The First Indian attempt at ASAT failed in February 2019

[The wheel of time]

Read slowly.

The First Indian attempt at ASAT failed in February 2019

The last one was our only first attempt which was successful, there were not previous attempts. we possessed this capability since 2008 only showcased it now, If we can put a satellite in the geostationary or polar orbit we can knock out one also. Plain and simple.

 

[The wheel of time]

@waz Merge this thread here:
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/the-first-indian-attempt-at-asat-failed-in-february-2019.611423/

No need to merge in fake propaganda post, this is a separate thread that has nothing to do with the one that you mentioned.

 

[The Deterrent]

No need to merge in fake propaganda post, this is a separate thread that has nothing to do with the one that you mentioned.

Nobody said that the ASAT test of March 27 was a failure. Rather, by all accounts, it was a resounding success.

The "fake propaganda post" is backed by publicly available evidence, and is about a possible failed attempt on February 12.

 

[zulu]

@Dubious @The Eagle kindly merge this thread into this
https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/the-first-indian-attempt-at-asat-failed-in-february-2019.611423/

 

[The Deterrent]

All right. It was a mistake. 26 and 27th February was still in my mind.

Now on the point. If our mission failed one and half month ago and we succeeded in 42 days, how do you rate it.

Don't bring that who sends people to space and back. It's not a big deal. Had had this on our priority list, we had done it a long ago. Address the main issue.

There is no "rating" without a rating system based on standards. In words, I'd say that was good enough.

So according to you, sending people to space and bringing them back alive is NOT a big deal. But ASAT is.
Time for bed, princess #1.

The last one was our only first attempt which was successful, there were not previous attempts. we possessed this capability since 2008 only showcased it now, If we can put a satellite in the geostationary or polar orbit we can knock out one also. Plain and simple.

Read the article slowly and completely, princess #2.

 

[SrNair]

I wouldn't theorize that without a lot of more evidence, however it does seem like this election is witnessing an unprecedented amount of politicizing of India's Armed Forces and its military prowess by the current government, for electoral gains.

Same happened before in 1971.

Modi is just delivering the promise he offered us .
Thats all.

Again, have you read the entire post?



Again, it is not about exemption or a technicality. Why did Modi feel the need to order an ASAT test close to elections, make a pompous codename for the test, and then brag about it? Don't you think that the Indian military prowess is being exploited for short-term electoral gains?


I've held the same view as many other third parties: Technically, this test had less to do with developing deployable ASATs, and more with verifying BMD's parameters in exoatmospheric domain...along-with achieving political objectives.

DRDO now has a somewhat proven seeker, capable of mid-course interception of ballistic non-maneuverable objects. What remains to be developed is a cost-effective and canisterized rocket motor for the seeker (K-4 is an overkill). Perhaps the proposed Agni-IP's motor will be used for this purpose.

I'll doubt the effectiveness of any ABM unless it is trialed against a BM with an actual RV (representative of the rival's capabilities), for example the Israeli Silver Sparrow. The day DRDO trials its BMD against Agni-I/II (or a representative system), I'll be convinced that Pakistani Shaheen-I/II/Ghauri/Ababeel are at risk. The day DRDO trials its BMD against a mid-course maneuvering RV of Agni-III (or a representative system), I'll be convinced that Shaheen-IA/Shaheen-III are at risk.

Nope.
Have you seen an interview of our NSA in youtube ?
You will get the answer there.
There was a chance of perception management issues by PR circles particularly by Western media outlet .
In 2012 when Saraswat said the same ,the western experts said that it is just a paper tiger no proven tech .
So this time by using the power of PM he declared by himself to clear if someone have any doubts .
This development will not affect elections

A dangerous precedent for the future of India

No need of conspiracy theories.
There is no dangerous precedent here

 

[randomradio]

Standard satellite build time for a TARGET satellite must be significantly less.

This wasn't an ISRO built satellite, it was built by DRDO.

We do not know anything about the payload it carried. 740Kg is quite a lot for what's supposed to be merely a target.

Ah, optimism, you nasty drug...why don't you ever work on me?

You know I'm right about the cost.

 

[God Parshuram]

So according to you, sending people to space and bringing them back alive is NOT a big deal. But ASAT is.
Time for bed, princess #1.

Much more missions of human spaceflight have taken place than ASAT. Any nation having sufficiently develoed space program can easily do that provided that it is their priority thought it is a technological Chellenge.

When some technologically complex task is accomplished, it is not good to say that something else is more complex just to undermine the achievement.

 

[The Deterrent]

This wasn't an ISRO built satellite, it was built by DRDO.

We do not know anything about the payload it carried. 740Kg is quite a lot for what's supposed to be merely a target.

Please don't say that it actually carried Masood Azhar and ''this is how Modi delivers''.

You know I'm right about the cost.

You're optimistic about the cost. Rather about everything.

When some technologically complex task is accomplished, it is not good to say that something else is more complex just to undermine the achievement.

Dear princess #1,
The only one undermining India's achievement here is you, when you compare India with space powers. You said, and I quote:

No US, no Russia can do such wonder.

To which I replied that they have not only conducted these tests, but also undertaken much harder projects successfully, therefore they can do much beyond such 'wonders'.

It is not good to stay awake past your bedtime, sweetie.

 

[randomradio]

Please don't say that it actually carried Masood Azhar and ''this is how Modi delivers''.

Hope you allow it someday.

You're optimistic about the cost. Rather about everything.

What I've said is logical after all.

Btw, you pointed out that Phase I should have been ready by 2014. But it's not possible to activate the full Phase I BMD system without multiple target testing. And this has been delayed due to the late allotment of land for the second test range. DRDO had planned to finish all the construction work by 2014-15 and finish development trials. But land approvals came only in 2017, hence why it has been delayed. The same with Phase II, it should have begun testing in 2016, but it's not possible without the second test range. BMD delays are not due to technical reasons. That's also why BMD sites have already been cleared for construction.

The same with the test facility in A&N Islands, which will be important for Phase II. Clearance came only last year.

So Phase I should finish the same year as the test range is ready. And Phase II could also start at the same time, perhaps even earlier. So best not to go by the dates that DRDO had announced. Things could move very quickly once the test range is ready.

 

[The Deterrent]

Hope you allow it someday.



What I've said is logical after all.

Btw, you pointed out that Phase I should have been ready by 2014. But it's not possible to activate the full Phase I BMD system without multiple target testing. And this has been delayed due to the late allotment of land for the second test range. DRDO had planned to finish all the construction work by 2014-15 and finish development trials. But land approvals came only in 2017, hence why it has been delayed. The same with Phase II, it should have begun testing in 2016, but it's not possible without the second test range. BMD delays are not due to technical reasons. That's also why BMD sites have already been cleared for construction.

The same with the test facility in A&N Islands, which will be important for Phase II. Clearance came only last year.

So Phase I should finish the same year as the test range is ready. And Phase II could also start at the same time, perhaps even earlier. So best not to go by the dates that DRDO had announced. Things could move very quickly once the test range is ready.

Kaaka, this is exactly why optimism (in this particular situation) fails: THE REAL WORLD. There are so many moving parts for projects of this magnitude that you cannot be certain about anything, except hoping for the best case scenario.

Hell, if I go at your optimism levels, Pakistani missiles would write "teri keh k loon ga" in space during midcourse phase, before doing the actual act.

 

[God Parshuram]

Dear princess #1,
The only one undermining India's achievement here is you, when you compare India with space powers. You said, and I quote

Hi dear cute laddu baby,
Where did I undermine India's achievement? From which post of mine did you conclude that with your flawed logic?

 

[randomradio]

Kaaka, this is exactly why optimism (in this particular situation) fails: THE REAL WORLD. There are so many moving parts for projects of this magnitude that you cannot be certain about anything, except hoping for the best case scenario.

Hell, if I go at your optimism levels, Pakistani missiles would write "teri keh k loon ga" in space during midcourse phase, before doing the actual act.

The optimism here doesn't fail at all. It was just a bureaucratic holdup. Once it's cleared, things will go back on course. This is well within the expectations of what we can get from the real world.

As for Pakistan's missiles, manoeuvring during the mid-course is a long ways away still. Even advanced nations are still working on a sufficiently advanced post-boost capability. And by the time it's developed, we could be talking about laser BMD against boost phase.

I mean, think about it, just a few months ago, we were talking about only terminal BMD. But with the ASAT test, we are now talking about mid-course interception already. So how soon will it be by the time we start talking about laser BMD.

 

[amardeep mishra]

Why?

The first stage of any missile is peanuts compared to the actual cost of the entire missile.

Hi @randomradio
It is costly, just compare it with Arrow-2 or 3 and you'll get your answer. Arrow-3 has close to 1m dia and can achieve hypersonic speed. We need to reduce the footprint of PDV MK2- with a 1.4m dia it is slightly bigger than comparable western system and hence seems to be an overkill. However as an ASAT role it is perfect.

 

[randomradio]

Hi @randomradio
It is costly, just compare it with Arrow-2 or 3 and you'll get your answer. Arrow-3 has close to 1m dia and can achieve hypersonic speed. We need to reduce the footprint of PDV MK2- with a 1.4m dia it is slightly bigger than comparable western system and hence seems to be an overkill. However as an ASAT role it is perfect.

Strictly speaking, even our Phase I BMD should be using much smaller exo-atmospheric missiles, like the THAAD, for the sake of logistics.

But if you are purely talking about size, then I would recommend looking up the GBI. It's a massive missile and is launched from silos.

https://thedefensepost.com/2018/02/01/ballistic-missile-defense-gmd-contract-boeing/

So in this case costs and logistics became irrelevant in exchange for capability.

The SM-3 Block 2A has a diameter of 0.5m, and can easily manage altitudes of 600Km, likely more than Arrow-3. This should be our goal for mid-course defence against MRBMs.

But it's all about the capability. If we can't build a 0.5m missile that can climb to 500+Km, then we build a 1m missile or a 1.5m missile. Today, we have a missile that's capable of killing something at 800Km, and it's been tested to boot. So it's obvious any military deployment should be based on this missile. Cost and logistics can come into the picture for future iterations, especially when we will want them on ships.