TF-X Turkish Fighter & Trainer Aircraft Projects

[CAN_TR]

https://twitter.com/x/status/995009547919032323

 

[gkurt-1979]

https://twitter.com/x/status/995009547919032323

Temel Kotil said that TF-X's first flight is in 2026

 

[damm1t]

Temel Kotil said that TF-X's first flight is in 2026

No worry, they will make this bird fly in 2023 one way or another. It's symbolic.

 

[Khagan1923]

No they won't. It's 4 1/2 Years until then and there is still no engine decision, no engine prototype, no engine tests wich will take years. It has taken the russians years to develop a good engine for the SU-57 and they are still testing it how long do you think it is going to take us even if Rolls-Royce helps? Not mentioning the contract talk that will take months until the state and the firm that gets that gets the tender agree with each other.

There is no prototype of the plane, no decisions made on important parts, no contracts signed. The only thing we have is Aselsan working on cockpit HUD, ASEA and other electronic parts.

They may have the hull of the plane with prototype engines until 2023 which they can show off but it ain't gonna fly. 2026 is more likely. Until then they could have a flyable prototype but I think even then it's gonna be very hard to achieve.

This plane isn't gonna be ready until the end of the 2030s for serial production.

Like I said we could see a very early prototype model in 2023 with prototype engines which makes it unflyable but nothing more

I will gladly be wrong but I fear I won't be.


Let's see other fifth generation projects:

Russia: 2002 Sukhoi wins tender for the program
2009 development stage complete
2010 first flyable prototype
2019 (planned) Introduction into the Russian Air Force
= 17 years (9 years between first flight and introduction)

USA: 1991 After 5 years of testing Lockheed wins the tender with its YF-22
1997 First Flight
2005 Introduction into the US Air Force
= 14 years (8 years between first flight and introduction, F35A 10 years (2006- 2016) between first flight and introduction.)

China: 1990s Development program started for a fifth generation fighter
2008 Chengdu wins tender over Shenyang
2010 High speed taxing of the first J-20 prototype
2011 First flight of the first J-20 prototype
2017 Introduction into the PLAAF
= 9 years ( 6 years between first flight and introduction)

J-31 had its first flight in 2012 and its introduction is planned for 2019
that is 7 years between first flight and serial production.

 

[azyr]

No they won't. It's 4 1/2 Years until then and there is still no engine decision, no engine prototype, no engine tests wich will take years. It has taken the russians years to develop a good engine for the SU-57 and they are still testing it how long do you think it is going to take us even if Rolls-Royce helps? Not mentioning the contract talk that will take months until the state and the firm that gets that gets the tender agree with each other.

There is no prototype of the plane, no decisions made on important parts, no contracts signed. The only thing we have is Aselsan working on cockpit HUD, ASEA and other electronic parts.

They may have the hull of the plane with prototype engines until 2023 which they can show off but it ain't gonna fly. 2026 is more likely. Until then they could have a flyable prototype but I think even then it's gonna be very hard to achieve.

This plane isn't gonna be ready until the end of the 2030s for serial production.

Like I said we could see a very early prototype model in 2023 with prototype engines which makes it unflyable but nothing more

I will gladly be wrong but I fear I won't be.


Let's see other fifth generation projects:

Russia: 2002 Sukhoi wins tender for the program
2009 development stage complete
2010 first flyable prototype
2019 (planned) Introduction into the Russian Air Force
= 17 years (9 years between first flight and introduction)

USA: 1991 After 5 years of testing Lockheed wins the tender with its YF-22
1997 First Flight
2005 Introduction into the US Air Force
= 14 years (8 years between first flight and introduction, F35A 10 years (2006- 2016) between first flight and introduction.)

China: 1990s Development program started for a fifth generation fighter
2008 Chengdu wins tender over Shenyang
2010 High speed taxing of the first J-20 prototype
2011 First flight of the first J-20 prototype
2017 Introduction into the PLAAF
= 9 years ( 6 years between first flight and introduction)

J-31 had its first flight in 2012 and its introduction is planned for 2019
that is 7 years between first flight and serial production.

But no one said anything about serial production (which is scheduled for 2030+ at the moment). They want a flyable "something" at 2023, probably the first prototype. Just a brief 5 minute flight etc. No idea if they can pull it off but they're not aiming for serial production at 2023.

 

[Khagan1923]

But no one said anything about serial production (which is scheduled for 2030+ at the moment). They want a flyable "something" at 2023, probably the first prototype. Just a brief 5 minute flight etc. No idea if they can pull it off but they're not aiming for serial production at 2023.

TAI CEO already said that 2026 is the first flight date because he knows it is impossible for them to develop a engine in 4 1/2 years and test it intensivly enough to let someone fly a prototype fifth generation fighter with it. Either they are gonna lend some engines from the UK (EJ2000) and let it fly for a couple minutes or what is more likely this isn't gonna happen. There will be no flight in 2023 only a unflyable prototype mark my words.

Also I never said they aimed for serial production in 2023 no idea how you came up with that.

 

[azyr]

TAI CEO already said that 2026 is the first flight date because he knows it is impossible for them to develop a engine in 4 1/2 years and test it intensivly enough to let someone fly a prototype fifth generation fighter with it. Either they are gonna lend some engines from the UK (EJ2000) and let it fly for a couple minutes or what is more likely this is being used for the election. There will be no flight in 2023 only a unflyable prototype mark my words.

Also I never said they aimed for serial production in 2023 no idea how you came up with that.

But the engine doesn't have to be ready for a first flight. They could fly it with the engine that the new one will be based on (which will probably be the ej2000 tbh). These things happen, isn't that how China is doing it at the moment or am I mistaken?

 

[Khagan1923]

But the engine doesn't have to be ready for a first flight. They could fly it with the engine that the new one will be based on (which will probably be the ej2000 tbh). These things happen, isn't that how China is doing it at the moment or am I mistaken?

EJ2000 isn't in the race anymore thought, EuroJet withdraw their offer after it was found to be unsatisfying. If it was and they only had to modify it I would agree that 2023 is doable but the only option now are a joint-venture by Kale and Rolls-Royce and I believe a Turkish company can't remember who though. And both option will develop a engine from the beginning whose rights will belong to Turkey fully but it will take years to do so. And when you add the contract talks after the decision has been made which it still hasn't and you see that 2023 is impossible to do. If they don't make a decision in the next year or couple months on who gets the tender even 2026 could become very critical as a date.

 

[azyr]

EJ2000 isn't in the race anymore thought, EuroJet withdraw their offer after it was found to be unsatisfying. If it was and they only had to modify it I would agree that 2023 is doable but the only option now are a joint-venture by Kale and Rolls-Royce and I believe a Turkish company can't remember who though. And both option will develop a engine from the beginning whose rights will belong to Turkey fully but it will take years to do so. And when you add the contract talks after the decision has been made which it still hasn't and you see that 2023 is impossible to do. If they don't make a decision in the next year or couple months on who gets the tender even 2026 could become very critical as a date.

I thought the EJ2000 was mainly developed by Rolls Royce back in the day and the new engine proposed by Kale and Rolls Royce joint venture would be at least based on some of the design of the EJ200. That's why I think they could be used in the prototypes. Otherwise it will take over a decade to just get an engine working - and then a decade more to design the jet. Both projects need to work side by side, we don't have time to wait for the engine :/

 

[Otonom Piyade]

But no one said anything about serial production (which is scheduled for 2030+ at the moment). They want a flyable "something" at 2023, probably the first prototype. Just a brief 5 minute flight etc. No idea if they can pull it off but they're not aiming for serial production at 2023.

We can't say for sure when it will commence serial production whether that maybe in 2030 or later, but one thing is for sure is that they would like to finalise all prototypes and engineering once the project has reached a level of maturity as seen in ANKA project. Allot of people were critical of the delay of the project and to some degree pessimistic of the entire project since there were some delays one after another, but these projects need ironing out and allot of rework/re-engineering back and forth.

 

[Silahtar]

https://twitter.com/x/status/997078573868515328

 

[-------]

https://twitter.com/x/status/997078573868515328

Aircraft engine manufacturer Rolls-Royce showed off its Advanced Military Fan concept for the first time at Aero India 2015.

Biggs explained that the hollow titanium is filled with visco-elastic material to limit vibration unlike in the Trent 700 zigzag structural component inside and a super plastic material over the titanium.

Biggs says the hollow titanium brings several advantages to an engine, which includes a significant weight saving of around 30 percent. It also brings better air compression efficiency with a better pressure ratio and could even allow for a reduction in the number of blades, according to Biggs.

In addition, it enables greater tolerance for distortion and lower observability of the fan from radar.

 

[Oublious]

Aircraft engine manufacturer Rolls-Royce showed off its Advanced Military Fan concept for the first time at Aero India 2015.

Biggs explained that the hollow titanium is filled with visco-elastic material to limit vibration unlike in the Trent 700 zigzag structural component inside and a super plastic material over the titanium.

Biggs says the hollow titanium brings several advantages to an engine, which includes a significant weight saving of around 30 percent. It also brings better air compression efficiency with a better pressure ratio and could even allow for a reduction in the number of blades, according to Biggs.

In addition, it enables greater tolerance for distortion and lower observability of the fan from radar.

Well, this is to much for us. I think they will not share this with us to advanced.

 

[Kamil_baku]

Aircraft engine manufacturer Rolls-Royce showed off its Advanced Military Fan concept for the first time at Aero India 2015.

Biggs explained that the hollow titanium is filled with visco-elastic material to limit vibration unlike in the Trent 700 zigzag structural component inside and a super plastic material over the titanium.

Biggs says the hollow titanium brings several advantages to an engine, which includes a significant weight saving of around 30 percent. It also brings better air compression efficiency with a better pressure ratio and could even allow for a reduction in the number of blades, according to Biggs.

In addition, it enables greater tolerance for distortion and lower observability of the fan from radar.

too much information at once... Turkey should invest a lot to test it and eventually you will find it...

Actually i met a Turkish Engineer at his 50th working for GE engines, we had a lot of conversation. he said There are 4 more workers there... He even went to Turkey for 2 weeks.. Your government should invest on those people too..

 

[Hexciter]

https://twitter.com/x/status/997078573868515328

https://twitter.com/x/status/996770196458262529