Pakistan cruise missiles pose key challenge to India

[Secur]

@bloo For trolling , speak for yourself . Nice way to escape though when you cant prove your point 17 km you said ?

All I see is a frustrated boy disproving his whole debate Dont want to ruin the thread because of people in denial mode , our SOP . You aren't fighting any battle here .

 

[Hulk]

First test was a success. Second test took 2 years because an upgraded variant came along, not the same thing tested once again. You see not he is ignorant and stupid, he refuses to read the babur database thread.

Nirbhay is being tested because they are not going to test a new thing. It will be the same systems.




Your army chief calimed your army can't fight more than 10 days! Yeah,,, at least Pakistan can withstand 40-50 days

Army has ammunition only for 10 days in war situation! - News Oneindia

Firstly I like to discuss with civility. I am not saying he is right or wrong but just saying there is no point continuously discussing the same. As far as test are concerned in my opinion Pakistan hides its failureor mis represents it. This is accepted by senior Pakistani members here. What I am trying tell them is that you both made your point and nobody is convincing the other. So why not move forward with it. I specially think history of babur does not matter to me, personally I feel Pakistan was helped on it from outside maybe China. Tomahawk feel in Pakistan which was given to china in return of developed babur, its my personal opinion but Pakistan really does not have the base to develop something so quickly without help. Research happens in steps with parts built incrementally.

 

[Hulk]

@indianrabbit I get your point about validation of different technologies just fine , I agree with it since the official sources say so . But this " death of logic " by preferring an unproven claim by a biased source over established fact of the first successful test flight of Babur is beyond me to be honest .

@bloo This is no law and order thing only . It applies to debate too just fine , the concept is also present for scientific and philosphical stuff in the same meaning . You continue your merry go round though , dodging the absence of any proof for the claim by your professional , doesn't irk me . Why would it since its just a hollow claim being quoted by a source ?

Secure that is what I am saying, disagree move on instead of repeating it is many post.

 

[Secur]

Nope, I am still saying 17km and I'll stick to it, so enjoy your denial.

Ok , just dont hit the keyboard on the wall now

Secure that is what I am saying, disagree move on instead of repeating it is many post.

I disagreed a long time ago but I cant say the same for the other member .

 

[Hulk]

@bloo For trolling , speak for yourself . Nice way to escape though when you cant prove your point 17 km you said ?

All I see is a frustrated boy disproving his whole debate Dont want to ruin the thread because of people in denial mode , our SOP . You aren't fighting any battle here .

To me proving it was not even needed, its the point that does not matter. One question for you, do you seriously believe that you never failed a test? Or you will agree Pakistan does not declare failures?

 

[Umair Nawaz]

With Pakistan arming itself with nuclear capable cruise missiles with stealth capabilities, a new dimension has been added to India’s maritime security challenges, says leading Indian defence expert retired Commodore C. Uday Bhaskar.

“Taking a leaf from China, Pakistan seems to be investing in cruise missiles,” he said, referring to Pakistan’s indigenously developed cruise missile Babur, which can carry both nuclear and conventional warheads.

“This has lowered the index of stability in the region,” Bhaskar said at an Asia-Pacific security seminar on India’s Maritime Security Challenges at the East-West Centre Tuesday.

But in dealing with issues ranging from low intensity conflict and piracy to major-power strategic contests, India’s key challenges were resource constraints, ship building capabilities, maritime infrastructure and the changing geo-political environment, he said.

The rapidly changing strategic environment in South Asia and emergence of an “extended global common” posed another challenge, said Bhaskar, currently a distinguished fellow with the Society for Policy Studies and a visiting fellow at the National Maritime Foundation in New Delhi.

Over the next decade, the US, China and India will form a critical strategic triangle and their individual relationships with the ASEAN, Iran and Pakistan will have significant regional and global implications, he said.

Given its distinctive geography and the recent shift of global maritime focus from the Atlantic-Pacific combine to the Indo-Pacific continuum, the importance of the Indian Ocean Region in India’s national security calculus has greatly increased in the post-Cold War/post 9-11 era, Bhaskar said.

Yet the Indian Navy mandated to address this wide spectrum security domain received about a sixth of an overall defence budget of less than $40 billion in fiscal 2012-13, he said.

He noted that within the Indian military matrix, the navy was referred to as the “Cinderella service”.

India’s ship building capabilities too were “not really flattering”, blighted as they were by time and cost overruns, Bhaskar said.

He listed the ability to build credibly fight capable ships as another key challenge.

The country’s maritime infrastructure too was “less than rudimentary”, he said. He added that that in terms of ports, India’s top port Mumbai was listed at the 30th spot in the world.

However, Bhaskar said there was a growing awareness at the national level that over the next two decades India’s future aspirations and anxieties will be increasingly shaped by its ability to address the challenges and opportunities of the maritime domain.

‘Pakistan cruise missiles pose key challenge to India’ | idrw.org

So the monkey is scared of Pakistan.

 

[The Deterrent]

@Secur
Although no one can claim that specific figure (17km) with credibility, something like that did happen during the 1st test. But after a dozen test flights the platform has matured, so there is no point in arguing over it. Similar is the case with Nirbhay, it will mature eventually.

@bloo
Just for clarification, Babur's second test took place 7 months later on 21 Mar 2006 (not 2 years later as you claim).

 

[Umair Nawaz]

@AhaseebA

Razia missile main phas gae.

 

[Secur]

@AhaseebA Nothing happened actually and I know there is no point arguing about that false claim since an upgraded variant was tested exactly seven months after , followed by dozens of test launches incorporating new technologies , but check the credibility of this dubious unproven 17 km claim coming from a single blog and being quoted by another website being parrotted as fact , does it make sense ? Its coming from a biased Indian blog who for all we know - made it up to undermine the Pakistan's missile technology advancement since due to secrecy of our missile programme , theres no possible way that these people would have had access to the data and parameters to claim such a thing . There's no other International or Pakistani source reporting it even . The official sources confirmed the test as "successful" , thats it ! What are these Indians basing their ridiculous opinion on ? That is what I wanted to know from these kids who when even asked about TERCOM and DSMAC will have a hard time explaining it but are hell bent on taking that source as gospel truth . As for Nirbhay , we will talk about it when its tested successfully for the first time , since the next test flight was planned months ago , but never happened . Delay after delay . Speak of maturity of the platform and start a childish comparison with an inducted and operational platform . These internet warriors really need to learn the meaning of "credible source" and "burden of proof" concept , making claims without proof is hollow , empty and baseless to say the least and they want me to prove " their claims " . Speak of irony .

 

[The Deterrent]

@AhaseebA Nothing happened actually and I know there is no point arguing about that false claim since an upgraded variant was tested exactly seven months after , followed by dozens of test launches incorporating new technologies , but check the credibility of this dubious unproven 17 km claim coming from a single blog and being quoted by another website being parrotted as fact , does it make sense ? Its coming from a biased Indian blog who for all we know - made it up to undermine the Pakistan's missile technology advancement since due to secrecy of our missile programme , theres no possible way that these people would have had access to the data and parameters to claim such a thing . There's no other International or Pakistani source reporting it even . The official sources confirmed the test as "successful" , thats it ! What are these Indians basing their ridiculous opinion on ? That is what I wanted to know from these kids who when even asked about TERCOM and DSMAC will have a hard time explaining it but are hell bent on taking that source as gospel truth . As for Nirbhay , we will talk about it when its tested successfully for the first time , since the next test flight was planned months ago , but never happened . Delay after delay . Speak of maturity of the platform and start a childish comparison with an inducted and operational platform . These internet warriors really need to learn the meaning of "credible source" and "burden of proof" concept , making claims without proof is hollow , empty and baseless to say the least and they want me to prove " their claims " . Speak of irony .

I'm not shoving my opinion down anyone's throat, so if anyone is looking for credibility, there isn't any. As far as the secrecy is concerned, interested parties always find a way to gain access (across both sides of the border), and it is my understanding that Sengupta might have links to such parties.
Another clarification, the second test didn't feature an upgraded variant.

 

[Bilal.]

Oh so since nirbhay failed suddenly Indians started claiming Babur only flew 17km, how come it was never claimed before. All after nirbhay failure and it becomes Devine truth and coming from a source often ridiculed by Indian defence enthusiasts... Yeah sure

 

[bloo]

@AhaseebA
Sorry man my bad, premature evaluation I guess.

@Secur
Now do you want to see my point objectively?

 

[OrionHunter]

Detecting Cruise missile is much harder than ballistic missile.

With the AWACS, it is pretty easy to detect and lock on to subsonic cruise missiles. Babur is powered by a turbofan engine and thus subsonic with a max speed of 800 kmh. Once detected by the AWACS, fighter aircraft can be guided to intercepted it and shoot it to hell.

Over sea, it can be easily picked up by the Being P-8I Poseidon at ranges as far as 200km. So the sub-sonic Babur is no big deal! It can be blown out of the sky without any difficulty, notwithstanding its so called 'stealth features'.

 

[HariPrasad]

In intercepting the cruise missile, detection is the key. When it is detected from ground, anti missile system has a little time to react so a very quick reaction missile is required. So far as india is concern, Maitri fits perfectly in this role.

Other way to detect it early. That can be done by Awacs or Aerostar like system. If detected from a distance, even a plane with good RADAR can shoot it down with an Air to Air missile provided it is not supersonic with a very high maneuverability.

 

[Secur]

I'm not shoving my opinion down anyone's throat, so if anyone is looking for credibility, there isn't any. As far as the secrecy is concerned, interested parties always find a way to gain access (across both sides of the border), and it is my understanding that Sengupta might have links to such parties.
Another clarification, the second test didn't feature an upgraded variant.

No , I get your point just fine . With no credibility , I always take that "rumor" with a pinch of salt . Well even then , he should have mentioned the source though , he got that little piece of information from if he had any and knowing the "openness" of the Indian defense affairs , wouldn't have been a problem since they even provide "transcripts of conversation of PA on LOC" to their media . Still , it doesn't matter now actually.

Oh so since nirbhay failed suddenly Indians started claiming Babur only flew 17km, how come it was never claimed before. All after nirbhay failure and it becomes Devine truth and coming from a source often ridiculed by Indian defence enthusiasts... Yeah sure

Happens , there's no extent of human ability to rationalize the truth After all , Mr Prasun only was enlightened from God-knows-where about Babur flying only 17 km after Nirbhay failed its first test flight , not before and the second test isn't in sight , being planned months after the first failure , but is yet to happen and you have fanboys here ready to declare it "superior" to an operational missile .