Pakistan Army APC Inventory

[Tornado23]

The explosion was caused by a TM-62M mine, and the crew was left uninjured. 7.5 kg of explosives.
View attachment 764520

That's pretty good protection then

 

[Raja Porus]

That's pretty good protection then

Yep, the mine was for anti-tank role.

 

[PanzerKiel]

That's pretty good protection then

Lucky it blasted beneath the engine...... Otherwise results would have been different.

 

[Dreamer.]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1418414066318684160

Where did this happen?

 

[Cookie Monster]

The PA doesn’t seem to care about the well-being of its troops. They continue to be targeted in IED attacks when properly equipped IFVs are available.

I don't think the mindset is "who cares if our soldiers die"...as the ppl here are making it out to be. I think it has always been the case that all our military procurements are looked at with the threat of India on mind. Yes Pakistan has been fighting the militants for decades now...but that threat is considered mild compared to the behemoth that Indian military is. Couple that with the huge difference between India's purchasing power...and Pakistan's purchasing power...and it's obvious why Pakistan needs to counter Indian capabilities first and foremost and make every cent count. This is why we see purchases like artillery, submarines, MPAs, surface vessels, tanks, jets, etc. It's obvious that we would hardly use tanks and subs against some rogue militants. One can hardly blame the military for going down this route given Pak's situation. Diverting the precious limited resources towards acquiring modern APC and IFVs...means taking resources away from elsewhere...
...coupled with the fact that Pak already has huge quantities of M113s. Either these are deemed sufficient...or even if not sufficient...replacing these again adds a huge cost.

IMO best way forward is not to expect a paradigm shift...nor expecting some magical extra money to pop up for such purchases while economy is struggling. A solution must be figured out that keeps costs affordable within the current allocation...and still provides PA with a good enough APC that can serve dual purposes. First to use them against terrorists until that situation is brought to an end...and can also be used in case of war against India.
Perhaps Pak can work with China/Ukraine/South Africa...to modernize/uparmor M113 APCs...kind of like what was done with AZ program. Slowly build up and churn out these upgraded M113s and start using them in areas where the terrorists are most active(areas that are their stronghold...where most IED attacks are carried out). Supplement these APCs with about 500 modern MRAPs(ideally local produced under license)...and more surveillance via drones. This type of protection and situational awareness of Pak Army convoys engaging those terrorists would see much less casualties due to IEDs or RPGs.

EDIT: the MRAPs are still a big expense...especially considering that they are lower in terms of importance...when compared to APCs and IFVs...but one can hope.

 

[The Terminator]

Some time I really feel doing a protest outside GHQ for not getting MRAP for our soldiers

You would be trialed in military court for that 'jisarat'. Tagging you along with some nefarious group would be easier due to your tactical beard

 

[Zarvan]

Where did this happen?

Syria. Russian soldiers who are deployed there often face attacks. They are busy testing their MRAP there.

 

[The Terminator]

But won't that hamper it's mobility in jungle or mountainous terrain?

Cuz in WW2 Germans installed these side skirts or "Schurzen" to stop HEAT rounds and i have heard the tank crews hated them cuz they hampered the mobility in terrains other than roads.

also can an MRAP's windows have ability to stop .50 cal or a more heavier round?

Those side skirts were installed actually to deter the anti tank rifles back then. Side armor wasn't enough to stop heavy caliber anti tank rifle rounds. If panzer Faust, RPG of that time would have exploded prematurely that was clearly an added bonus, more of a positive side effect . But initially it wasn't designed to counter RPGs threat

 

[Sifar zero]

Well the best solution for Balochistan's problem is to send a few waderas/sardars to the firing squad, bring connectivity roads/technology/infrastructure, resources(water is a huge one), industry, business and relocate people from other provinces there.

Would help a lot.

Killing sardars will have no benefit even though the sardars deserve it.
The current insurgency is neither funded nor being led by sardars it is led by non-sardars and Balochs from ordinary families.
Allah Nazar,Bashir Zeb,Gulzar Imam you name them all of them were students before becoming terrorists.

 

[The Terminator]

Pakistan need to develop something like that !!!View attachment 439841 View attachment 439842

Perhaps borrow from them 2nd hand as they are going to replace them soon but alas! We are short on Coalition Support funds these days. Maybe we should snatch the Kabul airport security deal with the US from Turkey, it might do the trick

 

[The Terminator]

Only if Tri services could increase synergy, standerdize needs, and jointly make many more based on scale.

Like what US did with the F-35!

 

[Ahmet Pasha]

Like what US did with the F-35!

Blackhawk is a better example.

 

[The Terminator]

This is whats happening to Saudi coalition IFV's, APC's and MRAP's in yemen war. One of the problem i see is that infantry is not combing the area on foot. Solitary vehicles are becoming easy targets.

When we discussed PA not having a proper IFV, instead PA has APC's and uses dismounted troops for combat, is an IFV suitable for COIN war or is it wrong tactics for IFV and MRAP here?

@Ulla @Zarvan @Gryphon

Saudis lack the will to fight. I have been up close with their military. They are more concerned about whats happening inside their families and homes rather than focusing on their jobs or serving their country, including military too. Cheers!

Even a Yemeni citizen working in Riyadh complained that Yemen don't have a airforce to fight with them, otherwise they would have defeated the Saudis comprehensively.

 

[The Terminator]

Wrong Tactics, they'll learn it the hard way. IFVs are sitting ducks if not supplemented by Infantry in urban warfare.

No they won't. Instead they would pay you to fight for them that too in $$$

 

[The Terminator]

@Gryphon @Signalian

@Gryphon @Signalian @Zarvan @Starlord @django Have you seen the film "Masters and commander", the first battle scene is very important, to understand my post:


Apko tori himat wi chaie dismount karne lie, lagta he ye apni jan boot piyare karte he

I think we are underestimating the Saudis, in my opinion, they now the BASIC tactics and strategies from the books, they have the equipment which you have mentioned, but that's not all what you need to motivate your infantry to dismount from your vehicles and battle the enemy. My point is, that the Saudi Soldiers are shocked and afraid when they enter the hot zones, no chance of leaving the vehicles/dismount, even a logical and coordinated communication and attack is not possible because of fear and lack of discipline. Totally opposite from the Pakistani infantry that's what I have observed since the Yemen War. So yes we can do the job against the Indian with our equipment. Training and equipment is not everything, ready to die is the way forward!

View attachment 448077


-lack of leadership

- lack of discipline

- no coordination

-no rational communication

-no experience in a live firing exercise

-no will do die and make sacrifices

Add 1 more thing to it. Excess of luxury in their lives. Very junior NCOs own big SUVs there Japanese, American you name it. IPhones seem to be standard issued there

Contrary to that, our NCO thinks is jeenay se to marna hi behtr he. Shaheed huy to compensation money se family status barh jyga r bchay ki job b LG jygi