is nothing but a promissory note by US central bank ... If you have even basic understanding of world financial systems and how currency notes work then just check for the size of US economy and the total quantity of dollars in circulation ...

However, i know you will still keep on arguing without any knowledge of the subject so i am replying you no more ...

Just wait and watch ... Its a matter of time only when the world financial syst will collapse along with the us economy ...

By the way your statement about currency is hillarious ... As the currencies of the country selling oil are not dollars ... So if your argument is true then payment of oil could have been done in riyal or dirham or dinar ... What us dollar has to do with gcc ?
 
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How difficult is to understand for a person wirh common sense that in order to buy oil you need dollars

India pays 45% of Iran oil with rupees the rest in Euros

India seeks to pay $6.5 billion to Iran for oil imports
By
Dipanjan Roy Chaudhury
, ET Bureau|
Updated: May 16, 2016, 04.21 AM IST

NEW DELHI: India has approached Turkey's Halkbank to facilitate the payment of $6.5 billion (about Rs 43,400 crore) it owed to Iran for the crude oil imported when western sanctions were in place on Tehran, an Iranian news agency reported.

“The Indian government is seeking to pay the $6.5-billion debt and is looking to prepare the banking activities. The receiving bank for this money will be Turkey's Halkbank, and the money will be paid in euros,” news agency Fars quoted Indian Ambassador .. Saurabh Kumar as saying in Tehran. Iran has been demanding faster payment of oil dues and in euros. India has put the process into motion ahead of Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s May 22-23 trip to Iran.

During his recent visit, Oil Minister Dharmendra Pradhan had told Iranian officials that India was committed to making the payment as and when banking channels, acceptable to both were available. Mangalore Refinery & Petrochemicals, Essar OilNSE -0.04 %, Hindustan Petroleum, HPCLMittal Energy and Indian Oil had imported Iranian oil when the sanctions were in place. At that time, India made 45% of the payments in the rupee.

The arrears were to be paid when the banking channels started working for Iran. Although most of the sanctions are now lifted, Iranian banks are yet to be integrated into the global banking system, making payment still a problem. According to sources here, Iran plans to utilise the $6.5 billion to boost its domestic infrastructure besides investments in the energy sector.

Iran says it needs $200 billion worth investments for its energy sector. During Modi’s visit, India is looking to boost its energy partnership with Iran. After China, India is the second largest importer of Iranian oil and it started buying additional oil post sanctions. The figure reached 5,00,000 barrels per day (bpd) this March, the highest by India from Iran in five years.

India is keen to purchase more from Iran and the PM's visit will focus on this, besides initial pacts on Oil & Natural Gas Corp’s participation in Iran’s Farzad-B gas field and investment in exploration of more fields and downstream sectors, as well as a gas pricing formula.

Read more at:
//economictimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/52285579.cms?utm_source=contentofinterest&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=cppst
..


China Completes First Physical Delivery For Crude Futures
By JLC - Sep 12, 2018, 2:00 PM CDT
a579b981bf80d9faf13c19cde9619cd8.jpg

China concluded the first physical settlement of the Shanghai crude futures contract (SC crude contract) on September 7, 2018, indicating that the newly launched contract has undergone all the trading processes, the Shanghai Futures Exchange said on its official website on September 10.

A total of 601,000 barrels was delivered via the first front-month crude contract on the Shanghai International Energy Exchange (INE), a branch of the Shanghai Futures Exchange, at a settlement price of CNY488.2/bbl ($71.57/bbl). The total value reached CNY293 million on a unilateral basis.

SC crude futures will better serve the physical market

The successful delivery indicates that the Chinese crude futures have passed the market test and are well accepted among industrial participants. It provides a reliable reference for the forthcoming contracts to keep liquid and develop, and will attract more industrial participants, ranging from oil companies and refiners to traders, to use the financial tool to lock in prices for their future physical cargoes.

The delivery process, as an important link between futures and spot cargoes, helps realize the convergence of futures prices and spot prices. The smooth process had set a good example to the subsequent contract trading, participants in the delivery commented.

Some state-run oil companies were heard to have signed long-term crude contracts with overseas suppliers, priced against SC crude futures and in renminbi. The SC crude futures have already begun to reflect physical supply and demand fundamentals and are expected to better serve the real economy.

SC crude futures are gaining momentum

The SC crude futures have already showed strong development momentum though it is only five months since the launch.

As of August 31, INE crude contracts had recorded a total trading volume of 11.09 million lots, valued at CNY 5.39 trillion, and an average daily position of 14,800 lots, replacing DME Oman crude futures as the world’s third largest crude futures contract.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Crude-Oil/China-Completes-First-Physical-Delivery-For-Crude-Futures.html

the only way left for u.s to compete china is to develop industrial undertaking in new Islands and bring cheap labor from africa and asia and train them.

We are at the beginning of another manufacturing revolution. Products will be manufactured by robots and automated systems. AI will also oil this revolution and guess which country is leading in this sphere. China too is is trying to catch up. What will happen to cheap wage countries who can offer nothing more than cheap labour.

And for the moron who says payment for oil can only be in dollars

September, 17 2018
India to Revive Rupee Payment for Iran Oil Imports
Sunday, June 24, 2018
India to Revive Rupee Payment for Iran Oil Imports

India is looking to revive a rupee trade mechanism to settle part of its oil payments to Iran, fearing foreign channels to pay Tehran might choke under pressure from US sanctions, two government sources said.

During a previous round of sanctions, India devised a barter-like scheme acceptable to Washington to allow it to make some oil payments to Tehran in rupees through a small state bank.

Iran used the funds to import goods from India, Reuters reported.
“We are looking at reviving rupee mechanism ... We have to prepare ourselves,” one of the sources told Reuters, adding that the current payment mechanism might not work from November.


A commerce ministry official said India’s central bank had yet to decide on moving back to the rupee payment mechanism.

In May, US President Donald Trump withdrew from a 2015 nuclear accord with Iran and ordered the reimposition of US sanctions.

Some US sanctions take effect from Aug. 6 while those, notably affecting the oil sector, will be effective from Nov. 4.

Refiners in India currently use State Bank of India and Germany-based Europaeisch-Iranische Handelsbank AG to buy Iranian oil in euros, according to IOC and other companies.

SBI, India’s top banker, has written to the Indian refiners and the government to say it would not be able to handle oil payments to Iran from Nov. 4, an official at SBI said.

India refiners receive a 60-day credit period for payments to Iran, suggesting oil imports from Iran could be hit from August.

The Indian government has not asked its refiners to cut Iranian oil imports, but some firms have started reducing purchases from Tehran.

“So far we don’t know what we are expected to do. We have not asked refiners to cut imports,” the source said, adding that an official meeting between India and the United States to discuss Iran sanctions had not yet taken place.

An Indian delegation visited officials and bankers in France, Germany, Britain and Brussels, the base for the European Union, to find alternative payment routes, the source said, adding that it would be “almost impossible to use European banks for payment to Iran”.

Restarting the rupee payment mechanism would help fix a trade balance that favors Iran.

https://financialtribune.com/articl...-iran-oil-imports?utm_campaign=more-like-this
 
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And for the moron who says payment for oil can only be in dollars

It's useless to talk with him.
Apparently if a country offered an OPEC country gold bars at a 5% over the value of the dollar for oil they WON"T do it because it MUST be in dollars. Oh yeah right. How about a stack of Euros 5% over premium. Apparently not either..yeah right they'd take it in a second.
 
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India pays 45% of Iran oil with rupees the rest in Euros

India seeks to pay $6.5 billion to Iran for oil imports
By
Dipanjan Roy Chaudhury
, ET Bureau|
Updated: May 16, 2016, 04.21 AM IST

NEW DELHI: India has approached Turkey's Halkbank to facilitate the payment of $6.5 billion (about Rs 43,400 crore) it owed to Iran for the crude oil imported when western sanctions were in place on Tehran, an Iranian news agency reported.

“The Indian government is seeking to pay the $6.5-billion debt and is looking to prepare the banking activities. The receiving bank for this money will be Turkey's Halkbank, and the money will be paid in euros,” news agency Fars quoted Indian Ambassador .. Saurabh Kumar as saying in Tehran. Iran has been demanding faster payment of oil dues and in euros. India has put the process into motion ahead of Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s May 22-23 trip to Iran.

During his recent visit, Oil Minister Dharmendra Pradhan had told Iranian officials that India was committed to making the payment as and when banking channels, acceptable to both were available. Mangalore Refinery & Petrochemicals, Essar OilNSE -0.04 %, Hindustan Petroleum, HPCLMittal Energy and Indian Oil had imported Iranian oil when the sanctions were in place. At that time, India made 45% of the payments in the rupee.

The arrears were to be paid when the banking channels started working for Iran. Although most of the sanctions are now lifted, Iranian banks are yet to be integrated into the global banking system, making payment still a problem. According to sources here, Iran plans to utilise the $6.5 billion to boost its domestic infrastructure besides investments in the energy sector.

Iran says it needs $200 billion worth investments for its energy sector. During Modi’s visit, India is looking to boost its energy partnership with Iran. After China, India is the second largest importer of Iranian oil and it started buying additional oil post sanctions. The figure reached 5,00,000 barrels per day (bpd) this March, the highest by India from Iran in five years.

India is keen to purchase more from Iran and the PM's visit will focus on this, besides initial pacts on Oil & Natural Gas Corp’s participation in Iran’s Farzad-B gas field and investment in exploration of more fields and downstream sectors, as well as a gas pricing formula.

Read more at:
//economictimes.indiatimes.com/articleshow/52285579.cms?utm_source=contentofinterest&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=cppst
..


China Completes First Physical Delivery For Crude Futures
By JLC - Sep 12, 2018, 2:00 PM CDT
a579b981bf80d9faf13c19cde9619cd8.jpg

China concluded the first physical settlement of the Shanghai crude futures contract (SC crude contract) on September 7, 2018, indicating that the newly launched contract has undergone all the trading processes, the Shanghai Futures Exchange said on its official website on September 10.

A total of 601,000 barrels was delivered via the first front-month crude contract on the Shanghai International Energy Exchange (INE), a branch of the Shanghai Futures Exchange, at a settlement price of CNY488.2/bbl ($71.57/bbl). The total value reached CNY293 million on a unilateral basis.

SC crude futures will better serve the physical market

The successful delivery indicates that the Chinese crude futures have passed the market test and are well accepted among industrial participants. It provides a reliable reference for the forthcoming contracts to keep liquid and develop, and will attract more industrial participants, ranging from oil companies and refiners to traders, to use the financial tool to lock in prices for their future physical cargoes.

The delivery process, as an important link between futures and spot cargoes, helps realize the convergence of futures prices and spot prices. The smooth process had set a good example to the subsequent contract trading, participants in the delivery commented.

Some state-run oil companies were heard to have signed long-term crude contracts with overseas suppliers, priced against SC crude futures and in renminbi. The SC crude futures have already begun to reflect physical supply and demand fundamentals and are expected to better serve the real economy.

SC crude futures are gaining momentum

The SC crude futures have already showed strong development momentum though it is only five months since the launch.

As of August 31, INE crude contracts had recorded a total trading volume of 11.09 million lots, valued at CNY 5.39 trillion, and an average daily position of 14,800 lots, replacing DME Oman crude futures as the world’s third largest crude futures contract.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Crude-Oil/China-Completes-First-Physical-Delivery-For-Crude-Futures.html



We are at the beginning of another manufacturing revolution. Products will be manufactured by robots and automated systems. AI will also oil this revolution and guess which country is leading in this sphere. China too is is trying to catch up. What will happen to cheap wage countries who can offer nothing more than cheap labour.

And for the moron who says payment for oil can only be in dollars

September, 17 2018
India to Revive Rupee Payment for Iran Oil Imports
Sunday, June 24, 2018
India to Revive Rupee Payment for Iran Oil Imports

India is looking to revive a rupee trade mechanism to settle part of its oil payments to Iran, fearing foreign channels to pay Tehran might choke under pressure from US sanctions, two government sources said.

During a previous round of sanctions, India devised a barter-like scheme acceptable to Washington to allow it to make some oil payments to Tehran in rupees through a small state bank.

Iran used the funds to import goods from India, Reuters reported.
“We are looking at reviving rupee mechanism ... We have to prepare ourselves,” one of the sources told Reuters, adding that the current payment mechanism might not work from November.


A commerce ministry official said India’s central bank had yet to decide on moving back to the rupee payment mechanism.

In May, US President Donald Trump withdrew from a 2015 nuclear accord with Iran and ordered the reimposition of US sanctions.

Some US sanctions take effect from Aug. 6 while those, notably affecting the oil sector, will be effective from Nov. 4.

Refiners in India currently use State Bank of India and Germany-based Europaeisch-Iranische Handelsbank AG to buy Iranian oil in euros, according to IOC and other companies.

SBI, India’s top banker, has written to the Indian refiners and the government to say it would not be able to handle oil payments to Iran from Nov. 4, an official at SBI said.

India refiners receive a 60-day credit period for payments to Iran, suggesting oil imports from Iran could be hit from August.

The Indian government has not asked its refiners to cut Iranian oil imports, but some firms have started reducing purchases from Tehran.

“So far we don’t know what we are expected to do. We have not asked refiners to cut imports,” the source said, adding that an official meeting between India and the United States to discuss Iran sanctions had not yet taken place.

An Indian delegation visited officials and bankers in France, Germany, Britain and Brussels, the base for the European Union, to find alternative payment routes, the source said, adding that it would be “almost impossible to use European banks for payment to Iran”.

Restarting the rupee payment mechanism would help fix a trade balance that favors Iran.

https://financialtribune.com/articl...-iran-oil-imports?utm_campaign=more-like-this

If this is such a routine then why making headlines ? Why India has to do so many efforts to pay iran in anything other than dollarand why iran is having sanctions despite of having surrendered all its nuclear facilities ... You are referring to one of cases which are result of other part of the world that are trying to turn table as norm ...

Goodluck with living in dream world ... But the day majority of oil starts trading in currency other than dollar and us dollar status as world reserves currency changes then us will no longer be world economic power ...
 
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You claimed ALL oil trade is done in dollars. I just gave you an example of 2 countries that use their own currency.
In a one of a transaction,,,

You guys don't know the basic principle of economics that you follow the trend and not the exceptions...

On few occasions Pakistan gets free oil of deferred term basis oil from KSA, so can you say oil is available free and on credit?

China is also trying to use Yuan as the currency of international trade ... So does this means dollar is no more currency of international trade?

In case of Iran, you had no option as there were financial restrictions on payments to Iran and you are trying your level best to find an alternate mechanism and its is taking a tough troll on you ... If such a mechanism exist then why it is taking so much efforts to find an alternate mode?

In macro economics you ignore the exception as otherwise you wil never be able to a trend as in a huge world there will always be exception to the rules but to understand the trends and to predict the future you have to iron out exceptions and concentrate on trend and then you population is always without exceptions ...
 
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Not one transaction. In case of China tens of billion dollars worth and in case of India during all US sanction phases. Future payments from India will be in rupees if Iran wants to continue exporting oil to India. China and India are number 1 and number 2 importers of Iranian oil in the world.
Its treble than the rest of the world put together for Iranian oil.

But you said ALL
 
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With 800 billion dollars of annual export (excluding local consumption in the country of production) how much it was traded in currency other than dollars?

Can you please share the annual ratio ?
 
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