Slumdog King - India ?

[Indus Pakistan]

Okay earlier on I came across a article on Dharavi in Mumbai home of Bollywood. Apparently it is the second largest slum in Asia. Now we all know India is famous for slums so this was no surprise. However what came as a shock was Orangi in Karachi being titled as the largest slum in Asia.

Frankly this came as surprise. I have seen most of Northern Pakistan. From Peshawar to Lahore and whilst yes there are here or there small neighbourhoods that might just about come within the rather subjective definition of "slum" but I never saw anything ghastly like you equate the real deal - Indian slum. So I was rather surprised about Orangi. My knowledge of Karachi is rather limited. I know it has large numbers from India so I thought maybe the "Indian disease" has been imported.

So I did some searching on the internet. From what I have gleaned Orangi although a low class district made of majority Bihari migrants does not though fit within the definition of the real deal "Indian slum". For that you need to go to India. Below is Google Earth images which confirm my feelings. Is there any people from Karachi who can shed the light on this "Orangi" and compare to Indian slums. Also why is Orangi being called the largest slum which seems to me typical fraud by Indian internet warriors. Below are Google images. Please compare and see what real slum looks like.

Orangi, Karachi, Pakistan

And now compare below Dharavi, Mumbai, India. This is what you call slum Hell on Earth. Worthy of Slumdog King.

I mean wtf? There is not even breathing space in Mumbai slums. Orangi in Pakistan looks like posh as dosh compared to Indian slums. Below are Google links. I suggest you click and navigate around to ses the reality. This is typical example of where Indian's distort facts by using "slum" word and hiding behind the subjectivity involved. I mean if Orangi, Karachi, Pak is a slum then Dharavi, Mumbai, India deserves to be called uber-slum as using same term for both is distorting reality.

This distortion applies across the board. We in Pakistan have poverty but the Indian's will use that to hide their exploded ribcage starvation poverty in the same bracket as poverty in Pakistan when the reality is Indian poverty is on altogather in another league.

Orangi, Karachi, Pak > Google Maps

Dharavi, Mumbai, India > Google Maps

The reality is we in Pakistan have same afflictions as India ( many imported from India ) but the essential differance is scale or magnitude. What is trivial annoyance in Pakistan becomes becomes humongous kick in the face in India. This can be seen in in poverty, slums and other less then pleasing aspects of life.

And can you guess who concluded that Orangi was the largest slum in Asia. Yes you got it. What does "Brihanmumbai Municipal Corporation" sound? Indian of course. This is sort of lies and distortions peddled by Indian's increasingly being picked up by Western media.

Karachi's Orangi beats Slumdog Millionaire's Dharavi in Mumbai as Asia's largest slum - Telegraph

Essentially what the Indian's did was realized they were becoming notorious for slumdogs. So hey why not deflect and dump this on Pakistan. With negative image of Pakistan it all it requires is for lies to be thrown at it and soon enough that will become perception. After that you can do what you want but mud sticks. Fact is Indian's will have succeeded in dragging you into the same shite bucket. This being typical example.

Although the physical reality can be seen from Google but if any of you know Orangi please enlighten us and compare it with Dharavi.

@Providence @gambit You gents are neutral so to say. Have a look at the Google imagery and compare.

 

[Nilgiri]

The big problem with Dharavi is its pretty much smack bang in the middle of the city, whereas Orangi is more on the outskirts.

So of course there will be more land per capita for Orangi.

That too not all of Orangi town is even a slum right? Lots of average decent habitations and areas from what I have seen/heard....again because it is so big (area wise) and is on the outskirts (so land value is relatively low and it can organically expand into empty areas).

Dharavi on other hand is severely constrained on all sides and cannot expand per se, hence it is very densely populated and on prime land. Hence the land value is very high and as a result the habitations are quite cramped and small. Its like if you took central park in manhattan and cramped in a million people to live there. It is truly a 100% core slum/shanty town like those on can find in Nairobi, Mexico City, Cairo etc...as a huge city envelops it and the slum itself becomes prime land and is bursting at the seems and expands by becoming even more dense etc. Orangi is more like the favelas of Rio de Janeiro and the slums of Bogota which formed on the outskirts and thus have more space....but the comparatively better aesthetics may not translate into better higher economical output.

There is definitely a strong economy behind Dharavi and there is change in the air with the redevelopment plans to make things more efficient, clean and liveable for its residents....while keeping and harnessing their enterprise and entrepreneurial nature better.

Talking about the imported "Indian disease" shows more about your own demeanour than anything else.

If you are bitter/angry about the UNDP giving any label or title to Orangi, take it up with them. Go out there and make your own documentary or report to factually present your case. Demeaning others only hurts your cause.

 

[ArsalanKhan21]

Orangi overall is a better neighborhood of Karachi than on Dharavi in Mumbai

Orangi Pilot Project - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Orangi is not Dharavi!


A recent report, compiled by Mumbai's Brihanmumbai Municipal Corporation with assistance from the United Nations Development Program (UNDP), claims that while Dharavi, the setting for the Oscar-winning Slumdog Millionaire movie, has 57,000 families living in overcrowded huts with poor sanitation, Orangi on the outskirts of Karachi is home to more than a million people living in poverty. This report has been splashed across Indian and some Western news media without any independent confirmation of its content.

The fact is that Orangi is nothing like Dharavi in terms of the quality of its housing or the services available to its residents. This report appears to be nothing but a shameful attempt by Mumbai's municipality to hide its own inadequacies by diverting the attention of the world to the biggest city of India's neighbor and arch rival Pakistan. What is even more disturbing is how the UNDP has become a party to this misleading claim. This preposterous claim is also an insult to the memory of Dr. Akhtar Hamid Khan who organized Orangi Pilot Project (OPP) and tirelessly worked with the residents on self-help model to improve their lives.

Reacting to the report, Parveen Rehman, of the Orangi Pilot Project, told a reporter of the Telegraph that the word “slum” did not do justice to its hard-working people, who had developed their own welfare system.

“People are poor but they are not destitute, they’re working class. It’s one of the poorest settlements. People have arranged their own schools, clinics and water supply. They are a great example of people helping themselves.

Ms. Rahman is right in her assessment. Orangi is not really a slum today. But it started life as a 'kutchi abadi' or squatter settlement for the large influx of refugees in Karachi from East Pakistan (often mistakenly called Biharis) after the fall of Dhaka in early 1970s. It consists of an area larger than 25 square miles (versus 0.67 sq miles in Dharavi) with a population of over a million (versus over 700,000 residents of Dharavi). Most of Orangi's population increase in the last three decades has come from the growing rural to urban migration, particularly of ethnic Pushtoons from the North West Frontier Province (NWFP). Shanties have now grown into single or two level cement houses over the years and a large number of schools have been operating successfully, sending the poorest children into the best educational institutions of the city. A significant population of educated middle class has grown in Orangi. There are a number of small businesses and a cottage industry, started by budding entrepreneurs and funded by microfinance efforts in the area. The city of Karachi has built roads into Orangi to provide improved access for the residents. A hospital was built in the community in the 1990s. While Dharavi has only one toilet per 1440 residents and most of its residents use Mahim Creek, a local river, for urination and defecation, Orangi has an elaborate sanitation system built by its citizens. Under Orangi Pilot Project's guidance, between 1981 and 1993 Orangi residents installed sewers serving 72,070 of 94,122 houses. To achieve this, community members spent more than US$2 million of their own money, and OPP invested about US$150,000 in research and extension of new technologies. Orangi pilot project has been admired widely for its work with urban poor.

Like any other growing and poor urban neighborhood, Orangi has its share of problems. Pollution, crime, corruption and political volatility are just some of the issues confronting Orangi residents. A large underground economy flourishes in Ornagi.

While the deplorable motivations of the Mumbai city authorities are clear, it is the UNDP that is doing a great disservice to its mission by joining with the BMC in defaming the highly laudable work of the ordinary citizens of Orangi and the OPP in Karachi.

Here's a video clip of Indian environment minister Jairam Ramesh saying "if there was a Nobel Prize for dirt and filth, India would win it hands down":

Related Links:

Informal Economy Estimates

Light a Candle, Do Not Curse Darkness

Urbanization in Pakistan Highest in South Asia

Orangi Pilot Project

Orangi Beats Dharavi

Can Slumdog's Success Improve Lives of Poor Children?

Dr. Akhtar Hameed Khan
Posted by Riaz Haq at 8:33 PM
Labels: Dharavi, Karachi, Mumbai, Orangi, Slumdog Millionaire
12 comments:

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

Old but relevant statistics

 

[kasper95]

can someone compare the land prices is Dharavi to the prices in Orangi. just curious

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

The big problem with Dharavi is its pretty much smack bang in the middle of the city, whereas Orangi is more on the outskirts.

So of course there will be more land per capita for Orangi.

That too not all of Orangi town is even a slum right? Lots of average decent habitations and areas from what I have seen/heard....again because it is so big (area wise) and is on the outskirts (so land value is relatively low and it can organically expand into empty areas).

Dharavi on other hand is severely constrained on all sides and cannot expand per se, hence it is very densely populated and on prime land. Hence the land value is very high and as a result the habitations are quite cramped and small. Its like if you took central park in manhattan and cramped in a million people to live there. It is truly a 100% core slum/shanty town like those on can find in Nairobi, Mexico City, Cairo etc...as a huge city envelops it and the slum itself becomes prime land and is bursting at the seems and expands by becoming even more dense etc. Orangi is more like the favelas of Rio de Janeiro and the slums of Bogota which formed on the outskirts and thus have more space....but the comparatively better aesthetics may not translate into better higher economical output.

There is definitely a strong economy behind Dharavi and there is change in the air with the redevelopment plans to make things more efficient, clean and liveable for its residents....while keeping and harnessing their enterprise and entrepreneurial nature better.

Talking about the imported "Indian disease" shows more about your own demeanour than anything else.

If you are bitter/angry about the UNDP giving any label or title to Orangi, take it up with them. Go out there and make your own documentary or report to factually present your case. Demeaning others only hurts your cause.

Funny, the OP being a think-tank is comparing the "aesthetics" of slums

When slums irrespective of their "beauty" are defined based on following criteria by UN:

1. Inadequate access to safe water
2. Inadequate access to sanitation and infrastructure
3. Poor structural quality of housing
4. Overcrowding
5. Insecure residential status

Housing & slum upgrading – UN-Habitat

 

[Nilgiri]

Dharavi: Self-created special economic zone for the poor

Dharavi, Mumbai | Sustainable Milano

So Dharavi economic output is estimated to be more than 1 billion USD (probably more now)

Any figure like that for Orangi?

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

India has made huge strides in reducing slum population in the last decades

2010 update

Proportion of urban population in slums declined to 29% in 2010 from 42% in 2000, according to UN report

India sees reduction in urban slum dwellers - Livemint

Proportion of Pakistani urban population in slums in 2009: 46.6%

https://sustainabledevelopment.un.org/content/documents/745habitat.pdf

Pakistan has greater percentage of its urban population living in slums in 2009, than India did in 2000

@Echo_419, @Nilgiri @SamantK @SarthakGanguly @Stag112
Despite roughly being a decade behind India in slum reduction the OP must on some agenda to make Pakistan look bad.

 

[third eye]

Frankly this came as surprise. I have seen most of Northern Pakistan. From Peshawar to Lahore and whilst yes there are here or there small neighbourhoods that might just about come within the rather subjective definition of "slum" but I never saw anything ghastly like you equate the real deal - Indian slum

Here we go.. another ' mine is better that yours ' thread.

 

[Ryuzaki]

haha indophobic scavenger got trolled