Pakistan Middle Class Bigger & Wealthier Than Indian Middle Class

[AyanRay]

Whom we worship is our choice and ours only. Please do not teach us that.

And please be proud of what you have. There is a reason Ganges and not Indus is so central to Hindu mythology.

Sindhu river was always considered holy for every Hindu FYI. And we are proud of both Ganga and IVC.

BTW, you did not answers my question. How did the name India came into being and what was considered as India by ancient explorers?

 

[farhan_9909]

Let me just reverse your sentence and make it more logical my friend... "Pakistan belongs to IVC"...once you get this line, start reading the history from there after... also read the destruction of IVC and the entire Indian history (you may exclude Gujrat and haryana if you prefer).

BTW some poster claimed that some thousand years ago Indian land was jungle and IVC was civilisation.. you may tell him that IVC was destructed even before Pakistan was created.. .. what existed after that destruction was India (again you may exclude haryana and Gujrat) and there are detailed texts of Indian history for thousands of years. so India has continued to be a civilisation..whereas the IVC was destroyed thousands of year ago.

BTW, it should be kept in mind that the sole reason I am comparing IVC and India sparately is for the sake of countering some absurd claims coming from my Pakistani friends.. otheriwse it is a well known fact that IVC is Purely Indian civilisation and has nothing to do with pakistan other than the fact that the site of IVC (whatever is discovered so far) ies in the current state of pakistan which was a part of India before creation of Pakistan.

oh dear do you even know that not the modern india but instead pakistan is the true successor state of ancient INDIA?

Be proud of your history,i don't know why you guys are after our IVC?don't you have anything better?

You being jatt cannot be indian,your by default a Pakistani.

Pakistan is not merely a nationality,it is a ideology and state of mind.

 

[suresh1773]

Its not 2009. terrorism and violence has decreased by 70 % and will be finished by next year. Russia ,china , iran have signed deals with Pakistan and economy is growing at its fastest pace in 5 years . Unlike India , Pakistan does not have poor people living in millions on the streets. Number of people below the threshold of $ 1.25 spend a day is 12 % of total population of Pakistan and its around 30 % for India. A simple stroll through Islamabad and Delhi will give you the picture of wealth and poverty of the people .

The Picture you painted is India of 2015. Where people get killed for being Christians and Hindus. People get their hands chopped off and slaughtered for eating beef.

This is news for me that terrorism has increased by 70% and will be finished by next year. It has been more then a decade. All your military operations including Zarb -E Adad or this E that has failed miserably. The militants know they cannot face a conventional war hence they will shift their operations or lie down low. Lastly U beg before the World Bank and IMF to clear your International debts which has reached alarming levels,talking about poor people in India.

 

[farhan_9909]

Sindhu river was always considered holy for every Hindu FYI. And we are proud of both Ganga and IVC.

BTW, you did not answers my question. How did the name India came into being and what was considered as India by ancient explorers?

India is named after a river that has 93% of its entire course in Pakistan.

The Reason are

*The history of India start in what is Pakistan/IVC
*Majority of the indians are the descendant of Pakistanis
*Majority of the indian follow Rig veda,which was composed by ancient Pakistanis
*Many of the indian language are developed from our language sanskrit

 

[indianBong]

Sorry but i strongly reject the point that IVC is this subcontinent.IVC only belong to pakistan and those region falling under IVC by default belong to Pakistan(haryana/gujrat)

sir, there is nothing called absolute in this world..... (god forbid) if tomorrow sindh or baloch breaks away from pakistan... then they will say IVC belongs exclusively to balochistan or sindhudesh etc and pakistan has no claim on it....!!!
you got to understand these man made boundaries, LOCs, etc were not present that time... neither did they have any nationality..... Good old times....

 

[Shamain]

Sindhu river was always considered holy for every Hindu FYI. And we are proud of both Ganga and IVC.

BTW, you did not answers my question. How did the name India came into being and what was considered as India by ancient explorers?

ohh go away liar. the word hindu never had anything to do with hindu religion. it was persian rulers of that time who found pronouncing word sindhu difficult so they named it hindu. it was a geographical name ..not remotely linked to hindu religion. you later on took it and made whatever out of it u did.

sir, there is nothing called absolute in this world..... (god forbid) if tomorrow sindh or baloch breaks away from pakistan... then they will say IVC belongs exclusively to balochistan or sindhudesh etc and pakistan has no claim on it....!!!
you got to understand these man made boundaries, LOCs, etc were not present that time... neither did they have any nationality..... Good old times....

dont know abt pakistan but ithink india will for sure break up. so watch that tongue.

 

[AyanRay]

ohh go away liar. the word hindu never had anything to do with hindu religion. it was persian rulers of that time who found pronouncing word sindhu difficult so they named it hindu. it was a geographical name ..not remotely linked to hindu religion. you later on took it and made whatever out of it u did.

Please try to understand the message you have quoted before replying. When did I argue about the name Hindu??? I said Hindus (people of sanatan dharm) always considered Sindhu holy, that's it.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

@Atanz see indians inferirorty complex ridden posts above. plz wud u share how indus valley is ours or give some past thread link. really need to see them indeez getting slammed here.

Well it is so simple that frankly it does not need much explaining. Lemme sum it up. Indus River Basin is 93% in Pakistan with 3% in China, 3% India and 3% Afghanistan. From this you can conclude Indus is to Pakistan what Nile is to Eygpt. But just to clarify look at the maps below.

Wherever you are in Pakistan you are on the Indus Basin. Islamabad our capital is only 15 miles east of River Indus. Remarkably even Kabul, Afghan capital falls in the Indus Basin. New Delhi DOES NOT. All of our irrigation depends on Indus as most of Pakistan is desert or semi desert.

Unsurprisingly Indian Punjab does fall within the basin but you alreadt know that is 2.5% of India.

You can see 93% of the Indus basin ( yellow ) comes in Pakistan.

Indus Valley Civilization > Pakistan is central to it like Ancient Eygpt and Nile. Of course there is some spillover into Afghanistan and India.

Now look at this map of Dravidian India that bet lot of these "history hunters" come from. Does it even come in the IVC frame? NO

Look below. 5,000 years ago. Jungles, jungles and more naked jugles today they jump up and claim something that is not even near them. Have look at the map and can you see IVC there? NO.

Dravid India

Yet today posters from Orrisa or Karnataka are salivating about something that has nothing to do with them. Look at Karnatka or Orrisa? What the hell have they got to do with a region that is far way and belongs to another climate zone? If they have claim then why not Iranian's who are right next door?

Now move to the Ganga Indians of the Ganga basin.

Ooops. This also falls outside the IVC zone.

Ganga India

So what we have today is Ganga or Dravid Indian's who had nothing but naked jungles 5,000 years ago looking around and running north west to the region that is today Pakistan. Then start plundering Indus basin history because their lands have no history. Any doubts please look at the two maps above which cover 95% of Indians.

Ganga India - That region of India on or about the Ganges River Basin.
Dravid India - All of the Peninsular or Deccan or South India.

I am not going to bother more than this. These are facts. Hungry cheating people will do anything to ignore reality. I will see if I can get a sticky done in the history section that people can always refer to for quick facts.

@AyanRay That bull about praying Shiva is repeated nonsense. First those seals might or might not be Shiva. Your transposing your thoughts on this. Second even if they are why do I have worship Shiva? What has religion got to do with this. According to your logic the modern Eygptians or modern Greeks would have top pray to Horus, walk around with sill headgear and the Greeks walk around praying to Greek gods. The Eygptians are Muslims and Greeks Christians. Both do not DETRACT from their ancestors achievements. If my son converted to Rastafarianism he would still remain my son and conversly if I become Buddhist I would still remain his father.

That way most people do not follow the religion their ancestors followed 5,000 years ago. That does NOT divorce them from their ancestors. Same to Christian Greeks, Muslkim Egyptians or even Communist Chinese.

 

[Dragon4]

India is named after a river that has 93% of its entire course in Pakistan.

The Reason are

*The history of India start in what is Pakistan/IVC
*Majority of the indians are the descendant of Pakistanis
*Majority of the indian follow Rig veda,which was composed by ancient Pakistanis
*Many of the indian language are developed from our language sanskrit

You didnt make anything, our ancestors did. And whatever they did, you wont like them, cuz it doesnt go well with Islam.
We are carrying forward Sanskrit and Vedas and not you.
Pakistan word was coined post partition and maybe in future it can be anything, doesn't mean Pakistan can have a copyright on IVC cuz you are just not worth it.

 

[farhan_9909]

sir, there is nothing called absolute in this world..... (god forbid) if tomorrow sindh or baloch breaks away from pakistan... then they will say IVC belongs exclusively to balochistan or sindhudesh etc and pakistan has no claim on it....!!!
you got to understand these man made boundaries, LOCs, etc were not present that time... neither did they have any nationality..... Good old times....

i agree but do you know that i don't consider pakistan and india as one entity ever?

It is true that because of foreign invaders,Pakistan and indian territory were merged but if we browse the independent history of each other,than the difference between the history of the region pakistan is as much different from indian as much is the difference between the history of arab world and Pakistan

NOTE:i consider punjab,kashmir,gujrat,rajasthan as part of ancient Pakistan,not india

 

[AyanRay]

Well it is so simple that frankly it does not need much explaining. Lemme sum it up. Indus River Basin is 93% in Pakistan with 3% in China, 3% India and 3% Afghanistan. From this you can conclude Indus is to Pakistan what Nile is to Eygpt. But just to clarify look at the maps below.

Wherever you are in Pakistan you are on the Indus Basin. Islamabad our capital is only 15 miles east of River Indus. All of our irrigation depends on Indus as most of Pakistan is desert or semi desert.

You can see 93% of the Indus basin ( yellow ) comes in Pakistan.

Indus Valley Civilization > Pakistan is central to it like Ancient Eygpt and Nile. Of course there is some spillover into Afghanistan and India.

Now look at this map of Dravidian India that bet lot of these "history hunters" come from. Does it even come in the IVC frame? NO

Look below. 5,000 years ago. Jungles, jungles and more naked jugles today they jump up and claim something that is not even near them. Have look at the map and can you see IVC there? NO.

Dravid India

Yet today posters from Orrisa or Karnataka are salivating about something that has nothing to do with them. Look at Karnatka or Orrisa?

Now move to the Ganga Indians of the Ganga basin.

Ooops. This also falls outside the IVC zone.

Ganga India

So what we have today is Ganga or Dravid Indian's who had nothing but naked jungles 5,000 years ago looking around and running north west to the region that is today Pakistan. Then start plundering Indus basin history because their lands have no history. Any doubts please look at the two maps above which cover 95% of Indians.

Ganga India - That region of India on or about the Ganges River Basin.
Dravid India - All of the Peninsular or Deccan India.

I am not going to bother more than this. These are facts. Hungry cheating people will do anything to ignore reality. I will see if I can get a sticky done in the history section that people can always refer to for quick facts.

Dude, nobody is arguing IVC sites are found in present day Pakistan, but what was present day Pakistan called 80 years ago? And what did the ancient explorers call this place?? Vasco da gama came to search the sea route to India, not Pakistan. The land has been partitioned, not our claim to the civilization.

i agree but do you know that i don't consider pakistan and india as one entity ever?

It is true that because of foreign invaders,Pakistan and indian territory were merged but if we browse the independent history of each other,than the difference between the history of the region pakistan is as much different from indian as much is the difference between the history of arab world and Pakistan

NOTE:i consider punjab,kashmir,gujrat,rajasthan as part of ancient Pakistan,not india

Try searching for Ancient Pakistan on net and please give a link if you find any non Pakistani source.

 

[Paksanity]

Sindhu river was always considered holy for every Hindu FYI. And we are proud of both Ganga and IVC.

BTW, you did not answers my question. How did the name India came into being and what was considered as India by ancient explorers?

Word India is a foreign one and is term coined for region East of River Indus. Unfortunately you are blinded by poltical sentiments and will fail to see history as it was. Indus valley civilization appeared before Abrahamic religions and Hindu religion in its current form. For sure you will find references to Indus valley civilization in Hindu religion and you will find influence of IVC in Hindu mythology. This is bound to happen in two civilizations who exist close by. A civilization which appears later will borrow from earlier civilization as did Ganges civilization. There was neither India nor Pakistan in those times. India in its current form is a British gift and hence borders of India, Pakistan, Bangladesh etc are strictly what was British empire. Let's not go there. Early civilizations were advanced human settlements almost always around a river and were able to thrive on two reasons 1) Surplus food 2) Protection from nature and human devastation. Indus valley is a fertile land with abundant fresh water and natural protection around it (high mountains in North and west, sea in south, jungle, Desert and marshland to the east) so it thrived. Ganges valley also thrived in its own time for same reasons. Please have a look again on this map and figure out where most of present day Pakistan and most of present day India lies.

Surplus food is keyword here. Any person coming from what is mostly India now would be awestruck in what is mostly Pakistan now.

 

[AyanRay]

NOTE:i consider punjab,kashmir,gujrat,rajasthan as part of ancient Pakistan,not india

Guess what, Mesopotomia civilization no longer belongs to Iraq, now ISIS can claim it.

Word India is a foreign one and is term coined for region East of River Indus. Unfortunately you are blinded by poltical sentiments and will fail to see history as it was. Indus valley civilization appeared before Abrahamic religions and Hindu religion in its current form. For sure you will find references to Indus valley civilization in Hindu religion and you will find influence of IVC in Hindu mythology. This is bound to happen in two civilizations who exist close by. A civilization which appears later will borrow from earlier civilization as did Ganges civilization. There was neither India nor Pakistan in those times. India in its current form is a British gift and hence borders of India, Pakistan, Bangladesh etc are strictly what was British empire. Let's not go there. Early civilizations were advanced human settlements almost always around a river and were able to thrive on two reasons 1) Surplus food 2) Protection from nature and human devastation. Indus valley is a fertile land with abundant fresh water and natural protection around it (high mountains in North and west, sea in south, jungle, Desert and marshland to the east) so it thrived. Ganges valley also thrived in its own time for same reasons. Please have a look again on this map and figure out where most of present day Pakistan and most of present day India lies.

View attachment 265328

Surplus food is keyword here. Any person coming from what is mostly India now would be awestruck in what is mostly Pakistan now.

First of all, the name Hindu came much later, what consisted before was the sanatan dharma. The Persians named the people Hindus and that's what followed thereafter.

There is nothing like Hindu in its current form or older form. Its just a name. We were all followers of sanatan dharma and we continue to do so.

And regarding the concept of 'the civilization which is established later will take something from the earlier civilization' I 100% agree, So, what's your so called Pakistani civilization has in common?

And don't name India and Pakistan in the same breathe when you are talking about civilization, I agree Pakistan is a British creation , but India, including its name existed long before that. As I mentioned Christopher Columbus was searching for sea route to India (Indies as the Spanish called it) and not Pakistan. West Indies derived its name because there existed a civilization called India.

 

[Shamain]

Well it is so simple that frankly it does not need much explaining. Lemme sum it up. Indus River Basin is 93% in Pakistan with 3% in China, 3% India and 3% Afghanistan. From this you can conclude Indus is to Pakistan what Nile is to Eygpt. But just to clarify look at the maps below.

Wherever you are in Pakistan you are on the Indus Basin. Islamabad our capital is only 15 miles east of River Indus. Remarkably even Kabul, Afghan capital falls in the Indus Basin. New Delhi DOES NOT. All of our irrigation depends on Indus as most of Pakistan is desert or semi desert.

Unsurprisingly Indian Punjab does fall within the basin but you alreadt know that is 2.5% of India.

You can see 93% of the Indus basin ( yellow ) comes in Pakistan.

Indus Valley Civilization > Pakistan is central to it like Ancient Eygpt and Nile. Of course there is some spillover into Afghanistan and India.

Now look at this map of Dravidian India that bet lot of these "history hunters" come from. Does it even come in the IVC frame? NO

Look below. 5,000 years ago. Jungles, jungles and more naked jugles today they jump up and claim something that is not even near them. Have look at the map and can you see IVC there? NO.

Dravid India

Yet today posters from Orrisa or Karnataka are salivating about something that has nothing to do with them. Look at Karnatka or Orrisa? What the hell have they got to do with a region that is far way and belongs to another climate zone? If they have claim then why not Iranian's who are right next door?

Now move to the Ganga Indians of the Ganga basin.

Ooops. This also falls outside the IVC zone.

Ganga India

So what we have today is Ganga or Dravid Indian's who had nothing but naked jungles 5,000 years ago looking around and running north west to the region that is today Pakistan. Then start plundering Indus basin history because their lands have no history. Any doubts please look at the two maps above which cover 95% of Indians.

Ganga India - That region of India on or about the Ganges River Basin.
Dravid India - All of the Peninsular or Deccan or South India.

I am not going to bother more than this. These are facts. Hungry cheating people will do anything to ignore reality. I will see if I can get a sticky done in the history section that people can always refer to for quick facts.

@AyanRay That bull about praying Shiva is repeated nonsense. First those seals might or might not be Shiva. Your transposing your thoughts on this. Second even if they are why do I have worship Shiva? What has religion got to do with this. According to your logic the modern Eygptians or modern Greeks would have top pray to Horus, walk around with sill headgear and the Greeks walk around praying to Greek gods. The Eygptians are Muslims and Greeks Christians. Both do not DETRACT from their ancestors achievements. If my son converted to Rastafarianism he would still remain my son and conversly if I become Buddhist I would still remain his father.

That way most people do not follow the religion their ancestors followed 5,000 years ago. That does NOT divorce them from their ancestors. Same to Christian Greeks, Muslkim Egyptians or even Communist Chinese.

thanks. Just what iwas looking for. So indians without any history of their own as usual stole others history ,our history and wore it around as theirs? Deception is all what their world is built on.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

@Paksanity @farhan_9909 @Shamain

What I can't understand is that most Indians live on the Ganges basin. Their capital is on the Ganges Basin. Their holy river is Ganges. Just look at the map below of Ganga India.

All Indian members here from Utter Pradesh, Bihar, East Rajasthan, Bengal, Assam, some Orrisa, some Madya Pradesh which covers most Indian's are from this region. They worship Ganges as below

I won't even bother with the Dravid Indian's. They are stuck way in the South. These people then when it comes to history suddenly pretend to be "children of Indus" and drop Holy Ganges like something that looks and smells foul. The reason is simple folks. The answer lies in the map by Paksanity - Please refer below.

This map makes it clearly evident that when our ancestors in the Indus region of Pakistan (coloured red and marked Indus Valley Civilization) were basking in high civilization and laying foundations of Harrapa etc what were forefathers of Ganga Indian's upto? Look at map please. All of UP, Bihar, Assam, Bengal Madya Pradesh or the Ganga Indian ancestors were running around as "Forest Hunter gatherers". Not very edifying is it?

Solution ? Jump on our backs in the west and claim Indus basin.

What about those members who come from Tamil Nadu, Kerala, Karnatka, Jharkhand, Marathrastra, Andra Pradesh etc or Dravid Indians ancestors doing 5,000 years ago? Please refer to map above again. They were "Stone Age farmers" and "Hunter gatherer peoples". Again damn embarassing.

Solution? Jump on our backs far away in the north west and claim Indus Basin.


This explains why Indian's go in paroxyms the moment we mention it. It is like they have copyright over it. This is nothing but simple copyright theft and an attempt at covering up with their own land's singular lack of history. Thus pray to Ganga, live on Ganga, declare Holy Ganga, bathe in Ganga but when talking about history suddenly claim Indus ancestry.

Maybe we ought to enamoured that they want to imitate us and deny their own forefathers. Instead want to be children of our forefathers?

"Imitation is best form of flatterry"